HELP? Tiny room - Upside-down floorstanders? sideways ported subs?

fullerorb7

Novice Member
Ok so I got more questions than what the post title states.
I like my TV up high, so I can still have a good view while not having to sit straight up.
I just ordered 2 SVS PB-3000 for an extremely good deal. 2300$. They are less than 2 months used and pre-SVS-increase price on top.... about a 1000$ off, so I couldn't pass it up... but they will not fit in my setup.

CURRENT SETUP:
I have my floorstanding speakers on nightstands. I think the audio would be more accurate if I had them upside down to be for the most part level with my center speaker.
My center speaker is on TOP of my glass base TV stand.
My atmos heights I don't think I get much use from since the floorstanding's are soo high.
all my speakers are klipsch reference premier.
My receiver is a denon x760h.
My TV is a LG C1.
Here's my TV stand

MY MAIN PROBLEM:
the SVS PB-3000 subs are very stall. I'd like to place them on my dresser, under my TV, BUT there's not enough room under my TV.
.... I already have my glass TV stand sitting on top of furniture height extenders.

IDEA 1:
Place my floorstanding speakers upside down with my subs under them.

IDEA 2:
Place my center speaker under my glass TV stand base, which would raise my TV 7 inches higher

IDEA 3:
Place the subs sideways... and nothing has to move besides my xbox

QUESTIONS:
Would the health of my speakers be impacted if:
I place the floorstanding speakers upside down?
I Place my floorstanding speakers on top of my subs?
I have the weight of my TV+TV stand on top of my center speaker?

I was also thinking of taking down my atmos heights and placing them on my left/right side walls... forgetting atmos all together, to get full surround sound.
If I do this, I suppose I could keep my floorstanding speakers to remain upright.
 

Attachments

  • 16379107708798249893585749509053.jpg
    16379107708798249893585749509053.jpg
    278.7 KB · Views: 57
  • 16379108611614057933093960218347.jpg
    16379108611614057933093960218347.jpg
    255.3 KB · Views: 51
  • 16379109127324277311555258679263.jpg
    16379109127324277311555258679263.jpg
    192 KB · Views: 42
  • 16379109864246914299182963506187.jpg
    16379109864246914299182963506187.jpg
    204.3 KB · Views: 42
  • 16379110332342940401150931118751.jpg
    16379110332342940401150931118751.jpg
    190.4 KB · Views: 42
  • 16379110532357945060656939421711.jpg
    16379110532357945060656939421711.jpg
    286.2 KB · Views: 42
  • 16379110690451459109817112219683.jpg
    16379110690451459109817112219683.jpg
    342.5 KB · Views: 38
  • 163791153311789959004939318999.jpg
    163791153311789959004939318999.jpg
    283 KB · Views: 53
Last edited:

larkone

Member
If you have good subs (which you do) then you can get rid of the floor standers and get something smaller in their place. Floor standers are good if you do not have subs as they are the best compromise to get reasonable bass. Moving the load to subs means you don't need the bass extension floor standers give.
 

fullerorb7

Novice Member
If you have good subs (which you do) then you can get rid of the floor standers and get something smaller in their place. Floor standers are good if you do not have subs as they are the best compromise to get reasonable bass. Moving the load to subs means you don't need the bass extension floor standers give.
OMG that sounds GR8!!!
but I'll need to look into what price I'd get back for selling the floor standers... I don't want to end up paying money to get something smaller. That would be a smaller tweeter too.
My setup is less than 6 months old.
I promise your idea will be on playback in my mind for a long time.

My subs are arriving by the 30th... I just want to make something work on that day

EDIT: just added option 3
 
Last edited:

Gasp3621

Distinguished Member
Can`t you get rid off the nightstands? That looks bit ridiculous and far from ideal. Don`t move the center channel anywhere lower. Find a new place for av-receiver though if possible. Upside down, what? No! They should be on floor!

One surround speaker is in corner (bipole), far from ideal. You should stick with 5.2 system and mount the bipole speakers higher up (2feet from seated ear height) and so that they are ~1feet from side walls each side, so spread apart more and higher up if you go 5.2 cause you sit so close to them. Atmos is not ideal in your room really. Get rid of the wall brackets on rear wall if possible.

Also you would have been more than fine with RP-600M as main speakers. You can`t fit two PB3000 and floorstanders there!

I would have also chosen 2x SB3000 over PB as that room looks so darn small, but if you were to keep the PBs i would try to sell/swap the towers for RP-600M and put them on top of your PB3000 as larkone mentioned. In that room PB3000s are bit too much, 2x SB2000 Pro or 2x SB3000 would have been plenty and sounded better as you get so much room gain that you don´t need big ported boxes!

Is that Denon S-760H? That is rather cheap receiver with those speakers. X3700H would have been more ideal and it would have the whole system sounding better especially as you don´t have ideal speakers in your room. It won´t also do much for your subwoofers meaning they will sound boomy and bloated shooking/rattling everything there! X3700H or SR6015 has Audussey Mult EQ XT32 which is what i would have wanted as it can correct the bass region more effectively which you need. This goes for both speakers and subwoofers.

I don´t want to sound negative, but this looks quite horrible if i may say straight! :(
 
Last edited:

Joe Fernand

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
'Can`t you get rid off the nightstands? That looks bit ridiculous and far from ideal'.

'I don´t want to sound negative, but this looks quite horrible if i may say straight!
:('

I suspect many are thinking exactly as you are :)

Sort the room, room layout, furniture and use the kit the OP has correctly.

Joe
 

fullerorb7

Novice Member
I'm an open minded person. I came here to get advice. I appreciate your response more than no response. I will make changes and re-upload new pictures.

● subs and speakers last a long time, maybe even a lifetime for some. I look at those as investments. I moved back in with my parents rent free so I can blow money on stuff like this freely.... lol this room size is temporary. Speakers, TV and subs all purchased in the last 6-9 months. Before then I've only used just standard TV speakers.
● I tried the sb-3000's and hated them. I want ported... preferably the pb-2000's, but with the price increase I literally got the 3000's for 200$ more than the 2000's. If anything I might even be able to resell and make money off the 3000's for the price I got them.
● I have many empty/half full drawers. Yeah I can get rid of the nightstands.
● And... the cat fort shelves hanging on my right side wall, they can be taken down too
● Honestly I really only wanted 1 shelf above my bed, but went overboard since each shelf after that was 10$... it looks like sh*t, i know. I only use the one above my bed and the small keyboard shelf. The small room was driving me crazy not being able to fit my nightstand beside my bed.
● My biggest priority is hdmi 2.1 with [email protected] + dolby vision for Xbox gaming. The denon is cheap and I got a 6 month return policy on it... it's temporary until I can get a better deal. If I don't get a better deal, I'll return and rebuy to wait another 6 months.
● Replacing the floorstanders with RP-600M will most definitely be in my mind, but I'm not rushing to that just yet.

Soo put the floorstanders on top of the subs?
Would the subs base quality be the best on top of the dresser or on the ground where the nightstands are at?

Just a FYI
if the nightstands were gone I wouldn't be able to see the woofers in the floor standers, just the tweeter only.
If I replaced the nightstands with subs, the subs would be totally hidden, and the floorstanders Would be 4 inches lower.
 
Last edited:

Joe Fernand

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
You don’t necessarily need to ‘see’ the mid range drivers of the floor standing speakers.

Grab some wood or other ‘boards’ which you can layer and experiment with raising the cabinets to find the optimal height in your room*, most likely you will only require an inch or two so the Subs will probably not make a good plinth for the Speakers as they are too tall.

*Small changes in height and positioning can make a big difference to what you hear so going from no plinth to a very high plinth (the Sub or side table) in one step is far from ideal.

I would start listening without the Subs and once you experiment with the height and placement of the Front LR you can then experiment with introducing the Subs into the room/system.

Investing for the future is a great idea but don’t try and shoehorn too many loudspeakers into your current room if it means reducing what you can achieve with a simpler setup.

Joe
 

Gasp3621

Distinguished Member
I'm an open minded person. I came here to get advice. I appreciate your response more than no response. I will make changes and re-upload new pictures.

● subs and speakers last a long time, maybe even a lifetime for some. I look at those as investments. I moved back in with my parents rent free so I can blow money on stuff like this freely.... lol this room size is temporary. Speakers, TV and subs all purchased in the last 6-9 months. Before then I've only used just standard TV speakers.
● I tried the sb-3000's and hated them. I want ported... preferably the pb-2000's, but with the price increase I literally got the 3000's for 200$ more than the 2000's. If anything I might even be able to resell and make money off the 3000's for the price I got them.
● I have many empty/half full drawers. Yeah I can get rid of the nightstands.
● And... the cat fort shelves hanging on my right side wall, they can be taken down too
● Honestly I really only wanted 1 shelf above my bed, but went overboard since each shelf after that was 10$... it looks like sh*t, i know. I only use the one above my bed and the small keyboard shelf. The small room was driving me crazy not being able to fit my nightstand beside my bed.
● My biggest priority is hdmi 2.1 with [email protected] + dolby vision for Xbox gaming. The denon is cheap and I got a 6 month return policy on it... it's temporary until I can get a better deal. If I don't get a better deal, I'll return and rebuy to wait another 6 months.
● Replacing the floorstanders with RP-600M will most definitely be in my mind, but I'm not rushing to that just yet.

Soo put the floorstanders on top of the subs?
Would the subs base quality be the best on top of the dresser or on the ground where the nightstands are at?

Just a FYI
if the nightstands were gone I wouldn't be able to see the woofers in the floor standers, just the tweeter only.
If I replaced the nightstands with subs, the subs would be totally hidden, and the floorstanders Would be 4 inches lower.

You probably tried the SB3000 in some other larger room and if at dealer then they could be setup poorly as we often see. In such small room as yours 2x SB3000 would shook it big time! If you stick with the PB3000s then you need to get the RP-600M as the towers can´t be put on top of 55cm tall subwoofers. The tweeters would go too high just like you have now. You should be standing now when watching movies for it to be ideal. Those 600s work great in larger cinema rooms so no worries on that side.
 

fullerorb7

Novice Member
I got 2 RP-600M'S!!!!! Sitting on top of my trashcan until sub arrives to hold it up

I got 2 sb3000 from svs, in my room and was disappointed.
Before that I've tried out 2 pc-2000 in the exact same spot.
I thought since the pc-2000's were right about "enough" level, maybe if I go sealed, but still go up a level, maybe the 3000's would be enough. SB3000 were NOT enough.
I had all 4 at max volume. Same movie scenes from Same discs

Base was clear 100% the time for the sb3000's, but i previously came from 2 pc-2000, so I was underwhelmed.
For pc-2000 about 85-90% of the time, the base was usually clear. On some scenes it would get over done. things would be rattling and one corner of my room oddly seemed to "eat up" the extra bass... but like I said 10-15% of the time.

My room has shelves, picture frames and no treatment.
Adjustments can be made

My best base scene was aquaman in the beginning when the door is kicked in. The sb-3000 did a good job sounding realistic, but... the PC-2000 made ME feel like IM THE DOOR!!!! being kicked down.
For base heavy scenes like the door/punches/gunshots or quick explosions, everything is clear on the pc-2000.
For rockets going to space, longer or multiple explosions or any extended heavy base scenes, that's when rattling on the ported sub happens..... but like I said adjustments can be made
 

Attachments

  • 16381335190162999475427287491696.jpg
    16381335190162999475427287491696.jpg
    208.3 KB · Views: 36
Last edited by a moderator:

Gasp3621

Distinguished Member
Ok, the dual PB3000s is going to kick your butt!! You are clearly more basshead than normal folks then. :) Good to see you got the RP-600M! They should be much more ideal than any tower speakers cramped tightly in corners and raised up like giraffes.

When you got the PB3000s check the quick quide and download phone app.

For connection to an AV Receiver, set the PB-3000 volume to -10 in the app (on
the rear panel, all but the last two lights illuminated). Set the low pass filter to LFE
and the phase to 0 degrees, then run auto-set-up on the AV Receiver.


Run 3 mic placements with Audussey on your Denon. Set both subs to same -10 volume level in the phone app. After Audussey check from Denon menu that the "subwoofer level" for subwoofer 1 and 2 is not -12db!!! It usually shows the results after the setup is done. If this is the case then you need to run the app with the volume set to -15 example on both subs. -12db in the receiver menu (subwoofer level) is out of range so you want slightly lower figures.

Naturally AFTER RUNNING AUDUSSEY you will set speaker sizes all Small and set crossovers 80hz for front three and surrounds, for front height (atmos) channels ~100hz could be more ideal. These can be tweaked later, but just for starting point these will do fine.

As you have the seat/bed against rear wall make sure you have the mic on seated ear height (tripod/cardboard mic stand if it comes with it) and do not keep the mic too close to walls, usual recommendation is 0,5meter away.

You need to follow certain procedure, not manually tweak them by ear "maxing all subs" or something other sillyness..
 

Joe Fernand

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
'I got 2 RP-600M'S!!!!! Sitting on top of my trashcan until sub arrives to hold it up' the key is ensuring the HF unit is at the correct height for your seated ear level.

'On some scenes it would get over done. things would be rattling and one corner of my room oddly seemed to "eat up" the extra bass...' - time for some homework on how your loudspeaker (inc Sub) placement is key to what you hear in your room, what physically 'looks' correct does not always deliver the best result at your seat!

Joe

PS It would be interesting to understand the SPL at your seat when you are listing to a movie :)
 

fullerorb7

Novice Member
My sound isolation feet and soundpath cables are being re-sent... they got lost in the mail.
I'll post again in 2 days
 

The latest video from AVForums

Podcast: CES '22 TV Announcement Round-up, Plus, Most Anticipated Movies of 2022 and More...
Subscribe to our YouTube channel

Full fat HDMI teeshirts

Support AVForums with Patreon

Top Bottom