Having a bathroom fitted...!

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by Arcam_boy, Jul 18, 2017.

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  1. Arcam_boy

    Arcam_boy
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    So the wifes been desperate for a new bathroom for a while and so we finally decide on what we wanted and ordered a lovely new suite which comprises of a large shower a combo toilet/sink unit in one of the built in type cabinets a new shower and towel radiator.

    Our bathrooms not huge 66" x 72" and the toilet/sink/shower will all be going where the old units were (give or take an inch or two)

    I guess we've gone in to it a little blind but have started looking at getting quotes to have the units fitted and the bathroom tiled. We potentially need some of the floor (chipboard flooring) replacing due to an old leak/where the bath used to be.

    I posted my request on mybuilder and only got 1 reply from a bloke who wanted £3600 just for labour and didn't even come to look at the job.

    We had a local chap out yesterday who wanted £3280 for labour and pipes/grout/adhesives etc and will skim the ceiling/paint it etc etc.

    I still think the quotes extortionate and so we've got a few more plumbers/bathroom fitters coming out in the next few days for a couple of more quotes.

    Am I being totally unreasonable and does this quote sound about right? I'd understand if we needed pipes re-routing all over the shop/electrics moving and all the malarky. I'm trying to comprehend in my head how much I'll actually be paying in labour. With the current quote its working out at least £400 a day labour as even though I appreciate the price of things I don't envisage a few bags of tile adhesive / grout / pipes etc will get to £1000??

    Maybe I'm just looking at it wrong, I don't know.....please enlighten me!
     
  2. rousetafarian

    rousetafarian
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    Is he also working as a Cisco network engineer?
     
  3. rousetafarian

    rousetafarian
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  4. jonna

    jonna
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    Bathroom refurbishments are expensive. If possible rather than someone doing the job lot, try and break the cost down by employing different tradesman.There are a lot of retired tradesmen or good DIY enthusiasts who could competently do most of the work without charging the earth.
    The main drawback is time.
     
  5. Wahreo

    Wahreo
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    A full Bathroom refit is going to be about 10 days for one man on a pretty basic refit.

    General materials- pipe/fittings/tile adhesive and grout/ply wood/plaster etc etc can vary between £500 to £800 (scary I know!)

    So let's take the local guys price of £3280 and deduct say £650 for his materials which leaves him with £2630 labour which equates to £263 per day.

    Being completely honest about it, if you have an established Bathroom business then £400 per day is easily achievable. The times are very very good at the moment.

    5+ years ago it was nowhere near that.
     
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  6. Wahreo

    Wahreo
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    If this helps, this is my current project which will take me 12 days on my own.

    I have a 30% mark up on all the meterials.

    No idea what the day rate equates to but it's reasonable money IMHO

    IMG_8742.PNG
     
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  7. Arcam_boy

    Arcam_boy
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    Thanks for the replies so far....

    @Wahreo apologies that I don't know, but are you a plumber/bathroom fitter, I'm guessing so?

    If so and just roughly how would this break down in to 10 days labour? At £263 a day I'd expect a good 8/9 hour day. Just so I can get it in my own head, as I say looking at this a little blindly I think!

    Just trying to comprehend in my head £32.50 an hour - certainly a lot more than I earn as a top level Police officer. Before we go on to tax etc this was a cash price so your guess is as good as mine if he'll lose 20% to the tax man however thats a different story! :confused::confused:
     
  8. Wahreo

    Wahreo
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    Yes I'm a Qualified Plumber with 25 years experience in the industry and 15 years running my own Bathroom Business.

    You can't really compare your hourly rate with someone who is running a business. I'd imagine you're an employee on the payroll whereas someone who is self employed/MD of a limited company has many more costs involved which gets him to his inflated hourly rate.

    Plus, there's no reason why someone who's a highly skilled tradesman shouldn't earn more than any other professional.

    Being completely honest though- the cost of the job isn't really your main concern- your biggest worry should be that he doesn't mess the job up.

    There are so many pros out there that don't do things properly it's untrue.
     
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  9. jonna

    jonna
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    Wahreos list could be slashed with a bit of homework. If people are willing to pay that sort of money for skilled labour then that's fine, I never have and never will.
    Buying your own bathroom suite and fittings would be the first thing I'd do. Work to your own budget.
     
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  10. IronGiant

    IronGiant
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    Don't forget that a lot of professionals won't be interested in finishing off after a "good" DIY enthusiast has "done" all their preparation for them. And not just because they can charge more for doing the prep themselves :D. And they may charge a premium to fit stuff you've supplied yourself "because your missus thought it looked nice in the showroom".

    Not that I'm promoting getting a pro in, I'd DIY the whole lot :)
     
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  11. Arcam_boy

    Arcam_boy
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    I'm not for one second saying a tradesman shouldn't earn a decent hourly rate I'm just trying to justify to myself basically paying someone double what I earn an hour!! I certainly wish I'd trained as a tradesman when I left the Navy rather than doing what I do now!

    I guess I'll have to see what the other quotes come in at if its going to be £3k + then I guess thats what I'll end up paying but its certainly an eye opener!!! :eek::eek::eek:
     
  12. busterbenny2001

    busterbenny2001
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    Totally agree with this, why pay a markup on any materials, shop around find exactly what you want buy all materials and just pay labour at least that way you know exactly what the labour costs are, our new build had 2 bathrooms and couple of toilets, we provided all materials and just paid labour.
     
  13. Arcam_boy

    Arcam_boy
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    The thing is I don't know exactly what bits he's going to need until he starts doing the work.

    After having a bathroom fitter round yesterday he told us we'd need to buy a riser kit for the shower tray as the one we'd ordered sat flat on the floor.

    I can't imagine he'd give me a list of all the parts I'd need as no doubt he'll be keen to supply the bits to get his mark up.

    I'm already considering removing the old suite/tiles myself and sorting out disposing of it which would hopefully save a few hundred quid??
     
  14. 27neth

    27neth
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    51757309773__A40F9298-2FEF-4655-887A-E610104689CB.JPG My mother got a new bathroom fitted. Everything ripped out inc floor and wall tiles. Concrete floor broke out to fit a shower tray, replastered, new shower, wall hung toilet etc, tiling and wall panels It took the plumber just over a week and cost about £1000 in labour. That also includes a new window which is getting fitted next week.
    John..
     
  15. jonna

    jonna
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    That's where your homework comes in :).
     
  16. 27neth

    27neth
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    I'm sorry to say if a tradesman said to me £1500 a week I would laugh and say no thanks.. p.s. I work as a tradesman myself.

    John..
     
  17. aVdub

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    We did the same with our wet room and only did so because we knew what we was buying, if on the other hand we didn't know then asking a professional to buy the materials and adding their % doesn't bother me at all.
     
  18. Arcam_boy

    Arcam_boy
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    Send him my way mate...sounds a lot more reasonable. I'd happily a decent tradesman £200 a day just in labour costs - I certainly wouldn't mind earning £1k a week!! :eek::eek:
     
  19. DIYlady

    DIYlady
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    We tend to diy but it is so, so easy to underestimate how long a full refit will take and all the little bits do add up.

    You can't compare a tradesman's rate with a salary. A tradesmen hAs books and quotes to do, needs to earn enough to cover holidays, death in service benefits, sickness and lulls in work availability.

    As a rule of thumb, if you double your salary then that's what you need to earn as self employed to have approximately the same level.
     
  20. 27neth

    27neth
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    A salary for a tradesman as I have ever known means you don't get anything for death in service and you don't get any sick pay.
    Holidays are the minimum legal amount they have to give you.
    Being self employed, yes you lose holiday pay but a accountant will claim that amount back for you.

    John.
     
  21. Thug

    Thug
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    8/9 hour day? Off a plumber? That's optimistic.

    I will tell you how it will go (in my experience).
    He will say he is going to turn up at 9 am and will turn up at 11am. He will go for lunch at 12 and either not come back (because he went to another job) or will come back at 2pm for an hour or 2 then go off to buy 'some meterials' and not come back.
    Rinse and repeat.

    If possible do as much as you can yourself. I mean, anyone can remove tiles or rip a bath/sink/toilet out. Just make sure you turn water off first.

    Even putting it back together is not that hard, as most use push fittings now. And tilng is easy too. After a row or 2 you will be used too it.

    Remove the flooring and see why you have got. You may need to remove some of it and if the you do then cut it out and replace it. Also if you are taking the flooring up you may be able to route the waste pipe for a lower level shower.
    As for painting, anyone who can use a pen can use a paintbrush.

    The job you are in, there will be no end of tradesmen, just ask around and there will always be someone wanting to earn an extra buck or 2.

    Try to reuse things if you can. Do you really need new taps or will your old ones do?

    Here is mine I did this year.
    Ok, it may not be 'professional', but we love it and I probably saved quite a few thousand on labour.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    I had a few comments on the tiling (and the shelf), but that's a price you pay when you save several thousands of pounds and one I can live with.
     
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    Last edited: Jul 18, 2017
  22. Wahreo

    Wahreo
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    As I have always said- I encourage DIYers, especially with Bathrooms. For every person that does a great job, there are dozens that don't which provides me with more remedial work.

    Most pros get Bathrooms wrong, DIYers are even worse.
     
  23. Wahreo

    Wahreo
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    Has that shower screen been fixed direct to the wall?
     
  24. Thug

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    How do you mean?
    I made sure that there was a batten going down at that point (which is in turn fastened to the wall) before the boards were put up, and fixed the mounting bracket to that. The screen pushes in to the bracket and has a wedge shaped rubber that forces in to hold it into place. The arm is also fitted into a batten that I placed in the correct place prior to the boards and tiling being put up.

    A bit easier to see on this photo.

    [​IMG]
     
  25. Thug

    Thug
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    My bathroom may not be perfect, but its a nice place to be and makes us think that we are in an expensive hotel.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2017
  26. Wahreo

    Wahreo
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    It looks great!

    I was just asking about the screen because it should be fixed to the tiles.
     
  27. Ruperts slippers

    Ruperts slippers
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    I think people just need to find a fitter they can get on with, trust, and within the budget they have in mind, then work together to make the project as smooth as possible, to achieve a finish they are happy with.

    On what people earn, it would be nice if people understood the difference between turnover, gross,operating costs, tax, NI, etc, for instance if my business gross is £30,000 that will leave a £10,000 net profit, which is a 33% margin, larger companies such as the one my dad was a manager at had a net profit margin of between 15-20%. So the overall picture has to be looked at, not the figure on the quote, "Look at that, they're earning more than me, that job is easy, blah, blah". :facepalm:
     
  28. Wahreo

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    Yes, it's very easy to think you know what someone is earning just by looking at their price.

    Very easy when you're an employee. Also, people don't see the countless hours not on site.

    I'm not having a pop at anyone, just saying that it's a common misconception that people can dissect your Quotation and think they know how much you're getting in your pocket out of each job.
     
  29. Thug

    Thug
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    Ah, I see. The tiles are butted right up against the screen bracket but not under it. It is still very stable though so not concerned at all

    I do agree with this having photographed a number of weddings (side line to my regular job) where I have spent possibly just as long (if not longer) on the PC editing photos as I have the full day shooting the wedding. People don't see this, they just think you turn up and press the shutter a few times and that is it, nice easy grand in your pocket. When in reality there is a lot of experience being put into it and thousands of pounds worth of gear being used (that had to be bought).

    Anyone and everyone can photograph a wedding, and everyone and anyone can do a bathroom conversion. They just wont be as good as a professional (although the could actually be better in some instances, depending on the 'professional').
     
  30. Arcam_boy

    Arcam_boy
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    @Thug that looks lovely mate :thumbsup: I'd certainly be happy with that bathroom!!!
     
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