HD Fury Arcana will lose me my TV audio?

arthurke

Standard Member
Being a classic example of someone with a TV only supporting ARC but interested in a SONOS ARC soundbar then my attention was drawn to the HD Fury Arcana.

This would seem to do the trick as I would get a way for the audio from an HDMI input to be presented as eARC to the SONOS. But am I missing something significant here?

Today my TV's ARC enabled HDMI is connected to my current soundbar which means it works with either an HDMI input connected to the TV or the broadcast TV channels that are received over the air via a coax aerial connection into my TV. I am in the UK and so it is typical for a TV to have Freeview or Freesat decoders integral to the TV.

If I used the Arcana then there is no longer any connection from my TV to the soundbar and so I can't see how to get audio from the TV channels through my soundbar.

Now getting eARC would be nice if I had a Sonos ARC but not really if it meant when watching broadcast TV then I am back to using the TV's in built speakers.

Am I being an idiot and missing something here?

Andy
 

Clem_Dye

Distinguished Member
You would need an HDMI switch somewhere in the chain. Your TV will only ever be ARC-enabled. If the Sonos has an optical input then you could use that from the TV and use the bar's HDMI input for something else.
 

outoftheknow

Moderator
You would need an HDMI switch somewhere in the chain.
As I understand the HD Fury it has one HDMI in and that isn’t clear as being able to take ARC sound from the TV. It is I think a normal HDMI input for sound and video.

similarly the video output HDMI isn’t clear as being able to take back the TV audio over ARC either.

it does seem as though an optical connection if available for TV sources is a choice. If the HD Fury HDMIs aren’t ARC connected an HDMI switch won’t help.
 

arthurke

Standard Member
Sorry for my delayed response but thanks for the suggestions. At least I was not missing the obvious here.

I have concluded that I got caught up in
a) all the Dolby Atmos buzz and from that into
b) the "I need eARC"

Where Dolby Atmos is possible, my research shows that for my usage the lack of eARC will be the least of my problems. I don't have an external device that uses lossless Dolby Atmos. If I can get it at all it is streamed via an app or downloaded content on Sky Q and none use lossless Dolby Atmos.

I have the soundbar now and I can get Dolby Atmos on it (via DD+ and ARC). The problem is, as I have discovered, being told "xyz streaming service supports Dolby Atmos" does not mean it will do it on every xyz app on every player. Dolby Atmos seems a minefield for home cinema that DD 5.1 never was.

About the most reliable has been my Sky Q. If that shows there is a film that has Dolby Atmos then that is what I get on the soundbar.
 

arthurke

Standard Member
While I don't think the Arcana is for me, I just looked on their website product page under "Getting Started" and it does show a message specifically aimed at this issue of getting TV audio back to the soundbar. So, it would seem you connect the Arcana HDMI out to the TV's ARC HDMI port and then it takes the audio return channel and presents it to the soundbar as would have happened had the TV's ARC HDMI been directly connected to the soundbar. In effect the Arcana seems to be a passthrough for the TV audio as well as doing its main job of linking to the soundbar an external device that could benefit from eARC. It also passes along the CEC control so that I guess you can still change the volume via the TV's remote.

Which all makes logical sense but good to see if being actually called out rather than assumed.

By the way, HD Fury's tech support should take note of their own guidance as I did ask this same question of them and got a very inconclusive response.
 

Woolmeister

Standard Member
Having just taken delivery of my HDfury Arcana, I am currently trying to solve this very problem.

The Arcana is great; I can't fault it from the point of view of sorting out the frustrating lip syncing issues between my BT youview (rebranded Humax) box and my SONOS Arc. It also enables me to get Dolby Atmos from BT Sport Ultimate to the SONOS Arc, straight out of the box with zero configuration.

However, the issues arise when I try to watch a Freesat broadcast (C4HD, for example) on the TV or a YouTube video via the YouTube app (or any app for that matter) on my Panasonic TX58DX902B TV. I can obviously see the picture just fine, but am not getting any audio to the Arc.

I'm guessing I need to run another cable from HDMI2 (ARC) on the TV back to a HDMI switch before the Arcana. Or maybe my HDMI cable between the TV and Arcana is not ARC compatible (if there is such a thing).

If I plug the Arcana into HDMI2 (ARC) on the TV, I am able to see and hear content from the TV tuners and apps. The problem arises when I switch the input source back to the BT youview box as my input source; I am able to see the pictures but I then lose all audio.

Any thoughts on this issue, please? I'm sure this is not a unique use case and was expecting to be able to play audio from the TV and my HDMI inputs through the Arc. Maybe it's just an Arcana configuration issue?

I guess I will also contact HDfury tech support on this matter.

Thanks,

Steve
 

Woolmeister

Standard Member
I've ordered a couple of new HDMI Arc compatible Premium Certified cables to see if they resolve this issue. I just have an ancient Sky branded cable between the Arcana and TV (which almost certainly doesn't support ARC). The Arcana user guide suggests this should all be possible:

How I can switch between TV ARC and HDMI INPUT?
For HDMI/ARC switching to work, when you use your TV remote and select APPS on TV, then ARCANA should switch to ARC(From TV) on the main OLED page, when you use your TV remote and select HDMI input where Arcana is connected, then Arcana OLED should report eARC HDMI INPUT. As long as this does not work correctly it means that ARC/CEC is not working as it should and you should try new update when they comes out and report back via our discord support server: here.
When TV sees a source it asks the source what it is. The source responds it is “audio system”. Then TV starts ARC and turns off its own TV speakers and allows TV remote volume control to pass as CEC commands. Now all audio either from tv apps or routed to TV via TV HDMI inputs will flow back via ARC. To enable HDMI audio from Arcana input then Arcana must be instructed to switch to its own input audio rather than use the ARC from TV. This happens with two ways: TV remote is used to select the input where Arcana is connected OR the Arcana input source issues routing change -message which happens when you press Menu button on ATV4K for example
When Arcana is rebooted this entire sequence is interrupted and all start from scratch and again the timing when SONOS Arc tells “audio system” vs when ATV4K source send its routine message is random. Arcana play no role in that, Arcana only listens to these commands and they come randomly after power up.
Sometimes TV is first and sometimes ATV4K is first so the startup selection by Arcana will be random
It is only in sequence if you never reboot Arcana.
If you see "eARC/ARC not active" on Arcana OLED > click Netflix or APPS on TV remote to enter ARC mode and then click HDMI (or wherever Arcana is) to have TV select HDMI input.
On some TVs you might need to set MENU > AUDIO > AUTO (instead of eARC ONLY by default since FW0.71)
 

Woolmeister

Standard Member
Or maybe my HDMI cable between the TV and Arcana is not ARC compatible (if there is such a thing).

So, the issue here was the HDMI cable between the Arcana and TV. Crappy old HDMI cable dating back from the days of those massive old Amstrad Sky boxes didn't support ARC, hence no audio being fed back over ARC from the TV to the Arcana. I also updated the Arcana firmware from 0.80 to 0.82.

I am now able to get full Dolby Atmos from the BT youview box on BT Sport Ultimate - via the Arcana - and Dolby 5.1 via the TV tuners (for broadcasts in DD+ 5.1) and the built-in apps.

All good. This device now does everything I needed it to.
 
Last edited:

Thrawnn

Novice Member
So, the issue here was the HDMI cable between the Arcana and TV. Crappy old HDMI cable dating back from the days of those massive old Amstrad Sky boxes didn't support ARC, hence no audio being fed back over ARC from the TV to the Arcana. I also updated the Arcana firmware from 0.80 to 0.82.

I am now able to get full Dolby Atmos from the BT youview box on BT Sport Ultimate - via the Arcana - and Dolby 5.1 via the TV tuners (for broadcasts in DD+ 5.1) and the built-in apps.

All good. This device now does everything I needed it to.
Hey! I was looking for a solution to the exact same problem you had. Glad to hear you got it fixed!
Can I ask what was your final set up, and if you changed any settings on the Arcana or TV? I'm a bit confused on how many HDMI cables you are using at the moment.
Thanks!
 

Woolmeister

Standard Member
Hi,

My set-up is very simple:
  1. BT YouView 4K (Rebadged Humax) box into HDMI IN on the Arcana.
  2. HDMI OUT on the Arcana to HDMI2 (ARC) on the Panasonic TX58DX902B TV (using new HDMI cable that supports ARC).
  3. eARC OUT on the Arcana to the SONOS Arc (using SONOS supplied HDMI cable).
I am using a total of three HDMI cables (including the HDMI cable supplied with the Arc).

I think my Arcana configuration is fairly standard. I may have modified the Audio Routing to be eARC only and I think I changed the TV Standby Mute to ON (otherwise sound will continue playing through your Arc until you turn off the source device). Will check and post my Arcana configuration here later on for you.

The key thing for me was upgrading the HDMI cable between the TV and the Arcana (to a newer cable that supported ARC) and also getting the CEC signals recognised by the Arcana. This seems to be critical to switch audio from the HDMI IN source and routing it back from the TV when using the TV's onboard tuners. Recommend you read and understand Page 29 onwards of the Arcana user guide:


Especially this bit:

If ARC is not working well yet out of the box, you can turn OFF option called TV ARC ROUTING in AUDIO menu that is present since Firmware FW0.71 or turn off TV ARC and/or CEC or not use TV ARC input till there is a next update available and you can retry.
There might be several different settings to try, example on Sony TVs: some got their displays ARC sound working after using the Sony CEC reset commands listed.
eARC ONLY option (default since FW0.71) might need to be changed to TV+Display or Auto for ARC/HDMI selection to work on some display, so make sure you tried that too.

Note also that I upgraded the Arcana firmware to 0.82. It's a very easy process. On Panasonic TVs, I believe you will also need to enable VIERA Link since this is the technology that enables CEC on these devices. This is the only setting that I think you will need to change on the TV (other brands call this something different).

Occasionally, my Arcana still gets a bit confused about how to process the sound source which results in no sound at all through the Arc. When this happens, I've found the following actions generally help:
  1. Re-initiate the handshake between the Arc and your TV in the SONOS app:
    1. Settings > System > {Room_where_your_Arc_is} > TV Setup
  2. Turn TV and HDMI inputs off and try again
  3. If all else fails, power cycle the Arcana
Hope this helps.

Furthermore, I've just attached my Arcana configuration, as promised.
 

Attachments

  • ARCANAEX.TXT
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Last edited:

Thrawnn

Novice Member
Hey Woolmeister,

Thank you so much man! Really appreciate the detailed explanation. I'll get to it as soon as I have some time off. Thanks again man! :)
 

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