1. Join Now

    AVForums.com uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Getting component video out of the BNCs of a DVD32FLR

Discussion in 'TAG McLaren Audio Owners' Forum' started by edward, May 12, 2005.

  1. edward

    edward
    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2003
    Messages:
    855
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    32
    Location:
    Reading
    Ratings:
    +26
    I’m connecting up my newly acquired DVD32FLR and have a few snags that I was hoping someone might be able to help with.

    I’ve connected the Tagtronic bus and can turn the FLR and AVP off in synch.
    I’ve got the T2T synch lead connected.
    I’ve got the digital audio connected and working
    I’ve connected the 3 component leads to the BNC connectors and I'm fairly confident they're connected to the AVP correctly, but…

    Try as I might I can’t get a video signal out of this machine. I could connect an S-video lead to it but that is a serious headache so here I am, asking if there is some way of doing this that does not involve my pulling this kit out and connecting in an s-video lead. Can I do this through the front panel? If I can, I be grateful for someone explaining how. I have this new toy but I can’t play with it yet – sniff.
     
  2. Stevesky

    Stevesky
    Active Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2004
    Messages:
    454
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Ratings:
    +13
    Greetings!

    Go into the AV192R setup screen (hopefully OSD should show), change setup->input options->Video Inputs->RGB/YPbPr/DVI Inputs->RGB1. Make sure signal type is set to "YPbPr Component".

    If you have a PSM installed in your DVD32DLR then connect via the phono sockets instead and use the PSM in your AV192R.

    Another trick to see if anything is working is shove the interlaced Y signal into the front panel composite input and see if a B&W pic comes out. If so then there is something coming out of your DVD32FLR.
     
  3. edward

    edward
    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2003
    Messages:
    855
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    32
    Location:
    Reading
    Ratings:
    +26
    Thanks Steve,

    I've got the inputs going into R3, G3 and B3. does this mean that I replace RGB1 with RGB3?

    Will I then be able to get a menu for the FLR up?
     
  4. GrahamMG

    GrahamMG
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2004
    Messages:
    4,449
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Location:
    UK
    Ratings:
    +192
    I suppose the AV192R input button is actually configured to the correct video port on the back?
    As you have BNC to Phono leads and phono to phono leads I'd consider RGB2 input to be the one if using the BNC/RCA leads? Of course if you put the RCA's in the DVD then BNC to RGB1 would be the one! More haste less speed? Remember don't kink them..... Mind you they will still work! Don't foget to enable the T2L for the DVD input as well....You know when you get that one right as the input says T2L after it in the AV's VFD.....
     
  5. GrahamMG

    GrahamMG
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2004
    Messages:
    4,449
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Location:
    UK
    Ratings:
    +192
    Actually, how was the Tosh connected? If it was the component output why not just pull the leads out of that and bung them in the DVD32FLR??????? Then play with your new leads later?
     
  6. edward

    edward
    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2003
    Messages:
    855
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    32
    Location:
    Reading
    Ratings:
    +26
    All the RGB/YPbPr/DVI Inputs are now set to YPbPr Component but it hasn’t made a difference. There is no PSM in this model. Sadly, I don’t have an available component cable without pulling stuff out, which I really want to avoid if possible.

    I’ve not selected any video ports on the back of the AV192R. I wasn’t aware of the need for this much less the facility to do it – even looked in the book. Please tell me more.

    Just discovered a wrinkle in previous details – I’m actually using the BNCs to go from the AVP/PSM to the scaler; the link from the FLR is RCA to RCA. So far there are no kinks in the cables that arrived this morning.

    The Tosh is currently out of the system. I’ll put it back and do some compares later (when I feel like pulling this lot to bits again). That said, the little 3-line status bar still tells me that video is DVD-S, presumably because that was the last source it could make sense of.
     
  7. Stevesky

    Stevesky
    Active Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2004
    Messages:
    454
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Ratings:
    +13
    Hi Edward,

    Aim your remote towards menu->change setup->input options->key assignments on remote->set ld/dvd/md keys. Change the video setting for the DVD key to the input that you've attached your DVD32R to. Once changed exit the menu, select a different input and then select DVD.
     
  8. edward

    edward
    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2003
    Messages:
    855
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    32
    Location:
    Reading
    Ratings:
    +26
    Thanks for your patience, gents.

    I’ve got CD and DVD keys both set to receive from DVD. The audio section seems OK on both. I’ve got s-video output coming in on the same line as I used to use for the Tosh and it works OK.

    Fundamentally, I think my problem comes down to not knowing how to associate the DVD key with video input coming from the RGB3 inputs rather than S-video.
     
  9. Stevesky

    Stevesky
    Active Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2004
    Messages:
    454
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Ratings:
    +13
    See my reply #7.
     
  10. edward

    edward
    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2003
    Messages:
    855
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    32
    Location:
    Reading
    Ratings:
    +26
    Thanks Steve.

    I dug deeper this time and...

    Had to contend with green and purple for a while there but was able to get up the set-up menu and went through it all. Colours are now all present.

    Its all working fime now but I need a darker room to really see what is going on. Having taken the morning off work, I don't think I'll get to that this evening - bit worrying because the FLR's debut to an assembled throng is tomorrow night.

    Somewhere around here I've got a duplicate set of cables that would allow me to hook the Tosh back in so I could see the difference. Another day...

    Now I can concentrate on work once more.

    Cheesey Grin.
     
  11. edward

    edward
    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2003
    Messages:
    855
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    32
    Location:
    Reading
    Ratings:
    +26
    The verdict is:
    Sound is definitely better – played a few familiar tracks and there was an improvement that by itself was probably worth the money. Played my current noisy test track, the shootout in Open Range in DTS, and flinched as bullets slammed into and splintered posts behind me – great stuff. Played The Incredibles for my kids and the subs nearly blew the doors off.

    I tool this opportunity to improve the video cabling and put the PSM into action. The image does seem a little brighter, which my old HD1 DLP chip appreciates.

    The Dwin PJ has its own outboard scaler so I was curious to see what would happen.
    The first thing I noticed was that the image seemed “softer” and with less contrast when PSM is enabled. I made some measurements with a camera using the TAG back-screen and OSD.
    PSM disabled required an exposure of 2 seconds.
    PSM enabled required an exposure of 1.5 seconds.

    So… more light overall but less contrast. I wonder how much of this is down to interaction between PSM and the scaler and how much is purely PSM characteristic.
    My current preference is for PSM disabled (puts tin hat on and waits for more of the sound of splintering wood behind him).

    Is there something I’m still not doing right or need to tweak?
     
  12. GrahamMG

    GrahamMG
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2004
    Messages:
    4,449
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Location:
    UK
    Ratings:
    +192
    I seriously doubt the PSM is inferior to the device within the scaler and in any case if the scaler senses a prog scan signal on its input it should not try to de-interlace it anyway (well anything half decent won't). Personally I think you have to calibrate the thing properly as they are obviously miles out at the moment... Do you have an Avia or DVE disk? Even using the DVD32FLR's inbuilt screens would be a good start... Much to do methinks....
     
  13. edward

    edward
    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2003
    Messages:
    855
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    32
    Location:
    Reading
    Ratings:
    +26
    Yes - I think the Avia will have to come back into service.

    I tried the stuff on the FLR menu but I was looking for soemthing to help me make the picture sharper, given that I'd already done what I could at the {J end.

    At the same time I had this little nagging problem - how come the sound is so good if there is any kind of problem picking the contents of the DVD up and spitting it at the processor? This is what got me looking at whether to PSM or not.

    Even without tuning and no PSM, the picture is better than I had before but that could be the move from s-video to component with my new exotic cables;-)

    I'll tinker and report back.
     
  14. Spen69

    Spen69
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Evening guys

    I really could do with an idiot's guide here, as I had a nightmare over the weekend trying to convince my shiny new FLR-PSM to output..... anything... :lease:

    First things first. The serial number and box state it's a PSM unit, and it has the DVI connector sticking out the back so I'm not going daft and it is a PSM unit.

    I read the manual, but just didn't get it. The player is producing RGB into my mate's plasma fine and dandy from the anologue(?) standard RCA outputs which I toggled on and off as I only have S-video capacity on my CRT back at home, but for love nor money could I get anything out of the PSM BNCs. Is there anyone out there able to give me the idiot guide, step by step setting it up, as I just didn't get the basics obviously.

    Firstly, does the PSM have to be "switched on" or enabled? I then need to know if it should be anywhere on the DVD32FLR's on-screen menu functions, as I didn't see it anywhere which worries me slightly. Surely it should state "here is your PSM control section" in big, idiot sized letters when i was wandering about in there.

    I then read the instructions which stated I had to set up the RGB command on the remote. To get this to work, do you need to press the shift key, or is is just the 7,4,2 sequence?

    Honestly guys, I've had years of effortless menu setting up from my AV32R, but this has me foxed. I even took it back home and went into the AV32R menu to have a look around, and of course it recognised the unit, but wouldn't let me pick any settings in the menu related to changing it from Y(b) whatever to RGB.

    I know you must get fed up with amatuers, but I'd gladly help set up an AV32R for anyone who could explain what basic step i have done wrong. :oops:

    Saying that, the "standard" RCA component output was amazing, but I'd appreciate getting the use out of the extra cash I've spent for the PSM when I eventually get my hands on a Plasma of my own, and don't want to wait until the warrenty is up to find out it's not me being daft, it is indeed the player... (I doubt it though!!! :suicide: )
     
  15. GrahamMG

    GrahamMG
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2004
    Messages:
    4,449
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Location:
    UK
    Ratings:
    +192
    The DVD manual states nicely how to change from Component to RGB on the PSM outputs (the BNC's), it is basically spelling out one or the other:-
    The output can only be changed when the player does NOT have a disk in it (I do not know if a RC5 code is available), so take disk out, close drawer, wait until it says "no disk", to select component just press the keys that correspond to COM (i.e. 2,6,6) to select RGB just press RGB (i.e. 742). Remember that the RGB output is actually RGsB (sync on green) the plasma will have to know this.......!!! Also the other thing to bear in mind is that the PSM can be selected to one of its three inputs (composite, s-video or the internal DVD output), pressing shift then 3 switches it to the DVD players output! Oh and I doubt you will get it to work with as standard CRT TV as most wouldn't have a clue what a prog scan signal is...but I assume your trying it with your mates plasma (is it a Panasonic???).
     
  16. Spen69

    Spen69
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Thanks for your patience as usual Graham. Spelling things out is often where the manuals let us beginners down. Honestly, when it was two channel I had this hifi thing cracked. Mind you, it's the same with pc's since they put the little green cables in the back of them, they've become a different animal and I get lost at page 1 of the book called "the children's ABC of networks"....

    This sounds a little more sinister as I understood to take the disc out, but typing 266 or 742 had absolutely no effect on the front panel display of the player, let alone getting a signal. I also understand that my standard CRT won't understand the input from the RGB output, let alone from the PSM, hence why I was trying it on my mate's plasma.

    Can you humour me one last time and explain the difference between COM and RGB please, as I thought component WAS red, green and blue. Understand that composite is basically all the signal mixed together with only two connections, s-video is something like the colours and the brightness (or contrast or mars bars, but it's something like that!) with more connections, 4 I think, and that component was the split colours with 6 connections, so why is RGB different (don't be too harsh, it's very early....) :lease:

    My mate's plasma is one of those cheap and cheerfull re-badged built in China in a backstreet garage by 10yr olds job, so I never thought to check it was synced on green or not as it was receiving the non-psm output crystal clear. Is the RGB output of the PSM and non-PSM differently synced, or should one mean the other plays?

    However, what I am thinking now is that I didn't try pressing shift then 3 to get the internal player output however (didn't quite get that bit, as I was getting annoyed by this point and wondering if I had to press shift or not to select RGB. I'll try that this coming weekend unless I can actually leave this place at a sensible time today (another tender due in again). I foolishly assumed that the player had been set up when it left the factory to allow idiots to plonk a disc in the tray and press play. This could very well be my problem.

    One final dumb question. The DVI output can't be played on a plasma can it? I ask as I have a DVi to normal VGA type converter lying about, and was wondering if this could be used with a standard VGA display lead to test the signal instead of the BNCs. No laughing please..... :D - it just looked like it had all the right number of connectors each side of it when I looked at it!

    Fingers crossed it's just the operator and not the unit which wouldn't be the first time. :suicide:

    Cheers - Spencer
     
  17. hoosterw

    hoosterw
    Standard Member

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2004
    Messages:
    133
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    in NL near Eindhoven
    Ratings:
    +0
    Maybe a very short but at least an answer: (maybe Graham can do better)

    COM = Component is Y (the full luminance information) and 2 colour difference signals mostly R-Y en B-Y. The G information is derived from the 2 difference signals.
    The difference signals are mostly called Pb en Pr but can appear in different forms as well.

    RGB is really 3 colour signals were the luminance is derived from the R, G en B information.

    Basically they are the same but the decoding path into the needed signals (Y, R, G and B) is different. In the end it all comes out the same. Why the one or the other is used is mostly historical and has relations to the two main worldly formats NTCS and PAL.

    The other questions I leave to another if you dont mind.

    Rgds Hans.
     
  18. GrahamMG

    GrahamMG
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2004
    Messages:
    4,449
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Location:
    UK
    Ratings:
    +192
    Sorry mate long day...here goes:-

    You don't get any front panel display of any confirmation when changing from Component to RGB with the PSM, the picture is the obvious give away! If your display was expecting RGB and you send component it usually looks very pink! Not sure it works at all the other way round (i.e. send component and display expects RGB). COM is just short for Component and the letters are simply spelt out on the remote (on the DVD selected mode!!!!) i.e. 2,6,6. RGB is just short for RED,GREEN, BLUE and is again just spelt out 7,4,2, it will stay in that mode for ever more (well until you do a full reset!) unless you change it again. All DVD32xxx are sent out configured as Component output I believe, at least 50% of people won't change it...... ;) As for the differences between the two output formats, Hans has covered that really and frankly it doesn't matter that much as long as you feed your display what it wants...... Composite is the lowest signal quality and is basically everything down one cable, S-Video has separated signals (lumanance and chromanance) sent down two co-ax cables, Component has the signal split into three colour difference/lumanance signals (three co-ax cables) and RGB is either 3,4, or 5 co-ax cables. 3 cables for R (red), Gs (Green with sync), B (blue), 4 cables for RGBS (S= separate sync) (SKY boxes output this and is what most RGB scarts output), and 5 cables RGBHV (separate Horizontal and Vertical sync) which most analogue PC VGA ports output.

    Getting back to the plot, the DVD32 outputs either Component or RGsB, easy as it only has three connections so it can only ever be these ;) Your display has to be set to receive either of these (look in the manual), if it can't then it won't work without further bodge boxes to further "convert" the signal...... Time for a read of your mates plasma manual...... You also need to check that the plasma will accept a Prog scan signal (de-interlaced) some older designs don't......Commonly listed as 576p for a PAL DVD output (576 lines and "p" for progressive). The non PSM triple RCA output of the DVD32 is strictly component only (and interlaced), as that apparently works into your mates screen using the same connections at the plasma end and connecting up the BNC's at the DVD32 end and configuring the DVD to output component should result in a picture IF the display accepts a prog scan picture.......

    You DONT press shift for changing COMponent to RGB but you do press shift to select the PSM INPUT, remember with a PSM fitted one composite and one s-video socket are now inputs NOT outputs, just look at the back of the unit, theyare labelled assuming you have the new white sticky label on the back........ Changing the input will be acknowledged on the DVD32's display, try it..... press shift, 1 (thats "shift" then 1 not "shift" plus 1), the display will say PSM with composite underneath, press shift then 2, the display will say PSM with s-video underneath, press shift then 3 and you just get "no disk", the last mode is what you want for DVD output.....

    The DVI output can be fed directly to a suitable plasma (newer ones and not Panasonics......) but the same applies with the colour space selection (COM vs RGB), I'd select RGB always (the 7,4,2 bit), I've not seen anyone try it any other way...... You can't, I believe, use a DVI/VGA convertor as the DVI output on the DVD32 is digital only (someone may put me right on that one), I've never used the DVI PSM output apart from proving to many people that the component output into a VSM (TAG scaler) gives excellent results.....and keeps the OSD......
    If all this fails to get a picture, you can always bring it round and I'll prove it one way or the other for you, or of course get IAG service to test it out.... Frankly you need someone with a DVD32 already working in their setup as some displays don't work with it (very very few these days) and that isn't the PSM's fault.......
     
  19. Spen69

    Spen69
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Graham

    Tell me about the long days mate, started at 5am and crawled home after midnight - the wife was really not happy..... and back again at 7 to get this tender done. It had better be worth it :mad:

    Thanks for the needed idiot's guide. I basically think it can only be one of two issues, either the plasma doesn't accept prog scan as it's a re-badged old unit, or the DVD player has the PSM set to the s-video or component inputs, not the internal player. With a bit of luck, it is the later and I will ease my troubled mind about the unit's pedigree and build, but if not, I'll be trawling through my mate's bin for th instruction manual to his display as he's bound to have chucked it away. He's a complete technophobe - the day he bought it, he wanted to get an old wire coat hanger to ask me where to put the tv aerial to wind me up, as he was the first mate to ever to get something I wanted before me..... :devil:

    I am 99% sure I get the RGB/COM thing now, so thanks for the help on that Hans. So the other thingy in the s-video signal is luminence and not mars bars then.... right, I think I get that too now! :D

    I'll let you know how I get on over the weekend, and thanks again :thumbsup:

    Spencer
     

Share This Page

Loading...