Help with my home cinema and new surround speakers

Gasp3621

Distinguished Member
I just want to know if it's a good deal or if I can get better ones for this price.

My X1600H only has one more pair of speaker inputs available, and I don't think back surround is very feasible in my room because of the big glass window in the back wall, as well as the back door right next to it, so I think 5.1.2 is the way to go for me... I thought they were supposed to be placed as front speakers tho. Will ATMOS movies "detect" how the height speakers are placed? I know the receiver does that, but will it impact how the movie sounds? For example is the movie "coded" to sound as if it's coming from the front or ceiling or whatever?

You will assign them in the Denon menu as Front Heights and it`s up to person will he place them on front wall or side wall (in front of listeners).

Keep in mind that you will get the speakers working with all material, not just with Atmos soundtrack movies. You will just use the Dolby Surround or DTS Neural:X upmixer modes in your receiver. :)
 
So if I buy only one pair and place them, should I place them slightly in front or in back of the couch?

I have the following options today:
- SVS Prime Elevation for 385€
- Mission LX-3DMK II for 240€
- Klipsch R-41SA for 270€

Which would be a better choice?
 

Gasp3621

Distinguished Member
SVS Primes! They are also largest physically.

If you go with the SVS then send email them with the picture or two of your room. They usually reply back fast and as the question is related to their product, they can answer best!

[email protected]
 
I decided and bought that pair of SVS prime elevation speakers.

I'm still having some trouble with the surround sound and the 2 surround speakers. I know they aren't that great, but I don't think their placing or their levels aren't quite right, as I am not hearing the surround effects when I watch a movie, and I'm having doubts because of the new svs speakers that are on their way: The surround speakers placement impacts where I place the height speakers, or I can just place the height speakers on the couch sides (as I've been told by SVS experts) without worrying about the surrounds speakers' placement?

Also, yesterday I was watching a movie and exploring the denon settings menu and came across a lot of new options on the surround settings that I've never seen before. I'm attaching a pic for you to check if I should change anything.
 

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Gasp3621

Distinguished Member
I decided and bought that pair of SVS prime elevation speakers.

I'm still having some trouble with the surround sound and the 2 surround speakers. I know they aren't that great, but I don't think their placing or their levels aren't quite right, as I am not hearing the surround effects when I watch a movie, and I'm having doubts because of the new svs speakers that are on their way: The surround speakers placement impacts where I place the height speakers, or I can just place the height speakers on the couch sides (as I've been told by SVS experts) without worrying about the surrounds speakers' placement?

Also, yesterday I was watching a movie and exploring the denon settings menu and came across a lot of new options on the surround settings that I've never seen before. I'm attaching a pic for you to check if I should change anything.

I`m not familiar with those settings, check manual what they are. Then just compare with same chapter of movie. I would assume most people go with defaults. No one really talks about those much that i can remember.

You have some junk Sonys from some cheap mini stereo system. I forgot was your father giving you something better. Hopefully that was the case! And some basic 2,5mm/AWG13-14 speaker wire over that uber cheap ultra thin one..

They should be heard from that distance easily. Here are the recommended angles so you can play with them.. You can bump up the levels 2-3db for example if it makes difference. With the placement of heights go with SVS recommendation.

dolby_speakerplacement_flat_5.1_virtual_2560x1280.jpg
 

Adziadam

Active Member
I would turn loudness management off as it adds compression to the source material. You will loose some depth to films with this on as it's trying to keep all effects below a certain volume limit.
 
Thanks, I will do that.
I just got my SVS Prime Elevation speakers, but I'm not sure I will be able to put them on the sides of the couch, as suggested, because I don't think my Denon receiver decodes that. The "amp assign" modes that we discussed here previously are the following:


So my options seem to be front height or ceiling. I was going for ceiling placement, but then I remembered that there isn't a way for me to hide the two cables that would have to cross the walls right in the middle (I could try to do in-wall cabling, but that's too much for me), so I guess I'm limited to use them as front height speakers... right??
 

Gasp3621

Distinguished Member
Thanks, I will do that.
I just got my SVS Prime Elevation speakers, but I'm not sure I will be able to put them on the sides of the couch, as suggested, because I don't think my Denon receiver decodes that. The "amp assign" modes that we discussed here previously are the following:


So my options seem to be front height or ceiling. I was going for ceiling placement, but then I remembered that there isn't a way for me to hide the two cables that would have to cross the walls right in the middle (I could try to do in-wall cabling, but that's too much for me), so I guess I'm limited to use them as front height speakers... right??

You can still mount them on side walls slightly ahead of listeners i assume and assign them as front heights. Lot of people are running 2pairs of Prime Elevation on the side wall as SVS recommends and they set them as front and rear heights. Don´t get too hung up on that. Mark H set them like too in the review: SVS Prime Elevation 3D Immersive Audio Speakers Review

After running Audussey you might need to bump the levels up some depending of movie and which mode you use. DTS Neural:X is likely bit more aggressive.
 
I usually just use "auto" or "direct", whatever I feel it's sounding better. If I do that, will the movies still use the height speakers if they are only decoded as 5.1?

About the speakers placement, I will place them on the sides then. It's good to know, I was beggining to think I made a mistake buying them when I say my AV receiver didn't decode side height speakers.

But then again, since the denon has both options, wouldn't it make more sense to set the "amp assign" as "top middle" instead of "front height", as that would be closer to where they are placed?
 

Gasp3621

Distinguished Member
Top middle is for overhead speakers if i remember correct so no.

You have to use Dolby Surround or DTS Neural:X upmixers if you want the SVS speakers working with non Atmos/DTS:X movies.
 

Adziadam

Active Member
I usually just use "auto" or "direct", whatever I feel it's sounding better. If I do that, will the movies still use the height speakers if they are only decoded as 5.1?

About the speakers placement, I will place them on the sides then. It's good to know, I was beggining to think I made a mistake buying them when I say my AV receiver didn't decode side height speakers.

But then again, since the denon has both options, wouldn't it make more sense to set the "amp assign" as "top middle" instead of "front height", as that would be closer to where they are placed?
Don't use pure/direct on films it turns audessy off which means all your speakers will be full range and sub calibration is off.
 

gibbsy

Moderator
I usually just use "auto" or "direct", whatever I feel it's sounding better. If I do that, will the movies still use the height speakers if they are only decoded as 5.1?
Not in direct mode. The soundtrack would be played as it appears on the disc. 5.1 will be output as 5.1. There will be no bass management either and the sub will just get the .1 LFE signal as on the soundtrack. Most will just use direct for stereo music as this may give a better performance although there is unlikely to be much of a difference from the stereo option that will play the sub.
 
Ok guys, thanks a lot for all your help. I finally put the SVS speakers on the walls, and I will post here a new pic of my whole system. I ran audyssey again, this is the new results I got. I already changed the crossovers for the suggested individual settings.
What do you think? Especially about the Height Speakers level??
 

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As promised, here are the pics of my room, as it is now. It's my home theater, v0.8 beta version xD I plan to buy a bigger, 75'' TV and better surround speakers in maybe a year or so to complete it.


Maybe cross the height at 120hz, to let the subwoofer handle the lower frequencies.
Both people in this tread and SVS engineers told me to set their crossover at 80hz.

I've been told here to maybe bump their level, tho, but I'm not sure how much, I'm still to really try them in a movie.
 

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Adziadam

Active Member
As promised, here are the pics of my room, as it is now. It's my home theater, v0.8 beta version xD I plan to buy a bigger, 75'' TV and better surround speakers in maybe a year or so to complete it.



Both people in this tread and SVS engineers told me to set their crossover at 80hz.

I've been told here to maybe bump their level, tho, but I'm not sure how much, I'm still to really try them in a movie.
Only reason I mentioned 120hz is your surrounds are set to 120hz was just to keep things more in line with each other. As well as atmos sounds are usually of the higher frequency sounds. There is no right or wrong answer only what you prefer but the standard people tend to use is 80hz.

I have just recently installed some ceiling kef t101's on my ceiling when running audessy it set them to 150hz so I lowered the range to 120hz and like the sound may try 100hz but it's good for me.
 

gibbsy

Moderator
I have just recently installed some ceiling kef t101's on my ceiling when running audessy it set them to 150hz so I lowered the range to 120hz and like the sound may try 100hz but it's good for me.
You really shouldn't drop the crossover to lower than that set by Audyssey. You run the chance of isolating the speaker when the bass below the crossover should be taken up by the sub which is omni directional. You want the 101s to help fill out overheads with just the object based audio being localised.

However it's your room and if it works for you who am I to argue. :smashin:
 

Adziadam

Active Member
You really shouldn't drop the crossover to lower than that set by Audyssey. You run the chance of isolating the speaker when the bass below the crossover should be taken up by the sub which is omni directional. You want the 101s to help fill out overheads with just the object based audio being localised.

However it's your room and if it works for you who am I to argue. :smashin:
I'm not sure why auddessy would pick them up at 150hz when they are rated down to 90hz. I guess it depends on positioning in the room but I will mess around with them once I have installed the other 2 on the ceiling for height rears
 

gibbsy

Moderator
I'm not sure why auddessy would pick them up at 150hz when they are rated down to 90hz. I guess it depends on positioning in the room but I will mess around with them once I have installed the other 2 on the ceiling for height rears
Audyssey takes into account the speakers performance in your room, Firing downwards it may very well be picking up high frequency reflections. Audyssey is room correction, making the speakers work within a given space, hence the high roll off.
 

Adziadam

Active Member
Audyssey takes into account the speakers performance in your room, Firing downwards it may very well be picking up high frequency reflections. Audyssey is room correction, making the speakers work within a given space, hence the high roll off.
I guess so as there firing downwards from the ceiling they are prob picking up sidewall reflection who knows. I'll give 150hz a demo looking forward to have rear heights as well :)
 

Gasp3621

Distinguished Member
As promised, here are the pics of my room, as it is now. It's my home theater, v0.8 beta version xD I plan to buy a bigger, 75'' TV and better surround speakers in maybe a year or so to complete it.



Both people in this tread and SVS engineers told me to set their crossover at 80hz.

I've been told here to maybe bump their level, tho, but I'm not sure how much, I'm still to really try them in a movie.

That looks nice, although i wonder is such heavy toe in (angling) needed for the main speakers.

The surround speakers should be next on the list. If you can find similar range JBLs used then that would be probably my first choice. If not then you could consider SVS Prime serie Satellite or Prime Bookshelf to keep the tonal match similar to your height channels!

Let your ears be the judge regarding how much to bump the levels so they add something, but don´t overpower the rest.
 
That looks nice, although i wonder is such heavy toe in (angling) needed for the main speakers.

I actually took my time to check, calculate and apply all the measures (angles) suggested by dolby - 22º-30º for front speakers, about 110º for surround. XD (Yeah I'm that mental). They are both pointing to the center seat of the couch.

And yes, I will probably look into JBL or SVS speakers for surround, depending of prices/sales. But since I already have these, I will probably upgrade the TV first. Anyway I have to save some money first. I'm still to decide which TV to buy too.
 
Yes I decided on a 75'' at least, already. I meant which model, bc a good OLED that size will be super expensive for me, that is why I need some time to save some money, but I don't want to spend €1000+ on a sh*tty TV. I already decided that I will most likely take thoses shelves off the wall and mount the TV on it, assuming the the drywall can stand it's weight, or I will instead have to buy a new different, bigger TV-av receiver-center speaker-playstations stand/cabinet
 
I just got some new JBL Northridge E20 surround speakers for €75 on ebay, to replace those sony surrounds. What should be their crossover?

Shame you can´t go with projector route.
I have been thinking a lot about that, what would I need to have in consideration for that? I have read yesterday about this ViewSonic PX701-4K that seem to be reasonably priced, is it worth it? I don't want to spend more on it that I would spend on an good 75'' OLED TV, especially considering I still have to buy a screen (and probably some other stuff for mounting them).
 

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