Hiding cables - Wall plate/bind post recommendations?

DarkConvict

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Hi,

I'm having an extension, and the ceiling is currently opened out. So I want to run cables to 4 ceiling speakers and 4 rear/side speakers.


I assume, I'll need to run from the AVR to the wall plate, and connect using banana plugs.
With 8 speakers, that will be 16 plugs in total.
4 pairs of cables to the ceiling speakers
With 4 pairs going to another wall plate at the back of the room, where I can then connect in cables for the 4 rear speakers.

Is it worth fitting banana plugs, or just screw into binding posts like on the AVR?
Also what do you recommend as the plates to use. 16 connections seems like a lot, but there are 8 speakers.

Could i get something like this?


Photos attached, just bind the cables like on the AVR?
 

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So for every speaker, if you was to fit banana plug at each end of a run of speaker cable, then you would simply have four plugs (two positive, two negative). So the math for eight speakers would be 8x4=32. As you will not be connecting the atmos ceiling speakers with wall plate (MWP) with 16 connections. Is this right?

If this is right, then you will require 32 banana plugs and as none of these are for connecting the speakers to the wall plate. These have their own internal screws to the rear which are not on show. The 32 banana plugs are simple to connect 8 runs of speaker cable between the MWP to av receiver

The best options however which has already been mentions by @ufo550 is to use the least amount connection (join) from your speakers to the av receiver which means 16 banana plugs would be the ideal amount and you could simply use something like a storm guard brush letterbox system to hide them coming out of the wall

The other options which you might be using are four wall plates for the surrounds which will have 8 plugs, you will also have another 8 internal screw connections to the MWP. This will then have another 16 screw points before you can even think about connecting each of the 8 runs of cable from the MWP to the av receiver.

Also remember that each banana plus have its own screws to hold the wires in place meaning that you have an awful lot of joins which will reduce the quality unless you can solder then all plus if you get one or two of those cable crossed over, you will have speakers which will be out of phase if not labelled correctly. This will cause you a real headache when running the room eq system

So, I'd recommend what @ufo550 said and try not to make running cables a real headache by using a storm guard brush letterbox (hidden behind where the av receiver) with single runs of cable from each speaker to av receiver. That would give you 16 in place of using 32 or even 48 banana plugs at worst depending upon which way you go. Sorry if that seemed complicated :confused:
 
Hi

Thanks for the details. I know joins aren't ideal, but I didn't think I would have a choice. And that it was good practice to terminate them like this?

AVR -> Wall Plate -> Wall plate -> Side Speaker (2x)
AVR -> Wall Plate -> Wall plate -> Rear Speaker (2x)
AVR -> Wall Plate -> Ceiling Speaker (4x)

So 3 wires to side/rear speakers, and 2 wires to ceiling speakers.
This works well, if wiring in for side & rear speakers, then only using the side speakers for now, as the others would be neatly terminated in the wall.

So at the AVR, there would be 8 speakers, so 16 binding posts.
At the back of the room, 4 speakers, so 8 binding posts.
The other 8 wires, would go directly into ceiling speakers.

Are you suggesting. Just to run the cable directly from the AVR to the speaker (via a wall opening with a brush guard, like I do for HDMI to the back of the TV)

Due to the constraints of the extension I'm having (can't move in for 2 months due to floor drying) ill have to fit the speakers in the ceiling first, wait to move in. Hook up existing kit. Then buy the AVR that supports 4 ceiling speakers in the new year. If i had a brush guard, I would have loose wires hanging out, or in the wall.

I read a few other posts, like this, and most seem happy with wall plates.

 
@DarkConvict - I'm doing a similar thing to you right now and came in with the same thoughts around wanting to use speaker AV plates and wall plates etc... What products and approach did you take in the end? I'd be curious to hear.
 
I installed my ATMOS and surround speakers last week and I put a wall plate in behind my AVR. I wired the other end of the cable directly in to the speakers.

I've no way of testing if the sound would be better it it was one cable the whole way but I doubt there is a difference that I would be able to hear and I thought the trade off was worth it for how much tidier a wall plate would look than a brush plate.
 
It will be absolutely fine to use wall plates, there is nothing to worry about. I even made my own ones out of plywood and female banana sockets.
 
Thanks Mashie. I'm getting some Wall plates, one with everything by the AVR, then 3 on the back wall (sub, rears, surrounds) with some Securi-Flex 2.5mm cable 100m cable for £116. Much cheaper Leyline x at £3.50 per m. I almost got some QED QX 16/2 for £88, but felt at 14 metres, I should really get 2.5mm vs 1.5mm cable.
 
Thanks Mashie. I'm getting some Wall plates, one with everything by the AVR, then 3 on the back wall (sub, rears, surrounds) with some Securi-Flex 2.5mm cable 100m cable for £116. Much cheaper Leyline x at £3.50 per m. I almost got some QED QX 16/2 for £88, but felt at 14 metres, I should really get 2.5mm vs 1.5mm cable.
No need to spend that much, I used several rolls of the previous white version of this B&Q cable:


You can read about my DIY front distribution panel here:

 
Its not much of a difference. 4x25m rolls would cost £80. The roll I used is 2.5mm and is LSZH (although not needed for a house, its still recommended)

Nice work on the DIY :)
 
@DarkConvict - I'm doing a similar thing to you right now and came in with the same thoughts around wanting to use speaker AV plates and wall plates etc... What products and approach did you take in the end? I'd be curious to hear.

Bit late, just saw this. I plan to use Non-Solder White plates - MSG Custom Audio

8.1 - 2 Gang - White 8.1 Speaker Wall Plate 16 Terminals + RCA Phono Socket - Two Gang - No Soldering Required
4.0 - 1 Gang - White 4.0 Speaker Wall Plate 8 Terminals - One Gang - No Soldering Required
4.1 - 1 Gang - White Plastic 4.1 Speaker Wall Plate 4 Terminals + RCA Phono Socket - No Soldering Required
 
Hi - Curious if you used the MSG speaker plates and how you found them, looking for a similar solution myself.

Appreciate that you don't need to - and using simple brush plates may be easier, but this allows for more flexibility in my installation and I quite like the look
 
The plates have been fine.

I used the solderfree plates, so just screw the speaker wire into the connector. They have been working fine for me. I also used some 90degree Banana plugs to keep the wires as flush as possible.

If you use RCA for the sub woofer, you'll need the deep 40mm back boxes. I will say having 4 speakers using 2.5mm guage wire, in a single gang box is a push, but it does fit. Just about.

The wife is much happier with these than cables dangling.
 
I have just a small question about wall plates, as there isn't any real power going through them is it even necessary to use a back box, seems a small hole for the cable and just wall plugs would hold the plate on.
 
Otherwise you'll be gluing the front panel to the wall :)

But I suppose you might be able to get away with 2 small Rawl plugs. The back boxes are also handy to give you some slack, so you can connect the wires then push them back into the wall cavity, especially handy with subwoofer phono sockets
 
The plates have been fine.

I used the solderfree plates, so just screw the speaker wire into the connector. They have been working fine for me. I also used some 90degree Banana plugs to keep the wires as flush as possible.

If you use RCA for the sub woofer, you'll need the deep 40mm back boxes. I will say having 4I speakers using 2.5mm guage wire, in a single gang box is a push, but it does fit. Just about.

The wife is much happier with these than cables dangling.
As a fellow user of the same wall plates and 90 degree plugs, I concur with this statement. Greatvquality wallpaper imo (I also went with the solderless option). My entire setup has been in place for over 2yrs with zero connectivity issues too. It also removes the hassle when swapping out equipment etc.

My OH is super happy with the clean look install too as you cannot see any of the cabling!
 
Otherwise you'll be gluing the front panel to the wall :)

But I suppose you might be able to get away with 2 small Rawl plugs. The back boxes are also handy to give you some slack, so you can connect the wires then push them back into the wall cavity, especially handy with subwoofer phono sockets
I was going to go the small Rawl plug route. After trying to find some back boxes seems i will still be doing this as in-wall boxes seem obsolete for the small half sized facia plates. Or i order full sized facia plates. Only ebay seems to have the back boxes i would require but i have never bought off there so don't have an account or paypal account.
 
Only ebay seems to have the back boxes i would require but i have never bought off there so don't have an account or paypal account.
Have a look in places like roolstation or screw fix. I got my back boxes for my wall plates from there.
 
Have a look in places like roolstation or screw fix. I got my back boxes for my wall plates from there.
I've looked everywhere Architrave back boxes seem extinct unless you want on the wall mounted versions or metal in brick versions, i guess these slimmer single facia plates are not generally used indoors. I bought these Amazon product ASIN B00SJA2FQ0
 
I've looked everywhere Architrave back boxes seem extinct unless you want on the wall mounted versions or metal in brick versions, i guess these slimmer single facia plates are not generally used indoors. I bought these Amazon product ASIN B00SJA2FQ0
Yep for those faceplates, they only offer the metal back boxes (as a flush mount option). Plastic surface mounted back boxes are available for them though, eg:

 
@Jester1066 @DarkConvict @meduk1

Enjoyed the thread. Thinking of doing the same here.

A few questions for anyone running these plates right now!

1. Soldered or solderless? soldered gives you a better joint, solderless gives you the flexibility. What to go for?
2. Has anyone has ANY issues using the white plastic versions of these? I've used 'white' euro-module plates in the past and their beige within 6 months... Has anyone noticed any UV discolouration with the MSG Custom plates?
3. What depth of back box did you guys go for on the wall plate and the 7.1 AV plate?
4. Any good recommendations for the 90 degree banana's? Seen loads but looking for a good quality recommendation, some looks sooo dubious in build and quality.
 
1. Soldered or solderless? soldered gives you a better joint, solderless gives you the flexibility. What to go for?
I went solderless - They've been in place well over a year and I've had no issues at all

2. Has anyone has ANY issues using the white plastic versions of these? I've used 'white' euro-module plates in the past and their beige within 6 months... Has anyone noticed any UV discolouration with the MSG Custom plates?
Can't comment as I went matt black. But the quality of these faceplates (regardless of finish colour) is top notch imo. They'll even make up a custom faceplates for you if you drop them a message.
3. What depth of back box did you guys go for on the wall plate and the 7.1 AV plate?
I went for the 35mm Appleby drywall back boxes. The ones with the yellow tabs. The deeper boxes help with cable management too.
4. Any good recommendations for the 90 degree banana's? Seen loads but looking for a good quality recommendation, some looks sooo dubious in build and quality.
I got the fisual 90⁰ plugs from AV:


They do bigger packs too.
 
@Jester1066 - Thanks for taking the time to answer my questions you confirmed everything i thought which is always reaffirming! A couple of follow ups.

1. How much of the outer jacket did you cut away? Did you cut away the outerjacket to the point that only the 2 inner cores reached into the box, or did you run the speaker cable outer jacket right inside the box.. I can imaging it may be easier leaving the outer jacket ouside the pattress box....

2. Can i ask what thickness of cable you used 1mm/1.5mm/2.5//4mm etc? and what your speaker setup was 5.1/7.1 etc...

Reason i ask is, i've been dabbling on whether to go to 47mm back boxes from 35mm (but thickness of the wall is a little limitting so would prefer to get away with 35mm back box if possible.)

My setup would be running 8.1 speakers back to the box using 2.5mm van damme cable (8mm outer jacket) I can imagine it's going to be tight!

3. Lastly, did you run bannanas everywhere or just between Main AV plate and back of the amp?
 

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