Guide: HDR TVs for gamers - 2016 Edition

richard plumb

Distinguished Member
is the XD93 really 100ms in HDR mode? That would seem to kill it dead as an option if you do any kind of gaming on it at all?
 

cash

Active Member
Tried Deus Ex and the same thing happens, the info bar tells me I'm getting HDR but in the pic settings the backlight defaults to 14, however when I deactivate game mode the backlight shoots up to 20. I've attached some pics,

IMG_1478453243.608869.jpg

IMG_1478453259.059398.jpg

IMG_1478453269.693075.jpg
 

Dodgexander

Moderator
So apparently Sony and LG have released updates that reduce input lag. Still haven't seen any details of actual figures though.

With the LG Oleds being reduced and the Sony XD93 coming in to the frame for gamers vs the KS8000 Samsung this looks great news.
 

moosehound

Standard Member
So I've had an avforums account for YEARS and never really used it BUT Dodge's work on this has been so helpful.

I was looking at the Pani 700/750b but, despite currently having a lovely 47" Pani I didn't like to picture on these sets.

SO I went in to look at the KS7000 yet sadly, despite the picture being very nice, I just can't accommodate those stupid feet at either end of the screen. I have an 85cm wide bench and that needs to stay.

SO what to do.... I am currently looking at the Sammy KS8000, Sony X800D and the LG B6. I don't really want to spent stupid money but it looks like I will have to crack well into the £1K to get something I don't have to replace in 3 years.

Good input response (20 - 30's) is what I'm after, even in HDR and I know this is a massive grey area atm.

Also - what advice on size? We sit about 8 - 10 feet from the screen most of the time. The 47" seems fine so I wa looking at a 49"... but should I be looking bigger at 55"?

I think Black Friday sales will feature heavily in to my choices here too... Or I might even push this decision off until Easter when new sets are out and prices are adjusted....

Currently have PS4 Pro and X1 S for HDR/4K Content - the TV will also be used for movies and Netflix...

Thanks all and keep up the awesome work!
 
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Dodgexander

Moderator
Thanks, very kind words. You can fix your own stand to the VESA mounts at the back of the TV. I think someone on here did that buy buying a mount/stand off eBay. You use the same fixings to do it as if you were to wall mount.

As for size and that distance you ideally want a 65" to notice UHD vs HD but HDR can be benefited from even farther away. So I definitely wouldn't go for 49". Even at 55" it's likely you won't see an improvement from resolution alone on an UHD TV at that distance :(
 

Dodgexander

Moderator
Okay I've reformatted the OP and added some more info. There's been some ranking changes.

- LG still don't have a HDR game mode
- LG still hasn't fixed the high and fluctuating input lag in its OLEDs
- Sony has improved input lag on many of its TVs. That finally means TVs like the XD85 and XD93 don't have unusually high input lag. It's still on the higher side but acceptable.
- Philips TVs seem to be hidden gems if you're looking at value. The new 65" 7601 is at a crazy price for a FALD TV.
- I've relegated the OLEDs to the special mention section. High input lag is one thing, fluctuations is another although the B6 is still not as affected so may still have good lag with HDR.
 

MrPineapples

Standard Member
Hey Guys, great thread, Currys/PC World have reduced the SONY BRAVIA KD49XD8305BU to £699 for Black Friday.
SONY BRAVIA KD49XD8305BU Smart 4K Ultra HD HDR 49" LED TV

I'm seriously considering it for TV & playing PS4 (not pro) people seem to be a bit down on the Sony TV's here though. The sales guy in Curry's said it was excellent for gaming, was built with the PS4 in mind & the best at that size/price. He was trying to make a sale though.

What do you guys think, it's the top end of what I want to spend & much better than the 9yr old setup it's replacing. Should I be looking at anything else at this price point?
 

Dodgexander

Moderator
You really don't get the brightness or contrast with the Sony as you do from the more expensive Samsung KS TVs. So they are lacklustre with HDR. They use IPS panels which alone means they have poor black's and contrast vs the Samsung's.

But the KS Samsung is more expensive.

I personally wouldn't go for anything smaller than the Samsung for HDR. You aren't really getting much different from an SDR TV.
 

MrPineapples

Standard Member
hmm... okay, thanks for the feedback. It looks like the ks7000 might be the way to go, although it's a bit over budget & may be a hard sell with the missus who seems more concerned about the style of the stand than the tech specs... I might wait & see what happens in the new year, I don't replace my TV very often. Cheers :)
 

Pebb

Distinguished Member
What would be the best 4K HDR TV with a screen size of 40-50 inches for movies and games with a price point ranging between £400-£700. However if you guys have any good suggestions for between £400-£500, then that would be a bonus.

But in the end I am happy to spend up to £700 if it means better picture quality and lower input lag.
 

kingolympics

Active Member
Is input lag something I should worry about if I only intend to use the TV with a standard Xbox One? I don't have any plans to use 4K for a few years...but will buying a 4K tv cause input leg on my current Xbox?
 

Dodgexander

Moderator
Good news for LG C6, E6, G6 users, game mode has been added to be used with HDR in a recent firmware update in the US, it should arrive here soon.

Bad news for LG B6 owners, according to the article, the B6 isn't included in the update due to its different SOC.

Although the B6 doesn't necessarily have that bad input lag with UHD and HDR enabled vs the other models, it does oddly suffer with 1080p and HDR/4:4:4 chroma and even with UHD, the input lag still does fluctuate.

So good and bad news really. Will update the OP.
 

Lamboy

Member
FWIW I demoed the Sony 49XD8305BU and the picture quality especially regarding motion was far far better than the equivalent Sammys. The sammy brightness may be good for HDR spec requirements but it doesnt help it as a TV. Sony for me, more realistic for TV and probably good enough for console.
 

Dodgexander

Moderator
FWIW I demoed the Sony 49XD8305BU and the picture quality especially regarding motion was far far better than the equivalent Sammys. The sammy brightness may be good for HDR spec requirements but it doesnt help it as a TV. Sony for me, more realistic for TV and probably good enough for console.

I'm hesitant to recommend any TVs that use IPS panels due to the apparent lack of contrast vs VA type panels so that's the reason the Samsung KU TVs are ranked higher IMO. Yes motion blur on the Sony may be better but for HDR especially contrast is far more important. Not to mention the Samsungs have lower input lag.
 

Mark_a

Well-known Member
Do not 10-bit panels at the very least help reduce/eliminate colour banding compared to 8-bit?
 

Dodgexander

Moderator
Theres a few things to consider regarding 8bit vs 10bit. First, to even notice a difference between a 10bit and 8 bit colour gradient you have to view it very closely, even then its hard to notice if its 10 or 8bit. This is with a test pattern up close, not with normal images.

Secondly, there actually isn't a way of telling if a panel is actually 10 bit or not. All we (or any reviewer) can do is feed a 10 bit signal and see how well it displays it.

Thirdly the UHD Premium spec only dictates you need to accept a 10bit signal. Not display it.

Judging by tests on the rec2020 colour space it wouldn't surprise me if the only TV that actually used a 10bit panel was the Panasonic DX-902. The others just do a very good job of displaying 10bit on a 8bit panel using FRC. Are the manufactures going to tell us which have true 10 bit panels and which don't- I doubt it.

And to back this up even more, check out the results from various reviews of how much colour coverage a TV known to have an 8bit panel (eg Panasonic DX-750) and a TV that supposidly uses a 10 bit panel (eg Samsung KS7000) you'll notice the Samsung does not do significantly better with colour coverage at all.

Hopefully of course this will all change in 2017 and we will see both more true 10 bit displays and better quality 8bit ones too.

tltr don't get hung up with bit depth, certainly not yet anyway.
 

suki basi

Active Member
I have ordered the xd93 and I'm worried about the input lag, I only play SINGLE PLAYER games mostly shooters.
 

Dodgexander

Moderator
I have ordered the xd93 and I'm worried about the input lag, I only play SINGLE PLAYER games mostly shooters.

If you update to the latest version input lag has been improved dramatically. I think its around 50ms now which is above average nowadays but fine for most gamers.
 

suki basi

Active Member
If you update to the latest version input lag has been improved dramatically. I think its around 50ms now which is above average nowadays but fine for most gamers.
Thanks mate
 

Genetrik

Standard Member
So now that the big TV announcements of CES 2017 have occured, its time for me to make a decision and I don't think I want to wait any longer. Samsung QLEDs may be nice but I am not a Samsung fan. The E7 didn't seem to offer much more bang for the buck that would warrant the waiting time until spring. The Sony OLED and it's weird stand didn't convince me yet + again I don't want to wait any more.

I have been considering the 65ZD9 or the 65 E6 from LG previously. I am a bit of a Sony fanboy and am very happy with my 50W905. However I am huge gamer thus my use case is the following:

-80% PS4 (pro in future)
-15% Netflix
-5% TV (wife)

I have checked both TVs on site and also played some Playstation Pro on the ZD9 (Uncharted 4 + Ratched and Clank). The store LG promo material fascinated me frankly more than the promo material that Sony was showing (that LG opera scene looked breathtaking). I guess the word that people are using is "OLED had more pop".

My gaming test experience on the ZD9 was fine as I mostly wanted to get an idea if an input lag of 45 is going to bother me (after the super low one that apparently my W905 has). Felt good to me at least (not planning to play competitive multiplayer games. Focus are single player experiences). Picture was nice no question about it, but the 4K HDR (confirmed in the input that it was indeed one) didn’t really blow me away however. I like to believe that it would be different in my own home with better picture pre-sets.

Anyway I am currently favoring the ZD9 mostly because of one reason: most reviews have praised the amazing HDR picture quality due to the TV’s brightness. I have to yet witness that myself. I also read in 2 different user posts that, whenever both E6 an ZD9 were side by side, most people liked the ZD9’s picture better. In the store I checked they were too far apart sadly.

The price points for me locally here in Finland are the following:
Sony 65 ZD9: 4 699 EUR
LG 65 E6: 3 333 EUR

On paper the price difference should be major enough to forget about the ZD9. But I am in a lucky position to be able to ignore the price difference. So all I want is to have the most glorious 4K HDR picture for my Playstation Pro gaming experience. I am aware of the LG update that reduced the input lag, which is a minor plus point for the OLED I guess. But picture quality is my #1 priority.

Would you guys despite the big price difference recommend me the ZD9 or am I insane to pay so much more? Is the higher HDR brightness something I would even notice in my own home if I don't have a brighter TV right next to it? Or did you guys feel that the waiting game would be worthwhile for the CES 17 TV's? As far as I could tell only real reason to wait, would be the new HDMI standard but that sounds like 2019 to me so no go.
 

slliw

Active Member
Buy the E6. Im a gamer with currently over 800 hour of Destiny on XB1 under my belt. Im buying the e6 just waiting for a price drop
 

Dodgexander

Moderator
It comes down to what I've mentioned in the OP.
E6 if it value gaming with next to no motion blur
ZD9 if you want HDR to wow you the most with the increased brightness.

Although perhaps it would be wise given your budget to wait for the new models. I know you don't want to buy it really sounds like the E7 will give that extra brightness negating the difference of HDR between the two.
 

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