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hitachi alis panel? progressive scan image?

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs' started by usman24, Aug 2, 2005.

  1. usman24

    usman24
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    Having discovered that the technology in alis panels is interlaced why does hitachi state that it can display a progressive scan image? I don't understand how this works.

    They also claim to have a progressive image chip [intelligent chip] Whats all this about then?

    Please help!
     
  2. JeffLaws1

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    As I understand it ALIS is nether interlaced nor progressive its sort of in between. its interlaced because it does odd lines and then even lines but is progressive because it displays both at the same time, hence its both and niether.

    Hitachi's website explains it and there are dozens of others on here who could give you a much better explanation. :suicide:
     
  3. johndon

    johndon
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    The Hitachi is perfectly capable of displaying a progressive scan image. However, IMHO, it's not worth it in terms of picture quality.

    John
     
  4. JeffLaws1

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    Well my Hitachi has a dirt cheap Zinwel scaler pluged into it an I can see practicaly no difference if I switch from 1080i to 720p so would have to agree but the PQ is not what I would call bad by any stretch except for the usual low bit sky channels.
     
  5. efendi

    efendi
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    Sorry, John, but I don't understand.

    How can Alis panel display a progressive image (means progressively), when the picture cells share the driving electrodes and are illuminated alternatively? What would then be a difference between progressive and interlaced method of displaying a picture?

    Thank you

    Petr
     
  6. johndon

    johndon
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    Going back to the original post the question asked was "why does hitachi state that it can display a progressive scan image" - what I am saying is that it is capable of displaying a progressive scan image that is sent to it.

    I've got my Arcam DV79 set to output progressive scan and it displays perfectly on the Hitachi.

    I accept that the Hitachi won't be displaying all the lines of the image at the same instant but it doesn't mean it cant display a progressive signal that is sent to it.

    John
     
  7. efendi

    efendi
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    Okay, so I understand. IMO it'd be wisier however to state that the Hitachi can accept the progressive signal and then display it in the interlaced way.

    BTW, my setup consists of 42PD5200 and the DENON 2900 and I've also no problems to display the progressive output, although - rather surprisingly - the interlaced output results in slightly better picture.

    Anyway, thanks

    Petr
     
  8. johndon

    johndon
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    Same here, there is very little, if any, difference in the progressive and non progressive picture from the Arcam either on my 5300

    John
     
  9. hornydragon

    hornydragon
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    ALis is not interlaced it is ALIS Alternate lighing of surfaces there is no side to side scanning ALIS is hellishly complicated to understand and explain i know how older Alis works but the newer screens seem to have different video processing
     
  10. usman24

    usman24
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    The following is a copy of a response to a fellow av forums member. I am very confused now!

    Dear Sir,

    Thank you for your email.

    I can confirm that the ALIS Screens used are HD compatible.
    The Alis screens can output 1024 lines for each frame. I believe the confusion is occurring due to ALIS being interlaced. This means it will output 512 ODD lines and then 512 EVEN lines, making a total of 1024.
    The plasmas also meet the EICTA standard.

    You will see the HD Logo on Brochures etc, but note that the panels are not sold with the HD logo sticker on it.

    I apologise for any inconvenience or dissatisfaction this matter may have caused you but trust that the above information has helped to clarify the situation.

    Regards

    Consumer Affairs Team
    Hitachi (Europe) Ltd
    England, UK.
     
  11. hornydragon

    hornydragon
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    odd lines then even lines but not both at the same time so 512 are "lit" at any one time the issue i have is how it gets 512 odd and evn lines s early Alis screens the odd and even lines contained the same info basically Alis splits each frame into 2 then displays as 2 x 512 which hitachi says equals 1024 i say it doesnt especially when comparing to traditional always on plasmas
     
  12. Snap

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    I've tried to connect computer via D-sub to PD7200 in the shop - 1024x768 dispayed without any interlacing noticable.
     
  13. Nick_UK

    Nick_UK
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    Oh here we go again ! Plasma's don't have "lines", they have pixels. A row of pixels on a plasma screen does not equate to a line on a conventionally scanned CRT. Plasma screens are not illuminated using a scanning technique, so all this argument over Alis panels is completely meaningless !

    In ALL plasma's, the incoming picture is scanned into a frame store, where it is then mathmatically processed and a "best fit" is used to map the picture lines onto the rows of pixels on the picture. The picture on a plasma isn't scanned - the pixels on a plasma are lit most of the time - except Alis panels where alternative rows of pixels are lit 50% of the time.

    Since plasma screens are not scanned, very little is gained by feeding a progressive signal. A "progressive capable" plasma is merely one which will accept progressive signals, and almost all will.
     
  14. LCDC

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    Thanks for that concise straightforward explain Nick that reads like a breath of fresh air, cutting right through a lot of the [Swearing removed by Mal600908 – please see the forum rules] that's often posted on here about ALIS panels :smashin:. I can't believe the amount of woffle I read on here about ALIS, mostly by non-Hitachi owners, some of whom seem to have an axe to grind against Hitachi and the ALIS technology in general :nono:. All I care about is that the picture looks great :thumbsup:, and I don't have to worry about all these niggling problems that seem to be present on some other plasmas, especially the PV500s.

    (edited for spelling :rolleyes: )
     
  15. scrapbook

    scrapbook
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    Sorry if this is off topic a little.

    Nick,

    There is bound to be a lot of hype over the coming year over panels that accept a 1080p signal, does that mean there is likely to be little noticable difference between 1080i and 1080p?
     
  16. LCDC

    LCDC
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    I think if you check the Oxford Dictionary you'll find that the expression you've removed from my post is merely slang and NOT swearing. I take great offence at being accused of swearing on a forum :mad:, as I NEVER swear either in forums or in real life :nono:.
     
  17. Badger0-0

    Badger0-0
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    Don't worry about it too much mate :smashin:

    I know what you're saying, but don't like to read those sort of words myself.
    (even though I do it myself ocasionally :oops: )

    I find it lessens what you're saying.

    I assume the word was Cr*p or sh*t.

    Stars help, I reckon :)
     
  18. LCDC

    LCDC
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    I did use stars, and the expression was "b*** s***", but not aimed at any individual. I'm not really bothered, but don't like being accused of something I'd never do :confused:.
     
  19. Ikki

    Ikki
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    Just another point about feeding interlaced or progressive signals into a Hitachi.

    The processing before final display requires the signal that it uses to be in a deinterlaced form. If you feed an interlaced signal, then the Hitachi's internal deinterlacer deinterlaces it. If you feed a progressive signal, then the deinterlacer in the source does the deinterlacing and the Hitachi bypasses it's internal deinterlacer.

    So any difference that you see will be down to differences between the two deinterlacers and any artifacts/errors that they introduce. As far as I have seen in practice it's minimal, if visible at all (although I haven't tried one of the really expensive deinterlacers).
     

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