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Help with new Marantz 5200!! Low output!

Discussion in 'AV Receivers & Amplifiers' started by Prav, Jan 6, 2002.

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  1. Prav

    Prav
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    Hi,

    I have just bought this big bad machine, and being a novice to HC, and finding a few things difficult.

    My set up-

    Mordaunt Short MS10i Classic fronts
    Eltax H1(?) rears
    Mordaunt Short MSC20 centre.
    Sony 725 connected with digital coaxial

    The problem is the output volume is low - I have to crank it to around -45db to get 'normal' sound levels - this is not only through DVD but thru' all inputs - radio, tv etc. I expected a larger volume at low levels? Can anyone suggest what the problem is? Are my speakers suitable - they should be as on a music amp. the volume is fine.

    Any suggestions greatly appreciated


    Prav
     
  2. Craig_Nike

    Craig_Nike
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    I'm no expert but I found something similar when I got my new amp.

    My amp is at about -60db for normal volume and -45db is very loud when watching 5.1 movies.

    2 questions for you -

    1. Have you got a volume dial that keeps turning - or one that has a specific max and min ? A dial that keeps turning is a digital and tends to have to be cranked up more than dials that go i.e. from 1-10

    2. What are the ohms on your speakers ? As I understand it if you have 8-16 ohm speaker they will sound slightly louder than if you had 2-8 ohm speakers which need a little more amp punch for the same volume. (This seemed to happen to me when I switched to my 6 ohm Sony speakers from my old crappy 8-16 ohm speakers).

    Hope this isn't totally wrong, but it'll give you something to read until the experts arrive !
     
  3. laurel

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    Hello

    I have the 4200 and my normal listening level is around -25db. I crank up to about -10db when listening to high octane movies (terminator etc). There still seems to be plenty of scope to go higher.

    Our friend Prav is nearly right. You will find that speakers with a higher ohm rating need to be pushed more to produce the same volume level (i.e. 16ohms will require more than 8 will require more than 4).

    I have a pair of old "Rogers" speakers rated at 16ohm hooked up to my HiFi setup at the moment and I notice a big difference when swapping for my 8ohm Tannoys.

    Cheers

    Laurel
     
  4. Wilf

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    I have the 4200 too (very happy with it) and normal listening levels are -40db to -20db which is plenty loud enough for me. One question. Why are the readings negative?I presume db is decibells
     
  5. Ian J

    Ian J
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    Craig,

    As we have the same amp I must be going deaf as -45db is for watching the news early in the morning whilst everytone else is asleep rising to -30db for watching a film.

    My Def Tech Pro Cinema speakers are supposed to be efficient so either your speakers are more inefficient or my hearing is failing.

    Ian
     
  6. Prav

    Prav
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    Yes, yes, yes - it all makes sense now - my speakers are 8ohm so this sounds about right. I need to test it with my mates speakers - older 8-16ohm set. And yes Craig - you're right - it is and 'endless' dial.

    Many thanks
     
  7. mandlebrot

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    I also have the 4200 and my normal listening level is around -25db. I crank up to -10db when listening movies or even 0db if wanting a really loud movie experiance, next door don't like it much though.

    I also would like to know why the db values are negative, seems weird that 0db shakes the room would have expected it to be silent.

    If this is a stupid navieve ? then please excuse me, but please take the time to explain otherwise how can I learn?
     
  8. Craig_Nike

    Craig_Nike
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    I want to know why it is negative too !
    I asked a guy in an AV shop once and he didnt have a clue.
    Hopefully one of the moderators can help us gumbies on this one.

    IanJ - interesting that your 1070 volumes are different - do you think speaker cable could also have somehting to do with it ?
    I use Sony QS bookshelf speakers - 6 ohms all round.

    I feel cruel to the amp when I have it on the mid 40's - wouldn't an amp get pretty shaky and increase Harmonic distortion (whatever that is) at these really high levels ?
     
  9. Craig_Nike

    Craig_Nike
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    I want to know why it is negative too !
    I asked a guy in an AV shop once and he didnt have a clue.
    Hopefully one of the moderators can help us gumbies on this one.

    IanJ - interesting that your 1070 volumes are different - do you think speaker cable could also have somehting to do with it ?
    I use Sony QS bookshelf speakers - 6 ohms all round.

    I feel cruel to the amp when I have it on the mid 40's - wouldn't an amp get pretty shaky and increase Harmonic distortion (whatever that is) at these really high levels ?
     
  10. Ian J

    Ian J
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    Craig,

    I understand that harmonic distortion is the result of a phased plasma variance in the warp shield generator.
     
  11. laurel

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    Ian J

    You are correct. However, this can be corrected by re-alligning the warp coils. :D
     
  12. Lowrider

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    The -dbs shown are attenuation, 0 db is no attenuation at all, the loudest...

    You probably can choose theater display mode, where it will go from 0, no sound, to 100, maximun sound, I prefer this way, more intuitive...
     
  13. Wilf

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    Thanks Lowrider, as a self confessed gumbie I had to look up attenuation which is described as dB loss, so I guess two negatives make a positive. As you say not very intuitive. Could you explain what the att button (on 4200 and others) does in respect to this.
     
  14. Lowrider

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    It kind of emulates the old volume dial, from 0 to 100... Then the numbers are only an indication, don´t really mean anything...
     
  15. mjn

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    0db is reference level, ie. no reduction in signal strength. Bearing in mind 140db will make you deaf!
     
  16. bob007

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    PARDON..............
     
  17. laurel

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    0db is certainly not the loudest. Mine 4200 goes plus aplenty. Not tried to see how far but I've had it to +10 (very loud).
     
  18. mjn

    mjn
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    well put it on mute, and crank up the volume......to see how far it goes...
     
  19. laurel

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    MJN

    I'll do that tonight.

    Maybe I'll see how far I can stand to go without the mute?...:D

    Laurel

    What?

    Come Again?
     
  20. Prav

    Prav
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    Funny, on my 5200, with no speakers attached, it switched itself off at 0db.
     
  21. mjn

    mjn
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    if your amp is THX certified, then they class 0db as optimum listening i think, but you can go louder if you wish.....but that is pretty loud...!!
     
  22. laurel

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    If it's too loud your too old...:)

    I remember someone telling me about an old guitar PA that went up to 11 on the volume dial - when all the others only went to 10. Apparently they sold like hot cakes!

    max - 0db doesn't have the same ring to it does it?

    Cheers

    Laurel
     
  23. mjn

    mjn
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    i didn't say it was too loud.....but i also value my hearing, and don't wish to damage something which can't be repaired!!

    Imagine having tinitus; i know people who have this, and the constant sound they can hear drives them insane...all because they thought it was cool to listen to music at ultra volumes for long periods, or put their ears next to PA speakers, or use walkmans at full volumes......
     
  24. pizzed-monkey

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    ........this thread is getting a bit "Spinal Tap" now.....;)




    cheers
    pizzed-monkey
     
  25. martian1

    martian1
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    Best price for this amp on the web..anyone.
     
  26. mandlebrot

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    Can't put the Marantz SR4200 on mute then crank up the volume, you need to put it on an input thats either not connected or switched off if you want to see how far up it goes without going deaf.

    Mine goes up to +14 but that would be way to loud, 0 is the loudest I have ever used.
     
  27. Prav

    Prav
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    I managed a price match at Richer Sounds N. Manchester for £340. Could have gone lower as they never checked the other store I was matching with. Dunno about the web though - RS website do the same price match with other web traders.
     
  28. martian1

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    Prav, ordered my amp today [to good an offer!].It was reduced at Global Hifi £369+They were willing to accept my old Pioneer 808 as part exchange.. So balance on amp is £244, Oh and they have ordered it for me in none black[not sure if its gold or silver].
     
  29. Prav

    Prav
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    Wow, good one - check out www.marantz.com for the colour - pretty nifty. I was going to get the gold one but the rest of my kit is black so thought I'd stick with the same.
     
  30. martian1

    martian1
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    Rest of my gear is black as well but i am looking into the future, my DVD player is 4yrs old,CD six yrs so i will at sometime get all in a similar colour.. The black seems a bit old fashioned now and Marantz looks twice the player in the Gold ? from pictures anyway.
     

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