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Hitachi Plasmas & Prog Scan

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs' started by mray, Sep 30, 2004.

  1. mray

    mray
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    HI.
    I hope someone can answer this question for me please.
    I read a review of the Hitachi PD5200 recently and the reviewer stated that when fed a progressive signal, the picture quality was fantastic.

    I'm a little confused, as I understand all Hitachi's screens are ALIS based, which means they output an interlaced display. So how does a progressive feed improve the PQ if the panel is interlacing the feed?
    Any help in answering this puzzle gratefully received.
     
  2. johndon

    johndon
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    Not sure how it does it technically but on my 42PD5300, the picture quality is noticably better when fed a prog scan signal from an Arcam DV79 than when it's fed a non prog scan picture.

    John
     
  3. mray

    mray
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    Thanks John.
    I've read through these forums and many of the post's here seem to say that p/scan makes no difference, which was why the reviewer' comments puzzled me. The quality of the equipment probably has a lot to do with it.
     
  4. johndon

    johndon
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    I agree about the source - this picture quality from the DV79 is vastly superior to the Yamaha S540 that I had previously although at over 6 times the price, you'd expect that.

    John
     
  5. dUnKle

    dUnKle
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    Ok my answer

    Hitachi 42pd5200 with a sony 930 DVD player via component input

    With Prog Scan - FANTASTIC PICTURE - clear and lovely and chrisp, HOWEVER - on some material mainly PAL DVD there is some odd smearing and blurring of vertically scrolling text such as end credits of the movie

    Without Prog Scan - As above - FANTASTIC chrsip clear brilliant picture but without the smearing

    I leave it off
     
  6. mray

    mray
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    Thanks Duncan.
    All the reviews I've read on the PD 5200 have been good, but there seem to be quite a few people on this forum who don't rate ALIS panels in general, so it's good to hear positive comments like yours.
     
  7. hornydragon

    hornydragon
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    ALis is an odd best it is not truly inter laced nore progressive Fujitsu Alis panels fed interlaced component are superb..... They are almost twice the price of Hitachi Alis panels. Difference is Fujitsu use very complex (AVM) and expensive video drive circuits while Hitachi use much cheaper systems (none AVM). To display an image the plasma de-interlaces the video signal scales to 1024x512 (1024) resolution (60Hz) i think... then Alis's the signal for piwels to display. Basically if DVD de-interlacer is better than the screens it will look better using PS if not then it wont its all down to where the better deinterlacer is. in an Arcam its the DVD in a cheapy DVD probably the panel. Alis takes a huge amount of processing and was not designed for displaying video images. If you want to know more about how it works see: http://www.fujitsu-general.co.uk/plasma/home/product_P42HHA30ES.asp and click on Alis and AVM for more explination
     
  8. esrg

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    What horny dragon is saying, seems to to fit what I am seeing on my 42PD5200. Picture clarity, even from a cheap prog scan component signal, is excellent - for static images! - It's when the image is moving swiftly that it falls down. Banding and solarisation is really bad, especially PAL DVDs. NTSC DVDs are unwatchable.

    I am now considering buying an epc fidelity 1 to maximise the processing done outside the screen. Though I feel I may be throwing good money after bad.

    I would definately say to anyone buying a Hitachi because they're on budget that it's false economy, you'll have to spend the differrence on a far superior source than you might with a pure progressive display.
     
  9. dUnKle

    dUnKle
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    What I would say is calibrate your set correctly - give it time to settle in and try not to be swayed by what others say regargs Hitachi sets

    Yes I do have some problems with Prog Scan - but without prog Scan i get an image that i defy anyone to be able to say is bad - pcture quality is nothing short of excellent - chrisp - clear - and just lovely to look at

    It does however take some work to get like that and needs calibtating correctly

    See my eperate posts on this
     
  10. hornydragon

    hornydragon
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    a scaler would help allowing you to tweek yhe signal going to the screen to exactly the best input resolution. The Crystalio has a specific output of 1024 x 1024 for Alis panels, but at over £2k why not buy a panny and move the Hitachi to the bedroom............. As you say Hitachi is excellent with static images which is what it was designed for....... unfortunatley we dont often watch them in Domestic scenario
     
  11. esrg

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    Yes, I've read your posts on settings (V.helpful, :thumbsup: ). When I went into the settings on the screen most of them were identical to what you reccomend - wierd.

    What I haven't done is buy a DVE disc and calibrate it myself.

    hmm... next step I think.

    Do you have a top end DVD player?
     
  12. johndon

    johndon
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    I only have R2 PAL DVD's and I get no sign of solarisation or smearing. I've set my Hitachi up as well as I can using Duncan's settings as a starting point. As I mentioned earlier though I am using a relatively high end (Arcam DV79) DVD player.

    Picture quality is almost 'too good' in so far as it now makes the CGI on the likes of Star Wars Ep 1 & 2 even more obvious.

    John
     
  13. esrg

    esrg
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    Well, I bought the hitachi because I was planning to hook it up to a HCPC. I was advised that the hitachi was the best screen for this job..hmmm. Now I'm finding that the HCPC has to be very High performance to get the best out of the hitachi, and meanwhile, while I save the money for such a beast I'm struggling with analogue signals from a cheap DVD.
     
  14. hornydragon

    hornydragon
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    erm can i ask who advised you to buy a Hitachi for HCPC use? for PC use then elo cheapo Hitachi are fine for but Video images Fujitsu HHA are expensive you can buy a HD Panny for same money....
     
  15. esrg

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    Well, I dont know if it's PC to name names on here. But, in fairness to the retailer they did reccomend I go and plug my PC into their dsiplay model in horsham,W.Sussex, but I couldn't do that because I don't own it yet.
     
  16. hornydragon

    hornydragon
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    ah well thats unfortunate perhaps you should have looked at retailers a little closer to home... Bentley in cardiff have a Hitachi 42" used for the car customiser PC and software they have set up for which it is ideal.
     
  17. dUnKle

    dUnKle
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    Not a top end player

    Sony 930

    It got better with age - after about 100 hours or so it really settled in
     
  18. The_Wierd

    The_Wierd
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    I've messed around a lot with progressive/interlaced feeds into my PD5000, and I have concluded much the same as horneydragon's comment about the quality of the de-interlacer.

    On my older Toshiba 510 the difference (on NTSC) was marginal and I used to leave PS off. I changed to a Panny E55 recorder, and I have decided that the PS picture is definitely better with NTSC and slightly better with PAL, and I would hardly call this a high-end device. The improvement is in the reduction in 'jaggies' and improved detail; other characteristics are the same. I can well believe that as the quality of the source improves, the difference would open up further.

    I have hardly ever seen banding or solarisation effects - only on the low-bandwidth Sky channels. In fact the picture still blows me away every time I watch it.

    And it doesn't buzz!
     
  19. mleggett

    mleggett
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    Oh oh, n00b question, do you have a link ?
     
  20. MrDemon

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    if you use a htpc then you drive it at native res 1024x1024 on the dvi imput and that skips the de-interlacer and that should give the best picture,

    Thats how i see it any way, i hope i am right as i am about to buy one :)
     
  21. esrg

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    Which one are you going for? I'm saving for one too. I bought my 5200 with a HTPC in mind (then the mrs made me buy chairs after I bought the screen :suicide: )

    I'd be interested see which one other people are going for?
     
  22. hornydragon

    hornydragon
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    Wont work like that cause its an ALIS panel and cant be run at 1024x1024 as that would be a progressive signal and IIRC Hitachi deinterlcer and ALIS processor cannot be bypassed................1024x768 is youre best bet
     
  23. esrg

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    Well now I'm really confused. How is it that a screen will not accept it's native resolution? Even if it does have to go through the deinterlacer why is 1024x768 better than 1024x1024?
     
  24. MrDemon

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    Tell me about it I was going to buy that screen yesterday lol

    Now I am lost out there in Plasma Hell.

    THe USA spec Panasonic screens look fab with there trendy specs but UK panasonic seem to have nothing to match them.

    D
     

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