Help with digital around the house

Discussion in 'Freeview & YouView' started by GOONER1963, Jan 8, 2012.

  1. GOONER1963

    GOONER1963
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    Hi all , hope you can help on the following little problem. I have a SKY HD box down stairs and have connected the digital aerial lead into the box , then I have connected another lead from the SKY box rf 1 into the back of the tv and this now receives digital tv , however I have another tv up stairs so I ran another cable from the sky box RF2 out to the second tv but this only picks up analogue and not digital. Any help would be much appreciated. All the tv's have built in digital
     
  2. bow79

    bow79
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    If you mean a freeview ariel lead. Ther is no real reson for it to go in to the sky box it just loops through. it can go strait to the tv.
    I dont think my sky box has 2 rf outputs few things do. Are you sure you are right about that.
    You could just try to splt the areil signal in to 2 using a 'Y' adapter or use an areil amp with 2 outputs.
     
  3. Peter Rhea

    Peter Rhea
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    Assuming you're searching for digital channels correctly . . . if you live in an area where analogue is still broadcast, there's a good chance the analogue signal is considerably stronger than the Freeview signal & the latter simply isn't surviving the journey through the longer cable.

    I'm also assuming that you're using decent cable & that your connections are well made.
     
  4. VinnyH

    VinnyH
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    Or, if by 'Analogue' you mean the content that is received via your Sky dish, i.e. so you can watch Sky TV channels on the TV set upstairs, then the 'Source' or 'Input' on the 2nd set needs to be changed to DTV (or similar) in order for it to tune into the Digital Freeview channels that your main set receives OK (assuming you did mean Freeview, in addition to SKY, when you said that the set now receives DTV).
    You also need to check that the RF Out channel number from your Sky box doesn't clash with any of the DTV MUX numbers (by at least 2 numbers, if possible) although if any did, then that would cause only SOME of the digital channels to fail, not ALL of them.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2012
  5. Peter Rhea

    Peter Rhea
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    And would also affect the tv connected to RF1.
     
  6. GOONER1963

    GOONER1963
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    Thank you for the posts , let me give you a better idea of the set up we have at home. We have a digital aerial which has a splitter , one cable goes into the loft and into a booster and the new tv up there picks up loads of freeview channels. the second cable feeds the ground floor and this tv also picks up freeview without any issues. Then another cable goes up to the first floor and this is where we are unable to get any freeview. If I turn the booster off in the loft then no freeview is picked up on any floor. The first suggestion may be to run a cable from the feed on the ground floor to the first floor to see if freeview then works as I must admit the cable at the momene does have 2 joints but i have checked all the connections. However could I use another booster on the ground floor to boost the signal to the first floor? Hope this gives you a better understanding.
     
  7. GOONER1963

    GOONER1963
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    one other thing we are not in a freeview area , so is it a problem over longer runs of cable?
     
  8. Peter Rhea

    Peter Rhea
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    Looks like this 'booster' is actually a power supply for a masthead amplifier; indeed the 'splitter' is probably a 2-way amp. Do the analogue channels also disappear when you switch this off (apart from the Skybox RF feed, obviously)?
     
  9. GOONER1963

    GOONER1963
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    Yes without the booster then we do loose everything apart from Sky , any help would be much appreciated.
     
  10. Peter Rhea

    Peter Rhea
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    You could try a new cable run or another amplifier on the ground floor, but I'd wait until switchover in your area before doing anything, the increased signal strength may take care of things.

    What area are you in?

    Also, the existing amplifier/splitter might have a spare output that you could use to run a cable direct to the 1st floor tv, but you'd lose the channel from the Sky box.
     
  11. Rodders53

    Rodders53
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    1. Use analogue teletext to see if your current analogue signal should be OK for digtal terrestrial after switchover... Digital UK - The condition of your aerial

    2. Use the Trade View of Digital UK - Postcode checker to get detailed reception predictions for your location, including dates for when things will happen.

    It's quite likely that, when switchover happens in your area, the existing distribution you have will work fine. You probably will still need the amplifier/booster you use for analogue, though, even after switchover.
     
  12. GOONER1963

    GOONER1963
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    The booster in the loft has only one output and I would prefer not to try and run a new cable as all the existing cable are hidden under the floor boards. I do have another booster , so I will try that out but I thought if you have more than one booster it could make things worse? Not sure about that , anyway my post code is ME17 2QH. Also we have 3 different makes of HD TV at home , Panasonic plasma in the loft Brand new , 1 Sony downstairs which is about 3 years old , and then another Sony and a LG on the first floor. It sounds like a tv shop!!
     
  13. Rodders53

    Rodders53
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    Do you know where your aerial is pointing / what transmitter you receive from?

    Cascading amplifiers can do more harm than good - but in your situation it may not be a bad thing for now as your trying to make up for the extra losses in the longer cable.

    NB Your predictions are not especially good, even after switchover. Dover and Bluebell Hill seems the most likely source of your DTT reception at present?
     
  14. Peter Rhea

    Peter Rhea
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    This 'booster' in the loft is almost certainly the PSU for the actual amplifier, located where the cable is split. These amplifiers typically have 2 or 4 outputs.

    If you're receiving from Crystal Palace (UHF channels in the range 22-34, also analogue C5 from Croydon on ch.37), switchover is taking place in April & the power increase will probably sort your problem.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2012
  15. GOONER1963

    GOONER1963
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    I will try the booster option down stairs and report back to all , but please note this will not be tonight as I am going down the pub!
     
  16. GOONER1963

    GOONER1963
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    Hi all , I did get a chance to have another look last night and i would say the aerial is pointing towards the Dover area , our post code is ME17 2QH , anyway the spare booster I had made no change to the tv's upstairs. But I did check the teletext page where the test card is for digital . Both the TV down stairs and the TV in the loft receive digital and both display the teletext test card , however when I tried teletext on one of the tv's on the first floor you could see that teletext was not displayed very well on the tv , I would say that it kept breaking up and you could not make out all the letters. I am not sure how much gain I require to sort this out as if I am unable to get a teletext page up , not much chance of digital. I did check some of the connections as there are 2 connections between the ground floor and the first floor , but not any change there. At the moment on the first floor I can get 4-5 very snowy pictures on analogue. The 2 options i can think of would be to ask what is the best booster to purchase to see if this would change things or to run a new cable with a booster to the first floor. Please let me have your thoughts. As a guide on the new Panasonic tv in the loft there is a signal bar as you change from one digital station to another and i would say this is at about 25% on most channels and the odd one at 50% , but we have not switched over in our area yet.
     
  17. Peter Rhea

    Peter Rhea
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    So there's more than 1 tv on the 1st floor?

    What kind of device is used to split the signal from the ground floor between them?
     
  18. Rodders53

    Rodders53
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    Dover is probably the most likely source of reliable digital reception after switchover completes in late June.

    It seems, from your description, that there is a problem with the 1st floor cabling and or splitting of the signal to feed that area. Ideally you need to trace and determine exactly what you have and where they are in the circuit - with makes and model numbers of any components (amplifiers, splitters, power units) where possible. Kinked cables and stray whiskers of outer screen touching the centre core can kill the signals quite easily. Good coaxial cable is 7-8mm in diameter - anything thinner could be suspect.

    Planning Your TV Installation is worth reading - following the links to associated parts (cables, splitters etc.,.).
     
  19. GOONER1963

    GOONER1963
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    one of the tv's on the first floor has sky , so that is not a real issue but the other tv on the first floor just has a wifi sony streamer as it is not possible to get a decent picture. the cable is just split on the ground floor with a 2 way split , I will check all the cable connections again ,I would estimate the run from the ground floor to the first floor of about 10-12 metres. Would it be best to purchase some decent cable and just run this from the feed on the ground floor direct to the tv on the first floor before the purchase of any other booster?
     
  20. Peter Rhea

    Peter Rhea
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    :confused: 2-way split? Starting at the ground floor Skybox RF2 outlet, describe what lies between it & any connected tv(s).
     
  21. GOONER1963

    GOONER1963
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    This is the total set up , digital aerial on the roof which must be split as I have one feed into the loft and this is where the booster box is , the other cable goes to the ground floor. Both of these receive digital no problems. The cable feed downstairs goes into the back of the sky box , then one cable from the sky box on the ground floor goes to the tv there and another cable from the sky box on the ground floor goes to the first floor (but there are 2 connections on the that cable run) The cable goes under the lounge floor into the hall (still under the floor boards , this is where one connection is made) then routed to the landing again under floor boards and into one bedroom (this is where another connection is made) and then another cable into the other bedroom. We have been in this house for 20 years so the tech has changed and the house has been extended and thus cables all over the place ( sorry I do not like to see any cables so thats why they are all under the floor. So I could run a new cable upstairs just to test the signal but a major issue to hide it!!
     
  22. GOONER1963

    GOONER1963
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    If you turn the booster off in the loft then you loose all pictures on all the TV's in the house.
     
  23. Peter Rhea

    Peter Rhea
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    By 'connection' do you mean a simple joint in one cable run or does it branch off into others?

    Also (as I've posted twice already), the booster is almost certainly a power supply that sends a DC voltage through the coax cable to the actual amplifier (masthead type).
     
  24. GOONER1963

    GOONER1963
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    Yes the connection is just a simple joint , I am not sure how much of the signal you loose when you have 2-3 joints?
     
  25. Rodders53

    Rodders53
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    The only solution we can advise that will be likely (still not certain) to work is to run new individual cables from each outlet you want on the 1st floor to the lounge and there fit a powered 3-4-way amplified splitter which is fed from RF2 out.

    If the cables have been split passively with proper splitters: RF2 --> hall splitter -4dB each way --> landing -> bedroom splitter 2-ways another -4dB --> the 2 bedrooms outlets

    So you will - with good quality splitters - be losing 8dB of signal plus any cable losses (say 1dB) to the two bedroom outlets at the end of the chain. -3dB is half the signal -6dB is 1/4 and -9dB 1/8th.

    Now if the wires have just been joined and a proper splitter not used then anything could happen.

    I'm afraid it's time to lift those floorboards and investigate / replace cables! (Or seek out alternative routes for the cables via external walls?)

    If you don't want the Sky modulated picture in those 1st floor bedrooms you could fit a powered splitter in the loft room and feed new cables from there instead (but you'll still need that power unit connected to the aerial feed for the mast head amplifier, of course).
     
  26. iaint

    iaint
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    Hi.
    Unplug the aerial from one of the upstairs TVs and try the other one?
    --
    Regards, Iain.
     
  27. GOONER1963

    GOONER1963
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    Thanks for all your help , I will purchase some good quality cable and get a booster. I will update you all in the next week or so.
     

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