Hi Guys

Discussion in 'Hi-Fi Stereo Systems & Separates' started by skylinegtrsteve, Sep 21, 2017.

  1. skylinegtrsteve

    skylinegtrsteve
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    I'm not an audiophile so I appologise in advance.

    I'm just about to buy a Brennan B2 - The little hard disc ripper that holds 1000s of CDs. I had the previous model the B7 and absolutely love the simplicity.

    My question is, and I am wondering if anyone on here is using this equipment, can anyone recommend an amplifier / speaker set set up to use the B2 with in my lounge? For the speakers I am fancying a pair on stands.

    My B7 I just ran through a Bose Wave System and it sounded stunning. I think feeding the B2 through a decent amp and speakers though would take it to a new level. Or not?

    That's it really, that's my question.
     
  2. Paul7777x

    Paul7777x
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    I’d suggest these good looking things.

    No need to mess about with separates when there are such as these about.

    Elac AM-200(AM200) Active Bookshelf Speakers

    Optical input for your Brennan and a few others should you decide to add your tv or a streamer to them.
     
  3. Paul7777x

    Paul7777x
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  4. Paul7777x

    Paul7777x
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  5. BlueWizard

    BlueWizard
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    First, there is no system to match the Brennan, and by that I mean, you just need an amp and speakers that fit your budget. The source is somewhat irrelevant.

    Introduction to Brennan B2


    Speaking of which - We NEED to know your working BUDGET?

    I would say the Yamaha AS501 and the Wharfedale Diamond 220.

    Yamaha AS501, 85w/ch, DAC - £299 -


    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Yamaha-A-S501-Integrated-Amplifier-Black/dp/B00OBM31JU

    Wharfedale Diamond 220 (5") - ~£170/pr -


    https://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_2?url=search-alias=aps&field-keywords=wharfedale+diamond+220

    Alternates -

    Wharfedale Diamond 225 (6.5") - $250/pr -


    Wharfedale Diamond 225 Speakers (Pair) Black

    Monitor Audio Bronze 1 (5") - £230/pr -

    Monitor Audio Bronze 1 Rosemah Bookshelf Speakers (Pair) - Monitor Audio - AudioVisual Online - UK Home Cinema and Hifi Specialists

    Monitor Audio Bronze 2 (6.5") - £280/pr -

    Monitor Audio Bronze 2 Walnut Bookshelf Speakers (Pair) - Monitor Audio - AudioVisual Online - UK Home Cinema and Hifi Specialists

    Wharfedale Diamond 11.1 (5") - £270/pr -


    Wharfedale Diamond 11.1 Blackwood Bookshelf Speakers (Pair) - Wharfedale - AudioVisual Online - UK Home Cinema and Hifi Specialists

    OF course prices can go higher or lower depending on your budget.

    If the Brennan B2 has Pre-Amp capability then it can be used with Active Speakers. If the Brennan B2 does not have pre-amp outs, then the Active Speakers will need to have their own Remote Control to be able to control the volume.

    If the Brennan B2 only has Digital Outputs, then you will need a DAC to decode Digital Streams to analog music.

    Steve/bluewizard
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2017
  6. BlueWizard

    BlueWizard
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    Here is a Video of the Brennan B2 used with KRK Active Monitors, so apparently the Brennan does have a volume control and would work with Active Speakers -

    Brennan B2 | CD Player From the Future?!


    Steve/bluewizard
     
  7. skylinegtrsteve

    skylinegtrsteve
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    Ha ha I knew I'd come to the right place! I've got loads to choose from here! Budget, I don't really want to go over £1k for amp and speakers. Like I say, I'm not an audiophile where every perfect thing is perfect all the perfect time. Rather I just want something to fill room with sound at low and high volume with relative ease and with clarity. Can't decide wireless or not although the obvious benefits are no tangles of cables etc. Maybe I'm old school, I think wireless, I think of interference from other electricals etc. probably completely unfounded! I definitely want speakers on stands about 18 inches or so high either side of a big screen TV which is wall mounted. And of course the amp (if I don't go powered speakers) will need the digital input so a full blown AV receiver might be the way to go so that I can connect TV etc. I would like the option of fitting a sub possibly if I feel the need. I'm not in a rush so will weigh up all the pros and cons. Obviously any further comments in light of my response to you guys here, welcome.
     
  8. Ugg10

    Ugg10
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    Similar to Paul's sugg4stion

    Yamaha HS7 plus HS8S sub and the WXC50 would be a good way to go and keeps it int he same family. Just in budget as well. My son has the HS7s and they are great ion their won but not very forgiving of bad recordings i.e. they are true to the original but very punchy and the addition of the sub would beef up the bottom end.

    Using an AV receiver fro 2.1 would be paying a lot of extra for stuff you would not be using i.e. an additional 3 or 5 ampsand a load of video circuitry and processing you will not use.

    Yamaha HS7 Active Monitors and HS8S Sub Bundle

    or go for the HS7's with a BK XLS200DF sub - saves a few pounds for cables and stands.

    Yamaha HS7 Active Studio Monitors (Pair)
    XLS200-DF
     
  9. BlueWizard

    BlueWizard
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    OK, in bookshelf/stand-mount speakers you probably want at least 6.5" (165mm) Bass Driver to get deep enough bass. There are several of these that can go down in the vicinity of 40hz which is about as low as you can expect from a Bookshelf speaker.

    Finding an Amp with a DAC should not be a problem, but do you have any other requirements? For example Network Streaming?

    What are the Dimensions of the Room that this system will be in?

    As to the stands, 18" (460mm) that is typically on the low side. Generally, within a few inches, you want the tweeters at roughly ear level. For me in the office chair I am currently in, ear level is about 40" (1016mm). On my sofa, sitting back in a more relaxed posture, ear level is about 36" (915mm). This isn't precision down to the fraction of an inch. The sound from the Tweeter spreads out, so it is more a generalization. Take a best guess to the center of your speaker, and add the stand to get the height you need.

    As an example, the Wharfedale Diamond 225 (6.5") is about 355mm (14") high, half that is about 177mm (7"). If we best guess to the center of the tweeter, let's add another 3" (76mm). So base to the tweeter about 10". We subtracts 36" ear height minus 10" leaves 26". That means functional stands are about 24" to 28" (600mm to 710mm), and those are both very common speaker stand sizes. 18" would keep you speakers pretty low. Though there could be something about your requirements that demand lower placement, that is for you to work out.

    Generally the sound from the Tweeter expands roughly 2.8 feet (850mm) for every 10 ft of distance from the speaker. So at 10ft, you have a cone or circle of sound 2.8 ft in diameters relative to just the tweeter, which means there is some flexibility in the placement of the speaker.

    For Amps, one possibility is the ...

    Yamaha RN602 Network Receiver, 80w/ch, DAC (2xOptical, 2xCoaxial, USB-Media), Network Streaming, Bluetooth, Sub-Out, Phono-In, ... - £380 -

    Yamaha RN602 Networked Stereo Receiver - Superfi

    R-N602 - Overview - HiFi Components - Audio & Visual - Products - Yamaha - UK and Ireland

    Then the just now released ...

    Yamaha RN803, 100w/ch, FM/DAB/DAB+, DAC (2xOptical, 2xCoaxial, USB-Media), Network Streaming, Bluetooth, Sub-Out, Phono-In, ... - £699 -


    Yamaha R-N803D Black Stereo Hi-Fi Receiver w/ MusicCast - Yamaha - AudioVisual Online - UK Home Cinema and Hifi Specialists

    Yamaha R-N803D Silver Stereo Hi-Fi Receiver w/ MusicCast - Yamaha - AudioVisual Online - UK Home Cinema and Hifi Specialists

    R-N803D - Overview - HiFi Components - Audio & Visual - Products - Yamaha - UK and Ireland

    Another Yamaha Integrated amp with DAC would be the AS701 -

    Yamaha AS701 Integrated, 100w/ch, DAC (1xOptical, 1xCoaxial), Sub-Out, Phono-In, ... £499 -

    Yamaha A-S701 Black Stereo Amplifier - Yamaha - AudioVisual Online - UK Home Cinema and Hifi Specialists

    Yamaha A-S701 Silver Stereo Amplifier - Yamaha - AudioVisual Online - UK Home Cinema and Hifi Specialists

    A-S701 - Overview - HiFi Components - Audio & Visual - Products - Yamaha - UK and Ireland

    This next amp probably takes you over budget, but it is worth mentioning.

    Yamaha AS801 Integrated, 100w/ch, Hi-Res DSD DAC (1xOptical, 1xCoaxial, 1x USB-PC), Sub-Out, Phono-In, ... £699 -

    Peter Tyson - Yamaha A-S801 Integrated Amplifier

    Yamaha A-S801 Amplifier - Superfi

    A-S801 - Overview - HiFi Components - Audio & Visual - Products - Yamaha - UK and Ireland

    • USB DAC function supports 2.8MHz/5.6MHz DSD native resolution and PCM 384kHz/32bit reproduction
    • * Windows support. Mac support is 24-bit.
    • High efficiency ESS 32bit DAC (ES9010K2M)
    This amp has the highest quality DAC with the addition of a USB-PC input for direct connect to a computer.

    I'm not obsessed with Yamaha Amps, but they are high value, if you want to maximize what you get in terms of quality and quantity, they always come out on top, though there are better amps, but you will get less amp for more money.

    Right now, I'm trying to give you a sense of the possibilities in your budget range.

    Depending on which amp you choose, you should have between £300/pr and £600/pr for speakers.

    Of those previously recommended the Wharfedale Diamond 225 (6.5") which are about to be replaced by the Diamond 11 series. The Monitor Audio Bronze 2 (6.5") and the older Monitor Audio Silver 1 (6") and Silver 2 (8"), and the new Monitor Audio Silver 100 (8").

    Monitor Audio Silver 1 (6") - £399/pr -

    Monitor Audio Silver 1 Rosenut Bookshelf Speakers (Pair) - Monitor Audio - AudioVisual Online - UK Home Cinema and Hifi Specialists

    Monitor Audio Silver 2 (8") - £499/pr -

    Monitor Audio Silver 2 Rosenut Bookshelf Speakers (Pair) - Monitor Audio - AudioVisual Online - UK Home Cinema and Hifi Specialists

    Monitor Audio Silver 100 (8") - £650/pr -

    Monitor Audio Silver 100 Walnut Bookshelf Speakers (Pair) - Monitor Audio - AudioVisual Online - UK Home Cinema and Hifi Specialists

    Though of course there are many others to choose from, but again, this illustrates what is possible in your budget range.

    Within your stated budget would be the Yamaha AS701 (100w/ch, DAC) and the Monitor Audio Silver 2 (8"). That would be exactly £1000 (£499 each).

    Silver 1

    Silver 2

    Silver 100

    The Silver 1 has a rated low bass of 45hz and is worth considering, and would bring you in a bit under budget. The Silver 2 and the Silver 100 are rated at 40hz each. That's pretty good for a bookshelf speaker.

    So, again, this gives you some idea of what is possible in your budget range.

    Of course there are other options, but for now ... perspective.

    Steve/bluewizard
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2017
  10. skylinegtrsteve

    skylinegtrsteve
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  11. Paul7777x

    Paul7777x
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  12. Ugg10

    Ugg10
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    Audio Connections new

    Looking above you can use the analogue/optical 3.5mm socket on the back and the Brennan acts as a pre-amp. The Yamaha H7's have a 1/4" heaphone type connector for audio in on the back of each speaker. You therefore need to split the 3.5mm on the back of the Brennan and feed it individually to the 1/4" jacks on the H7's. There are several ways of doing this either by custom cables of various adaptors using RCA/Phono cables in between.

    Something like this in the back of the brennan - https://www.amazon.co.uk/AKORD-Stereo-Female-Splitter-Adapter-Black/dp/B016U9R33G/ref=sr_1_19?s=electronics-accessories&ie=UTF8&qid=1506526654&sr=1-19&refinements=p_n_feature_keywords_browse-bin:1055633031

    Cables like this to the HS7s - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Damme-Phon...qid=1506526754&sr=1-11&keywords=rca+6.35mm+3m

    Or as Paul aays use the XLR rather than the 1/4" jacks.

    https://usa.yamaha.com/files/download/other_assets/4/793644/hs8i_en_om_b0.pdf

    Based on the manual above, if using the HS8s sub then you do as above but connect the Brennan to the Sub inputs and the XLR cables to connect the sub to the HS7's. That is pretty neat way of doing it.

    Brennan as a pre-amp using the volume on that (fixing the ones on the HS7's/HS8S) and connect directly to the sub the to the HS7's is a neat little system.

    If you want to increase performance you need to add a DAC between the Brennan and the Sub - something like the Beresford 7510/7520 would do the job taking the SPDIF signal from the 3.5mm jack on the rear of the Brennan to the DAC and then onto the Sub/HS7's. I would see what the first setup sounds like and you can always add a DAC later.

    Hope this helps.
     
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2017
  13. Paul7777x

    Paul7777x
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  14. skylinegtrsteve

    skylinegtrsteve
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    I wonder what those KRK's speakers are like. And I'm struggling with speaker stands. There's so many to choose from.
     
  15. skylinegtrsteve

    skylinegtrsteve
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    Also I'm wondering - with wood laminate flooring instead of carpet would there be any special requirements in speaker stands - like spikes, gel cushioning etc.
     
  16. Ugg10

    Ugg10
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    hs8 KRK alternative is the Rokit 8, link below seems to point to HS8's being significantly better.

    Rokit 8 vs HS8 • r/edmproduction

    This video shows the differences beteen the KRK, Yamaha and a JBL.
    Yamaha has a very flat response, it puts out what you put in.
    KRK has quite a bit of bass boost and a dip in the mid/high range.

    JBL LSR308 Yamaha HS8 KRK RP8G3 Comparison and...
     
  17. Ugg10

    Ugg10
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    This help any - Products
     
  18. BlueWizard

    BlueWizard
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    If you want Studio Monitor Stands, you would have a hard time doing better than these for the price -

    Studio Monitor Speaker Stands, Pair at Gear4music.com

    Studio Monitor Speaker Stands, Pair


    If you want Desktop speaker stands, consider these -

    Desktop Monitor Speaker Stands by Gear4music, Pair at Gear4music.com

    Desktop Monitor Speaker Stands by Gear4music, Pair


    There are other variations of the same thing -

    Stagg SMOS-10 Studio Monitor Stands, Pair at Gear4music.com

    Frameworks GFW SM50 Studio Monitor Stand, Pair at Gear4music.com


    Just a thought.

    Steve/bluewizard
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2017
  19. Ned Senior

    Ned Senior
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    If the speaker stands have spikes, you will need some spike shoes (relatively expensive for what they are really)
    Or make do with 5 pence pieces (one under each spike)
    TO PROTECT YOUR LAMINATE FLOORING FROM HOLES AND SCRATCHES
     
  20. skylinegtrsteve

    skylinegtrsteve
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    Well I've ordered the B2 - so now there's no going back! I'm pretty much decided on the Yamaha Sub package and the recommended stands linked above. I have a small reservation in case I want to incorporate TV etc, whether to go with a stereo receiver speaker package. But as pointed out, it would contain circuitry I might not use and so...... Pretty sure I will go with the Yamaha's though!
     
  21. BlueWizard

    BlueWizard
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  22. Grumpsimus

    Grumpsimus
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    I have come to this thread a little late. However, I have noticed that not many of the respondents appear to know much about the B2, it has a built in amp and DAC. Its big selling point is ease of use for non techies.

    Also the OP says he is not an audiophile and nobody has asked about the size of the room or listening levels. If the room is not very large and the listening is moderate, the simplist solution would be attach a pair of passive speakers directly to the B2. The B2 output is only 15W+15W so sensitive speakers would be best. I noted in todays review of the Spendor A1 the reviewer said it was an easy load to drive and 10W would be adequate. The Rega RX1 would also appear to be suitable, as it is very sensitive for a small standmount speaker.

    If the OP wishes to pursue this further, I would suggest he tries to arrange a home demo to see how it works in his room. He could also take his B2 (which is very small) to a dealer try various speakers.

    The room of the OP may be large and that he likes to listen at high volumes, in which case the advice he has been given above might be better.
     
  23. BlueWizard

    BlueWizard
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    Grumpsimus - Actually I did ask about the room size, but the Original Poster never responded to the question. However, it seems clear he wants Amp and Speakers. And given that he wants Bookshelf Speakers, I don't think the room size is that much of a concern, though it would good to know.

    I think I saw mentions of a SUB, I would suggest he get the Amp and Front Speakers then see how that sounds before he considers a Subwoofer.

    If the room is large enough, with up to £1000 to spend, He can probably get a very good amp and floorstanding speakers lessening the need for a Subwoofer. However, if he plans Bookshelf Front and Sub, then he needs to choose his Front speakers wisely. The low end bass response of the Front Speakers has to be in the working range of the Subwoofer Crossover. That is if the Front Speaker are rated at 40hz, then the Subwoofer Crossover Control has to go as low as 40hz for the best blend of Front and Sub.

    He also mentions incorporating TV into his watching and listening. To do that, the best thing to do is get an Amp with a DAC and Optical inputs. There are a few TV that use Coaxial Digital Audio Out, but a vast majority us Optical Digital Audio Out.

    The Best Value in a Low Cost Amp is the Yamaha AS501 Integrated Amp with DAC and 85w/ch, which can be found from at least three sources in the £250 to £270 range (SuperFi, Richer Sounds, Exceptional AV,...). Other places are selling the same amp for £400. But it can be commonly found for closer to £299 which is still in the working budget range.

    In Passive Speaker, the Monitor Audio Silver 1 (6.5") and Silver 2 (8") are good choices, and they should have good bass, though not shake the house bass. Though having been discontinued, these are limited to available stock.

    That combination would run about £650 to £750 and would be a very worthy system. Then if the OP chooses, at a later time, decides, he would consider getting a Subwoofer. The best deals in Subwoofers come from BK Electronics.

    The BK XLS200 would be a good choice at about £329 (10", 265w, DF or FF).

    BK Electronics - Subwoofer

    BK Electronics - XLS200-DF

    BK Electronics - XLS200-FF

    DF = Down Firing
    FF = Front Firing


    £300/ea = Yamaha AS501 (85w/ch, DAC)
    £400/pr = Monitor Audio Silver 1 (6.5")
    ------------------------------
    £700 = Total

    £300/ea = Yamaha AS501 (85w/ch, DAC)
    £500/pr = Monitor Audio Silver 2 (8")
    ------------------------------
    £800 = Total


    Though as I said, there are three places, last time I checked, that have the Yamaha AS501 in the £250 to £270 price range.

    Steve/bluewizard
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2017
  24. Paul7777x

    Paul7777x
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    I very much doubt that the B2s amp will get anything like the best out of a pair of thousand pound speakers. However sensitive.
     
  25. skylinegtrsteve

    skylinegtrsteve
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    Ok, thank you so much for ALL of your responses. It was from this thread that I made my choice of what to go with the Brennan B2. I went for the Yamaha HS7 and HS8 sub powered package. I've put the speakers on Quicklok stands which at their lowest height is perfect both for aesthetics and listening. The room by the way is roughly 4m x 4m.

    I have to say, the speakers and sub sound amazing. But what I am a little disconcerted about is the fact that I have to pump the volume up to near max on both the B2 and the powered speakers and sub to get meaningful output. I would much rather have it pumping with still half of the volume left. This way I know nothing is being strained. When I first connected everything up, having missed the bit on the Brennan website that said the volume would have to be turned almost all the way up, I thought that the whole thing was not working at all. I worked it out, but still...

    I am wondering should I introduce some kind of amp between the B2 and the speakers? I mentioned in one of my original posts that I might want to integrate some TV into the mix. But this would only be as much as Music TV as opposed to films etc. Once again I am in no rush, and will peruse your responses with enthused interest.

    Once again many thanks for all of your responses and apologies for the delay in my response to some of the posts.
     
  26. Ugg10

    Ugg10
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    Brennan spec says Line out 3.5mm jack gives 1v peak-peak or 350mV rms, variable with volume and suggests should be at near max using the amp to control volume.

    Audio Connections new

    It also suggests adding a line level dac and using the optical toslink output to feed it (same 3.5mm socket as line out). You could use something like the beresford 7510/20/Cayman, audioengine d1 or fostex a3/4 that are dacs again with variable line level outputs to boost the signal. Set b2 to max volume, set h7's to mid and use dac to control volume. Or, set b2 to mid, balance dac and h7's so fairly loud and use b2 for volume. The second option may not need a dac with a variable output so any dac that is better than the one in the b2 will do.

    The other benefit is that the dac will probably have other digital inputs so you can hook your tv through that. The Yamaha wxc50 may be worth a look, bit of a bargain at £279 and has a number of connection as well as preamp and streaming capability.

    Yamaha WXC-50 Wireless Streaming Pre-Amplifier

    I powered the h7's directly from an iPad Pro without problems, spec looks like this is 1V rms so approx 3 times the signal.
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2017
  27. Paul7777x

    Paul7777x
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    I’m delighted you’re pleased with the speakers :thumbsup:

    As for a preamp, it will be a noticeable improvement in all likelihood.

    With all the stuff going on in the Brennan, it’s unlikely that the preamp part has anything extraordinary going for it.

    As you seem to prefer the smaller sized items I’m compelled to recommend this again;

    Yamaha WXC-50 Wireless Streaming Pre-Amplifier

    Assuming it has the inputs you need then there is nothing better at the price.

    And here’s an idea too...

    Dirac Series : DDRC-24

    It’s easy to setup and the DiracLive software is a revelation. A truly superb bargain. I love what mine does.

    And then there’s these for the tiniest budget.

    Yamaha DSP-E800 Stereo Integrated Amplifier | eBay

    They are rock solid performers with a million inputs, great sound and are cheap as crisps. They come up on eBay frequently and won’t add much to what you’ve already spent.

    This is also top class and has balanced outputs for the Yamahas. Its dad is also universally applauded.

    Cambridge Audio Stream Magic 6 Network Streaming Music Player | eBay

    Good luck.
     
  28. skylinegtrsteve

    skylinegtrsteve
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    Thanks again guys! I'm not that constrained on budget. The reason I initially mentioned a £1000 budget was that I was trying to qualify not being an audiophile. That is, I won't be spending my entire listening time at the apex of the equilateral triangle. Rather I am interested in filling the room / apartment with sound. Already with the B2 and the Yamaha speaker and sub package together with stands and cables etc, I have way overshot the £1k to £1300 or so. Another few hundred quid to beef it all up a bit, is fine by me!

    I'm liking the look of the Yamaha WXC-50. I guess I'd use the optical sockets between the B2 and the WXC-50 right? And then use the 3.5 jack into the sub socket of the WXC-50 which in turns feeds the HS7s? And everything is controlled from an app? I use an iPad Pro, so that's all good. I'm assuming the Yamaha doesn't come with a dedicate remote?

    I'm almost there, I can feel it!
     
  29. Paul7777x

    Paul7777x
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    Indeed the optical input on the Yamaha is damned good and the way to go.

    But I’d not use the sub out on the WXC50. It’s unnecessary as the Yamaha sub has adjustable parameters for the 7s.

    I’d use the WXC preouts into the sub using phones to xlr cables, then connect the speakers to the sub using a pair of xlr cables.

    I’d also set the subs hand over frequency to 80hz and set the volume such that you can just about make out the contribution of the sub and then turn down it’s volume a little bit, so that it’s contributing to the sound without overwhelming the 7s.

    Once that’s done and you’re happy then the WXC will control the volume of the whole shebang.

    I’m confident you’ll like the sound even more; the WXC50 is a very fine preamp on top of its other amazingness. :thumbsup:
     
  30. skylinegtrsteve

    skylinegtrsteve
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    Ah well, the WXC50 is ordered! Plus the phone to XLR lead. But tell me, there appears to be a number of optical lead option. Is it something like this that I need?
     

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