Goodfellas 4K Blu-ray / HDR - waste of money

Discussion in '4K Ultra HD Blu-rays' started by RayP, Aug 4, 2018.

  1. RayP

    RayP
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    I’ve just finished watching Goodfellas. The packaging said 4K with HDR. Someone must have messed up big time at the studio.

    The PQ was no better than BD and as for HDR, don’t make me laugh. It was non existent. I feel like I’ve been ripped off paying £20 for this. Given it was made in 1990 there’s absolutely no reason why the transfer should be so poor.

    Is there a website that shows what the quality of these 4K transfers are like so I can avoid making this sort of mistake again?
     
  2. Jim Di Griz

    Jim Di Griz
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    Hmmm. Perhaps you should check the other site's forum thread for this one. Most people there (including me) agree this is an upgrade. Black levels are correct here (not crushed like the blu-ray) and colour is better. HDR is well used too. Goodfellas is always going to be a grainy film, its never going to look shiny new. It doesnt need a shine box ;).
     
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  3. barnaby jones

    barnaby jones
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    You’re in the right place, just read up on titles here, every major title tends to get a thread. Like Jim says, Goodfellas came out in 1990, it’s never going to look like a blockbuster that came out 4 months ago.
     
  4. RayP

    RayP
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    I never watched the BD version so if this is an upgrade then god knows what that one must have been like.

    I’ll have to agree to disagree with you about HDR. It was hardly in evidence and if that is meant to be a big selling point then they failed miserably. I’ve seen films with HDR - Sicario and Life of Pi - and it was miles better.

    If grain is evident in the master then it probably isn’t suitable for 4K as the detail is lacking. At no time did it give me the wow factor as 4K HDR is meant to.

    @barnaby jones , watch Lawrence of Arabia on Sky Q if you have it. Filmed in 1960 and a superb transfer even on Sky. Why? 70mm film. That’s why. Studios should be shooting everything on that to retain the quality. They don’t because it’s expensive but they pay actors millions. Crazy.
     
  5. lgans316

    lgans316
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    Movies shot on a right budget around early 90s are hardly going to look better.
     
  6. YNWA1892

    YNWA1892

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    If you've never watched the Bluray how can you say the 4k isn't better, what are you comparing it to?

    I have both and the 4k is better picture quality wise and sound, maybe not as big an upgrade as say Bladerunner2049 but it's still an upgrade over the Bluray......
     
  7. RayP

    RayP
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    Then it should never have been selected for a 4K transfer. The quality just isn’t there.
    I’m comparing it to the other UHD disks I have all of which have very good PQ. It has no wow factor. Don’t you think that for £20 it should?
     
  8. JimboH

    JimboH
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    As seen above, you specifically were comparing it to BluRay and then admitted you haven't seen it.

    Another vote for it being a decent transfer.
     
  9. RayP

    RayP
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    Not quite as I haven’t seen the BD version. What I meant was the lack of fine detail made it look like I was watching the BD release, not a UHD one.
     
  10. xWill

    xWill
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    There is a review on Blu-ray.com where the 4K transfer gets 1 out of 5 for video quality.
     
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  11. RayP

    RayP
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    Thank you for pointing that out. It was one of the first attempts by WB with UHD/HDR and their inexperience shows.

    I won’t be buying any more UHD disks without first checking that site. Much appreciated. :thumbsup:
     
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  12. RayP

    RayP
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    @Blupetros , I’m curious why you marked my earlier post as funny. Care to explain?
     
  13. Jim Di Griz

    Jim Di Griz
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    Haha! You trust that?! Tell you what...read the Goodfellas thread on the forum there. And see what people who know what they are talking about say..
     
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  14. Swizz

    Swizz
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    Days upon it's release I picked up the UHD version of Goodfellas and I am satisfied with my purchase. Waiting for Casino & Scarface now.
     
  15. Blupetros

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  16. invisiblekid

    invisiblekid
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    It's only screen captures (some JPEG some PNG), so there's the arguments to be had over that, but at least it's shows what differences there are between disc releases and you can use your own eyes and not have to rely on someone else's.

    Shows off nicely the new UHD Predator disc compared to the abomination of the Blu Ray

    caps-a-holic.com
     
  17. YNWA1892

    YNWA1892

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    If you're basing the quality of goodfellas 4k to Sicario 4k then that is where you're going wrong. Two totally different films.

    Goodfellas is an upgrade on the Bluray disc whether it is as good as Sicario is irrelevant.
     
  18. RayP

    RayP
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    Thanks but what I really want are reviewer’s words as those images are of limited value depending on what you view them on.

    @Blupetros , so you think that an asking price of £20 doesn’t demand a top quality transfer. I despair.
     
  19. RayP

    RayP
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    Then the price should reflect the lack of quality. Both cost me the same. One studio makes the effort, the other can’t or won’t.
     
  20. invisiblekid

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    I’ll defend @RayP up to a point. Compared to say Blade Runner UHD or ET etc Goodfellas is not a stellar UHD.

    However it might also be that the film cannot be made to look any better. It could be the film stock or film nagative. Goodfellas to me was always going to be a problem to restore. I just don’t think the picture is there laying hidden waiting to be discovered like some other films

    Saying that, let’s take Predator UHD and a weird comparison to Hi-def music

    Some say Hi-def music is pointless as you cannot hear the extra data etc. I say I can definitely hear the higher quality track, but that’s not to say I can hear the stuff we are told the ear cannot. What I hear is a better sound/master and it’s usually the case of that music is the best it’s going to be.

    So in Predator case it’s not going to be up there with the best new UHD transfers, but compared to the last Blu Ray it’s a revelation. In the case of Goodfellas it might just they ran out of picture quality and it’s alao going the be the best it’s ever going to look.

    If we look at the HDR or lack there of, with a lack of my knowledge I think that also has to be based on the original film image. I don’t think you can just whack up the HDR levels on any film and it works miracles. If there is a lack of detail in the image sending up the highlights and darking the lows (I know, a very basic definition of HDR) it could make the image look worse. Same with adding the WCG. It might just not work very well.

    If there is better image to be had out of Goodfellas then it would take a collosal amount of time and money which plays into Rays issue in that some studios appearing to not making an effort. If they think they can make money out of the rerelease they will. They like everything/one else have to weigh up the cost vs profit.
     
  21. RayP

    RayP
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    Thanks @invisiblekid it looks to me that the bean counters decided they could make some more money out of this and didn’t need to put any work into a remaster gambling that the title would guarantee them sales. Surely with no special effects that would not have been that difficult.

    With so many dark scenes the decision to add HDR was also flawed. You live and learn and in future I shall read reviews very carefully before buying. This was bought in HMV rather than online. Next time I go I’ll take a list of titles with good 4K reviews.
     
  22. YNWA1892

    YNWA1892

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    Why should the price reflect the difference between a newer film and an older one remastered?

    It's not a case of can't or won't, Marvel films look amazing in 4k but the sound is dissapointing and they are the most expensive 4k titles on the market.

    Bluray didn't do this so there's no chance 4k will. I paid a tenner for goodfellas and even if I'd paid £20 I'd be happy with it as its an upgrade over the Bluray.

    There's some films that are amazing in Bluray and will only be a slight improvement on 4k but I won't expect them to be cheaper because of it. When you are buying the latest technology you pay extra.
     
  23. YNWA1892

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    The problem with reading reviews is that is just someones opinion which you may disagree with.

    Everyone's setup is different as is everyone's opinions :), I tend to buy films I like irrelevant of the review as there's been a few I've disagreed with.

    It's like the sheep on Facebook that post they're not going to watch a film because rotten tomatoes have rated it bad, until you see for yourself you'll not know if you disagree with the review :)

    Maybe you need to join a rental service and that way you can watch a film and decide if its a keeper, I think there is a couple of companies about that rent 4k.
     
  24. xWill

    xWill
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    I’ve not seen the 4k and was put off by the review although I love the film. Ray obviously wasn’t impressed, however after checking the other forum there are others like yourself who think otherwise (thanks for highlighting that). I might look at getting it now but only if I can get it for closer to £10.
     
  25. RayP

    RayP
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    They obvious put zero effort into the UHD version so why charge £20? Because there are always mugs who will pay it.

    If people refused to buy because of the price premium they would be forced to lower prices. With you happy to pay you’re playing into their hands. Saying the latest tech involves a premium only works if people cough up.

    I’ve considered renting but prefer Sky movies. I wait a bit longer but that doesn’t bother me. Films are subjective. One man’s meat is another’s poison. But I know when I’ve been fleeced and it won’t happen again.
     
  26. YNWA1892

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    How did they put zero effort in??

    It's better than the Bluray so they obviously did something, although as you've not watched the Bluray you wouldn't know this.

    When Bluray first came out it was more expensive than what 4k is now so not sure how people are mugs for buying them tbh.......
     
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  27. RayP

    RayP
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    @YNWA1892 , I’m sure the tech people weren’t happy with the results but the bean counters rule. If they’d asked themselves “is this a good enough improvement over the BD?” then the honest answer would have been no. You say the UHD is better than the BD but given it costs three times the price the PQ certainly isn’t three times better.

    I keep going back to Lawrence of Arabia as my reference UHD that doesn’t even need HDR because the master was so good. 58 years old and still a reference offering. Hell, it even looks good on Sky. The answer is to film at the highest res available and the rest takes care of itself. LoA was filmed at 70mm.

    I joined the DVD party late in 2000 and £10 was the going rate. It’s about time UHDs cost that but they won’t because it would kill the DVD and BD market. So they keep the prices high.
     
  28. Jim Di Griz

    Jim Di Griz
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    I would tell you to put the Blu-ray you got with it to do a comparison check but I imagine you have the UK 4K UHD right? In which case they supply the really old Blu-ray with it which is missing extras and will look poor next to the 4K UHD. But hey, don't take my word for it - go and check yourself.

    I can confirm that this 4K UHD not only looks better than that old Blu-ray, it also looks better than the remastered Blu-ray (supplied with USA, Australian 4K UHD's and more but NOT UK). The black levels on the Blu-ray are crushed for instance.

    You could go and read this in the thread I mentioned but I don't expect you will. I think Geoff is of the same opinion and hopefully he will write something here too.
     
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  29. RayP

    RayP
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    I’m running out of reasons to continue this debate. I’ve stated my views on this disk and won’t be swayed. Your suggesting I watch the blue-ray release so I can see how awful it is and then expect me to have a more positive view of the UHD version. No thanks.

    Nor am I reading through 67 pages on the other forum. I saw some posts to suggest I wasn’t alone in not rating it.

    Time to draw a line on this I think.
     
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  30. YNWA1892

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    £10 was going rate when you joined late, how much was it initially?

    4k is still a new market and with new release blurays still costing £15 how can they reduce uhd to £10 it wouldn't make any sense.

    Also with 4k having around 5% of the market its gonna be a long, long time before it kills any market.
     

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