Free beer for everyone

Discussion in 'Subwoofers' started by Member 96948, Apr 29, 2007.

  1. Member 96948

    Member 96948
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    There's been some fairly heated discussions lately about the relative merits of various subs. No change there then.

    Most of it has stemmed from the very nature of forums, where individuals of widely differing experience, all contribute their thoughts. OP wants opinion on Sub A. Correspondant X has heard Sub A and Sub B. Correspondant Y has heard Sub A and sub C. Correspondant Z has heard Subs B & C and extrapolates performance of Sub A from X and Ys experience. Z posts his thoughts on Sub A in a later thread and it all kicks off. We've all done it. I know I have.

    Of course, these opinions, even on the same sub can differ wildly between two owners because subs, being as they are, very room/positioning dependent.

    Online objective tests are a fantastic resource. They can let you weed out the also-rans in an instant. But even so, where two subs show similar results, you frequently see statements like "yeah, but once you get it in a room, then it'll show the difference. Take the Velo DDs. They generally show massive compression below 30Hz at high volumes, but they're renowned deep bass monsters. RELs with their humped response (with the smaller ones at any rate) measure poorly and even the bigguns don't go very loud, but their owners don't recognise this description based on their experience of living with one.

    It seems, that in the interest of balance, it would be good to do some in room comparisons. I'll stop short of calling it a shootout, but I can't think of another name for it.

    I'd just like to canvass some opinion as to whether anybody thinks it's worth it, possible, or even desirable.

    FWIW, my thoughts are thus:

    It's got to be done in one room and one room only. This means someone would have to be willing to host it. I'd be happy to, as it's my suggestion and there's any number of inducements to keep Mrs russ.will out of the way, with a bit of notice. I'm also quite happy to put people up if they think it's worth the journey.

    The test would be based on AV use only. Reference level, 80Hz crossover, low level input only and EQ'd to the room. I know that may not suit some people, but these things take time and that modus operandi is right bang down the middle of the road and suits the vast majority on this forum.

    Does there need to be some sort of measurement and if so how in depth? A basic in room response curve (pre & post EQ) would seem to be adequate to my mind. There's a plethora of objective measurement available elsewhere, I think it may be more interesting to see how subs perform in practice if the difference is audible.

    Anyhoo, I'd just thought I'd float the idea to see if anyone else thinks it's worth it. I already have one interested party, so I guess that's the PB-12/Ultra sorted.

    Russell
     
  2. sdb123

    sdb123
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    Hi Russ,

    I'd be happy to bring my tiddler, sorry SB12Plus, along to be left trailing in the wake of the other participants!

    Steve :)
     
  3. stevefish69

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    I'd be happy to bring along my 20-39PC+ or PC13-Ultra if it's turned up by date it's arranged :thumbsup:
     
  4. ttree sound

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    I think its a brilliant idea. :thumbsup: At least this sort of test would be much closer to real world use as opposed to testing subs in huge car parks. Does anyone ever listen to subs outside? :rolleyes:
     
  5. AngelEyes

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    Can I make a somewhat controversial suggestion? :blush:

    I think in the interests of creating a debate for all users of the subwoofer forum we should endeavour to avoid the fanboys favourites and try an entice some of the other brands that don't 'hit the headlines' quite as much around here.

    As much as I enjoy my sub I would rather spend the time listening to Rel, MJ, M&K, Velodyne, B&W etc.

    Maybe I am bias *cough* but I bet you get loads of offers from SVS owners and if you didn't have a BK yourself more of the same. We all at least 'think' we know how good they are so can we listen to some others and learn something new?

    Just a thought ;)

    Adam
     
  6. Member 96948

    Member 96948
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    That is exactly what I would like to happen.:smashin:

    As a thought and this depends entirely on any interest generated, it'd be good to say get an SB12, MA RSW12, MJ Ref 200, B&W ASW675, BK XLS-200 at the same time. Then maybe do the big boxes another.

    In other words, keep the subs at any one time comparable with each other. People with any of the above for instance, wouldn't have considered one of the bigguns or visa versa.

    Russell
     
  7. IronGiant

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    That's a fair point Adam, I'll also be controversial and wonder whether testing an assortment of subs in a particular room will tell you more than which sub is best suited to that room (EQ not withstanding). It's still a good idea though :thumbsup: and Russel's rather nice HC room would be a good starting point.

    Dave
     
  8. Member 96948

    Member 96948
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    Good points also, but where else do you listen to a sub? At 6x4m (approx) with a 2.4m ceiling, my room is about as average as it gets. Certainly more average than a playing field.:) I'd reckon the EQ will make it less room dependent however. That's one of my original points - with room gain factored in, and the sub EQ'd, how far apart are the subs that struggle in the open air.

    Russell
     
  9. AngelEyes

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    Yes, I was thinking along the same lines. There are just too many subs to give them a good workout in a couple of days.

    Starting with the smaller ones would probably benefit more people who are sub-less or new to the forum as it is a more likely purchase point... at least I would have thought so.

    Might I suggest you ask some kind moderator, these do exist I have heard rumour... to change the title to something that will catch the eye of more people or maybe start a new thread once we have nailed the format here?

    Adam
     
  10. Howard0000

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    I'm guessing there's about 20 other members who will be able to bring a Monolith ;) So I won't need to do that, but I'd be interested in coming along out of interest?

    Cambridge isn't a million miles away. Well, about 95, so under 2 hours' drive.

    I think it's a good idea, it'll prove which subs are actually "better", so to speak, if theyr'e tested in a fairly average sized/furnished room :)
     
  11. Ian J

    Ian J
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    Done :D
     
  12. Toasty

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    Certainly worked on me ;)
     
  13. AngelEyes

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    Classic;)

    Although I hear Russell only has CastlemaineXXXX :thumbsdow
     
  14. suniil

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    i don't have a car.. otherwise i could bring PC+ 25-31 & PB12+/2 (ohh yes and a 12.2 version 12 inch driver too)

    :)
     
  15. Member 96948

    Member 96948
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    Rotten sod.

    Russell
     
  16. Member 96948

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    Right, it woul seem a plan is forming Now we need to blag forumites into bringing their subs. SB-12 done. XLS-200 I'll try and blag, which leave the MA & B&W.

    Russell
     
  17. AngelEyes

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    Any other contenders? I am not familiar with this price point ~£300 is it?

    Adam
     
  18. tony @ suffolk

    tony @ suffolk
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    I think this is a really, really good idea!

    I know you're only going to do it with smaller subs at the moment, but I'd be happy to bring along one of my Veloyne DD15s when the time comes.

    I wasn't interested in the free beer thing. It didn't lure me to this thread at all! No siree! Not me! Not in the slightest way...
     
  19. AngelEyes

    AngelEyes
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    now that I would like to hear :smashin:
     
  20. paulst10

    paulst10
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    sounds like it could be long weekend :)

    why do i have to live so far away ?? :(
     
  21. Member 96948

    Member 96948
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    You don't. I commute to Braintree every day.:)

    Russell
     
  22. Member 96948

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    That's a stroke of luck. Judging by your avatar, you'd drink your fair share and then some.:eek:

    Your offer is very much appreciated. It would appear that the big subs are going to be easier to get hold of, which seems a bit odd.

    @Angel Eyes - I'm thinking of small subs full stop. Price not an issue, the idea being to see what the extra money really buys given that they're all a similar size. Y'know, what does an SB-12 give you that an XLS-200 doesn't.
     
  23. AngelEyes

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    Sounds good to me... and THEN we test the bigguns :devil:
     
  24. Howard0000

    Howard0000
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    Yeah :devil:
     
  25. paulst10

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    are you anywhere near cambridge FC russell ?? as thats about 1h30mins ish away by car
     
  26. Member 96948

    Member 96948
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    No, I'm in a village called Cottenham, just north of the city. It's easier to get to. Where are you?

    Russell
     
  27. paulst10

    paulst10
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    im on canvey island mate

    edit: may even be able to get access to my old B&W PV1
     
  28. Scott_Mac

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    Can someone please get a Velodyne SPL-800R along too as it could solve my crisis :)
     
  29. Crustyloafer

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    It's a shame it is way too far for me to travel, I would have loved to have brought my REL Stentor 3 along with its puny 10" driver for comparison.
     
  30. Scott_Mac

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    Quitter...

    Catch the Airport Express for £5 return from outside Waverley Station

    Fly to Brum for £45 return on BA/FlyBE and i'll pick you up :)
     

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