HDMI 1.3 AV Amps and 3D passthrough? Please post your experiences :)

So if i kept the Amp, the BD player would send video to tv and sound to the amp. But would that be the same for Tivo? does the optical work on the Tivo so could do the same, or could that still pass through the amp?

Oh and thanks for the reply

 

Hi. I'm new here today, and this thread is very interesting.

This issue has been driving me crazy.

I have a Sony BDP-S570 3D Bluray player, connected to Sony STR-DA2400ES amp via HDMI. The Amp is connected to a Samsung PS50C6900 3D TV via HDMI. The Bluray player WILL NOT recognise the 3D TV and will not play 3D discs in this configuration.

Connecting the 3D Bluray player directly to the 3D TV works fine, but as already pointed out....HD audo possibilities are then lost, and anyway, I really wanted synced video/audio switching via the amp without needing to constantly select different source inputson both the amp and TV.

I can confirm that HDMI 1.4 equipment and cables are NOT required for 3D as I just found out after wasting £80 on a couple of 1.4 Chord cables. I get perfect 3D playback when the 3D Bluray player is connected to the 3D TV with either 1.3 or 1.4 cables.

In fact, the documentation for the BDP-S570 3D Player makes no mention anywhere of HDMI version requirements.

Interstingly, SKY+ HD 3D signals pass through the STR-DA2400ES to the TV with no problem at all......perhaps this is because SKY+ HD signal is not sure HD at 1080i instead of 1080p?

So....I have the same issue as everyone else here......it must be something in the 1080p 3D signal from the 3D player that can't pass through the STR-DA2400ES to the TV and vice versa. Is there not a way of creating a pure pass-through HDMI connection through the amp, as if it wasn't there at all?

Alternatively....I was wondering if anyone had tried connecting a 3D Bluray player to a 3D TV through the STR-DA2400ES using Component cables instead? Wouldn't this still give 1080p performance? It would alos free up the HDMI connection for audio only. The documentation for the STR-DA2400ES describes the component connections as pure pass-through.

Anyone tried?

Many thanks.

 

The one thing I've noticed with my SR606 is that the up scaling only goes to 1080i rather 1080p. I was wondering if this has something to do with not being able to play through the 3D BluRay signal.

 

Should have bought an HDMI cable for £1.30p:-
1.8M HDMI to HDMI Cable - £1.30: Amazon.co.uk: Electronics
They were £0.32p last week - shame.

Wait, just found this cable for £0.01, what the heck is going on there!
HDMI for 1 pence
.
.
.
.

 

@Tents2Castles
Hi mate - I have different equipment to you and experienced a similar problem. Here is an email I sent to Neet the people who were helping me with this setup, and it explains my setup and problems experienced -saves me typing it again. Maybe the same could work for you:

OK, using Neet cables it all works a treat.

So to cut a long story short (to trouble-shoot similar problems) I bought this to enable 3d to be played on my telly (Panasonic GT30) from PS3, with second HDMI output going to AMP (Sony STRDH800 none 3d amp) purely for sound. Final configuration is everything connected via Neet splitter using only Neet 1.4 Cables.

My initial problem was PS3 would only detect 2 channel surround, not amps sound formats, so you sent me another Neet box to try.
Fix: In PS3 had to manually choose what my amp can handle, not let PS3 detect as it only detects what TV can output

Next problem was when I played Bluray films or movies via DLNA the screen blanked out about 5+ times in a film for about 2-3 secs each time randomly. Seemed to be handshake problem.
Fix: Ordered 1m Neet cables, and all fine now!!

Note playing 3D from Virginmedia --> Amp --> TV works fine. I only connected my PS3 to this splitter. I haven't tried 3d blurays, but 3d games work fine as the PS3 now detects that the TV is 3D.

This is what I bought
Neet® - 2 Way HDMI SPLITTER BOX 1x2 Port (1 input 2 output) £29.95
Neet 1m Cables (2 of) £6.95 each
Neet 2m Cables (2 of) £7.95 each - already owned these.

I used a mixture of cables and that caused the blinking issues, using the same version (or brand) of cables fixed it.

Can I also say Neet support was awesome...

 

Many thanks all for the tips. I tried last night to hook up the 3D Bluray player through the amp to the TV using component cables, but that didn't work either. The resolution I can get is 1920x1080i using component cables. Also, connecting the 3D Bluray directly to the TV using components doesn't allow for 3D discs to be played.

So back to original set-up, connected directly to the TV using HDMI and Optical cable to the surround amplifier. Not ideal, but I'm not forking out extra for a new 1.4 amp just to have HDMI sound through it.

Thanks again for the help.

 

Are you sure about this? I just tried hooking a new Sony 3D Blu-ray player and new Sony 3D TV through my 5400, and I cannot get 3D to work unless I bypass the receiver. Chatted with some idiot at Sony tech support and he said the 5400 does not support 3D.

If you actually have this working, I'd love to know how.

 

Hi Joe,

I don't really want to have to lose some of the HD Audio formats by using optical, but have an AVR (HK AVR255) which is HDMI pre-3D. I currently have 3x HDMI sources connected and all works fine in terms of the AVR being able to pass the 3D signal to the display and output HDMI HD Audio.

I have two minor issues - first, when the PS3 is connected directly to the TV, HDMI control is passed back and forth so the TV automagically switches to the 'Game' preset. When connected via the AVR, this doesn't happen (okay, this is a very minor gripe!). The second issue is of more inconvenience - the Virgin Media V+ HD box I have connected will refuse to play any 3D content whilst *initially* connected via the AVR. If I recable the V+ box to the TV I can launch a 3D programme. I can then pause the programme, recable the V+ to the AVR and resume playback (in 3D) perfectly fine. It seems to be the 'handshake' that's the issue.

I'd like a 4x2 Matrix to resolve the issue, but from what I've read and been advised, the likelihood is that when concurrently connecting the TV and AVR, the TV will report back in its EDID information that it is only capable of 2Channel Audio only thus reducing the audio output for the AVR to 2Channel also.

I understand that there are several solutions most of which rely on modifying/spoofing the EDID information.

You mention in your post "DA running Firmware that allows the DA to generate the required 3D EDID" - can you advise on any specific DA's or Matrices that will allow modification of the EDID information to meet my requirements. It's worth noting that I don't require any audio from the TV so I'm quite happy for the HDMI signal to be sent to the TV in a multichannel format it doesn't understand so long as it doesn't affect my ability to utilise the video stream - similarly the same in reverse for my AVR.

Would really appreciate some pointers. I'm looking at the simplest and cheapest solution where I don't need to replace my AVR. So far I've come up with the idea of a Matrix that will allow manual EDID modification but haven't found any that will allow that in the sub £100 price range.

I've also seen an EDID emulator:
Gefen EXT-HDMI-EDIDP - EDID Emulator for HDMI

and presume I could put that in between a simple 4x2 Matrix Output1 and TV to enable me to do what I want, but then the price for a solution is about £150 taking into account having to also buy a Matrix.

Many thanks!

 

Thanks Joe - well, if you ever do test it, please post the results
Regards the two Octava devices - they're a bit out of my price range - especially given there's no guarantees it would actually work for my usage, but thanks anyway. I don't understand why there aren't any low end consumer priced Matrix's readily available given that you can get a Denon AVR-1911 incorporating 3D PassThru for £240. How much can the technology cost that's needed to meet the requirements of the many people like myself that have a 3D TV but a non 3D HDMI AVR?? To my mind, it would seem that all that's needed is for a Matrix/Splitter to have it's own EDID information that it can present to the source and then buffer/forward-on the HDMI signal afresh to both outputs.

Dragons Den anyone???

 

My understanding of the HDMI/EDID issues is relatively limited - I only came across EDID about a week ago! I'm not sure where/how the EDID information is generated, but would this work:

********************

Issue:
Need HDMI to two output devices concurrently
Output device 1 only needs visual (1080p)
Output device 2 only needs audio (Multichannel)
Output device 1 can only handle 2Channel Audio, therefore Lowest Common Denominator dictates that the audio presentation will be 2Channel to both output device 1 and 2.

Solution (??):
Matrix/Switch Output 1 > [HDMI>DVI Cable + DVI>HDMI Cable] > Output device 1
Matrix/Switch Output 2 > HDMI > Output device 2

Anticipated Result:
DVI = No Audio capabilities of Output Device 1, therefore Multichannel to Output Device 2

OR

DVI = No Audio capabilities of Output Device 1, therefore No Audio output to Device 2

********************

Would anyone like to advise if this would work????

 

Okay, well that makes sense I guess.
Maybe licencing will always keep such a solution out of the reach of low-budget consumers (like myself! )

Thanks Joe!

 

Anyone got any thoughts on this?

 

@mouseboy007 I suggest you ask here about HDMI matrix switching, as your not really asking about AV receivers.

 

I have a Sony STR5400ES receiver which until last weekend was happily passing 3d Virgin On Demand content to my tv. Now it can no longer do so. The reason, I am told, is because Virgin have changed the software on their STB. Where once it would accept 3d through to any receiver it will only do so now to 3d ready receivers. I hope Sony will provide an firmware update to solve the problem otherwise there are going to be a lot of unhappy people out there, myself included!

 

Yeah, this is my problem exactly - however, you may find that if you re-wire your Virgin box to your TV you can start playing the 3D content, pause it right away, then recable back to the Receiver and un-pause and it'll play perfectly fine. That's my experience anyway. Obviously it's a pain to recable all the time so I'm trying to find a passive (i.e. non powered) HDMI 1-in-2-out switch, but it seems to be quite hard to track down. If I had one I could then 'switch' to TV, play the content, pause and quickly 'switch' back to the Receiver and actually watch the content through my Receiver.

If you hear of Virgin changing it again to allow 3D through the receiver, please post here!

Thanks

 

Yes I sort of came across your idea when I was playing about with the receiver last night. I found that if I played 3d content directly to the tv it worked fine. If I then left the programme playing and switched back to the receiver the picture would pass through ok as if there had never been a problem. Trouble was as soon as the programme ended and I selected another the receiver wouldn't recognise it and I would have to go through the whole tv/receiver cycle again. Not at all satisfactory. Virgin should at least have warned people about the change to their software instead of just leaving us high and dry.

 

No go with an Onkyo TX-NR906 in case anyone ever comes looking.

 

Panna 310 into a Onk 805 and out to a Samsung T23A750 using some old Supra HF100 cables seems to work fine.

 

Just managed to get ps3 3d gaming to work on my denon 3310. The 3d edid doesn't work when routing the ps3 through the amp so the ps3 doesn't recognise my 50vt30 as a 3d tv. But I plugged the ps3 directly into the tv to get the display output 3d resolutions configured and then plugged it into the amp and switched off all processing and I know have 3d gaming through the amp

I have a panny 310 player with 2 hdmi outputs so 3d movies and hd audio is covered as well!

A few things to note with the denon.....although batpig's FAQ states that the denon will pass through the hdmi signal untouched if I/p scaling is off and video conversion is on I found this wasn't the case! I had to switch off video conversion (which means the denon GUI is sent to the screen in 576i!!) for the ps3 hdmi socket to get the 3d signal to pass through. I figured this out as I tried turning the hdmi control on on the denon allowing the hdmi signal to be passed through with the amp in standby and this worked. But, if the video conversion option was on and I/p scaling off when the amp was switched on the picture turned into a strange type of snow! Turning video conversion off fixed this.

Hope this is useful to another denon 1.3 hdmi amp owner trying to game in 3d from their ps3

 

I'm baffled by this.

The Onkyo 906 won't accept a 3D signal going into it, but the 805 will ?

So you pass a 3D signal into the 805 and you get a fully functioning 2D picture with HD sound ?

 

will try my onkyo 875 with 3d pass through tom from ps3.

 

gutted the onkyo 875 wont pass 3d through tried folling it by plugging straight to the tv which it showed the 3d tv but when i plug it back in amp and start a 3d film it losses signal(i have through selected in the ampmenu)

 

I think thenicklouse was referring to side by side 3D games and not the sequential 3D video associated with 3D Blu-rays? Side by side video should pass through because it looks all the world to the amp like a regular video signal, but it wasn't until the advent of HDMI 1.4 that the sequential 3D video signal was incorporated into the HDMI spec and its associated EDID.

 

thanks that makes sense, wwill have to work out the best way now to get pic straight to tv hdmi and hdmi to amp for hd sound.
or am i just better going hdmi to tv optical for sound as i only play games on it now and optical will do pcm 7.1

so if i plug the sky hd box through the amp it will pas the 3d as thats side by side.

 

I've read reports that you can split the HDMI output of a 3D BD player, sending the 3D signal to a 3D TV and sending the HD audio to an HDMI 1.3 receiver. This in theory should also work with a PS3? You need an HDMI 1.4 compliant HDMI splitter. This is the one I've seen reported as working:

nSplitter Pro 1x2 MK-II QS

nSplitter Pro 1x2 MK-II QS is an advanced HDMI splitter which allows sending digital video and audio signals from one source (BD/DVD player, satellite receiver, computer, game console or HDMI switch with signals from many sources) to two or more (when cascaded) receivers (plasma, LCD, projector, amplifier).

nSplitter Pro supports the HDCP protocol and has its own HDCP keys.

nSplitter Pro supports 3D signal in the following formats: Frame Packing, Side-by-Side and Top-and-Bottom up to [email protected] nSplitter Pro supports mixed combination of 2D and 3D sets.

nSplitter Pro 1x2 MK-II QS is the first splitter with the QuickSwitch™ function. It is used for dynamic changing of video and audio formats so as to optimally adapt them at any time to the capabilities of the receivers connected to nSplitter. The distinguishing feature of the QuickSwitch™ function is that the receiver which is in the stand-by mode is omitted in determining the formats accepted by the receivers connected to nSplitter.

The QuickSwitch™ function is especially useful for display devices with significant variation in parameters. For example, if the signal has to be displayed simultaneously on two receivers, but only one of them supports the [email protected] format, nSplitter Pro MK-II 1x2 forces the source of the signal to convert it from [email protected] to [email protected] As soon as the receiver which does not support [email protected] is switched off, nSplitter Pro MK-II 1x2 QS informs the source of the signal that the transmission format can be changed to the one optimal for the active receiver - [email protected] in this case.

Since MK-II version, nSplitter Pro supports the DreamEDID™ function which gives the possibility to replace the receivers EDID tables with the predefined tables containing the list of the highest video and audio formats supported by nSplitter. This new feature, missing in other HDMI splitters, allows expansion of the compatibility between devices compliant with different versions of the HDMI specification. It solves the problem with AV devices which incorrectly report the range of the supported video or audio formats.


The DreamEDID™ function eliminates the lack of a 3D image when the 3D player compatible with HDMI 1.4a is connected to a 3D ready TV set through an HDMI 1.3 compliant amplifier. The source signal should then be splitted with nSplitter Pro and sent separately to the TV set and to the amplifier. The DreamEDID ™ function provides the appropriate signalling of formats accepted by both devices.

Apart from the HDMI splitter function, nSplitter Pro is perfectly suited as an intermediate device to solve any incompatibility in the HDCP authentication between the connected devices.

Specifications:
• one HDMI input, compliant with HDMI 1.0 - 1.2a, 1.3a - 1.3b, 1.4 - 1.4a, DVI 1.0
• two HDMI outputs, compliant with HDMI 1.0 - 1.2a, 1.3a - 1.3b, 1.4 - 1.4a, DVI 1.0
• HDCP support compliant with HDCP 1.0 and 1.1
• Supports the following 2D video formats:
• [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]/50/60Hz, [email protected]/60Hz,
• [email protected]/50/60Hz and computer formats up to 1920x1200
• Supports the following 3D video formats:
• [email protected]/50/60Hz, [email protected]/60Hz, [email protected]; Frame Packing, Side-by-Side
• and Top-and-Bottom
• Supported audio formats:
• Dolby TrueHD, DTS-HD Master Audio, Dolby Digital Plus, DST (Super Audio CD),
• Dolby Digital, DVD-Audio and PCM (up to 8 channels [email protected])
• Transmits the following control signals:
• Anynet, Aquos Link, BRAVIA Theatre Sync, CE-Link, EasyLink, EZ-Sync, HDAVI Control,
• HDMI-CEC, Kuro Link, NetCommand for HDMI, Regza Link, RIHD, SimpLink, T-Link
• and VIERA Link.
• Supported TDMS clocking: 25MHz - 225MHz
• TMDS bandwith up to 6.75Gbit/s
• Supports: YCbCr, RGB, x.v.Color
• Supports 36-bit Deep Color up to [email protected]
• Supports 48-bit Deep Color up to [email protected]
• Filtering and reconditioning of the HDMI signal
• Nominal current: 0.8A @5V (4W)
• Dimensions: 65 mm x 65 mm x 23 mm
• Weight net: 185 g
• Working conditions: temperature: 0 - 40 C, humidity: 10 - 85%


Elbox Online Store

Yes, as with games, 3D TV broadcasts use side by side 3D video.

 

but the ps3 doesnt pass 3d and hd audio at the same time does it.