Ford dealer put petrol in brand new Fusion 1.6 diesel engine!

Icm76

Novice Member
Hi,

Ford dealer today filled up a brand new 1.6 diesel Fusion with petrol just before it was due to be collected (by my mother, it's her new car). The petrol station was apparently close by, but the car was driven back to the dealer anyway - I don't know if that means 100 yards or 500 yards.

However it's my understanding that modern diesels can be severely damaged the instant petrol (a solvent) comes in contact with certain engine parts that would normally be lubricated by diesel. As such after a misfuel the key should not even be put in the ignition let alone turning the engine over.

The Ford dealer apparently got the car into the workshop straight away, drained the tank & changed the filters (I assume flushed the pipes & engine too, but I haven't been told this) They reckon it will now be fine & no damage will have been caused and my mother drove the car away having waited all day for it to be sorted.

I'm really concerned that potentially damage has been done & it's just wishful thinking or hopeful assumption that the car is completely unharmed. I think my mother should actually reject this car & not take any risks since it's entirely the Ford dealers fault.

Does anyone have any advice or experience of similar mistakes? I'm mostly worried that even if the car seems fine now in the long term problems may materialise - even if it's fixable under warranty later on I think that could be more hassle than just demanding an immediate replacement now.

Thanks for any help/advice/links to technical guides


UPDATE: Thanks to all for the replies so far :thumbsup:

The salesman at the dealership has taken full responsibility and is putting in writing exactly what happened with a complete breakdown of the action taken to put it right.

I will push the dealer anyway to extend the warranty on the engine & related fuel system parts as condition of acceptance & compensation.

I also intend to contact Ford directly & get them to provide a proper engineers report on all the potential consequences of putting petrol into a Duratorq diesel and get them to verify that the dealer has taken the complete required action to fix this. I want them to specifically outline any issues that may affect long term engine life, economy, smoothness etc.

We've spoken to a couple of independent mechanics & a family member who works at a different car dealership. Their advice seems pretty consistent - if there is a problem it's going to show up soon, almost certainly within 1000 miles and therefore if the Ford dealer has taken the correct action it should be OK. Apparently this type of misfuel is a very common problem.

Personally I would still not be happy accepting the car, but it's not my choice so for now the car is being kept & we'll run it for a few days and see how it performs. As noted below it can still be rejected & returned for a full refund if anything does goes wrong.

Obviously it's a really stressful situation & possibly having to wait another 8 weeks for a new car to be built is distressing, so I will insist on a courtesy car if we do need to reject this one.
 

Adam_uk

Active Member
Yes- I'd reject the car.

What a muppet
 

co55ie

Novice Member
I doubt any real serious damage has been done and the car is in new so will be covered under warranty.

Personally I would have rejected the car though and sent the Garage a bill for wasting my time. You can still reject the car and I still would.

I tried to buy a new Ford once and when I went to collect it it had a large dent in the rear bumper and the rubber seals etc were covered in what looked like moss :D(obvioulsy the thing had been stood in a field for a very long time) I rejected it and asked for a refund which after some argueing I got .

Its a shame as Ford make some great cars which are let down by the shambolic dealer network having said that neither Audi or BMW seem to be much better from my experiences.
 

pjclark1

Novice Member
30% petrol may be mixed in with diesel in cold climates to prevent waxing,
So it would be unlikely that the mix that got to the engine would do any real harm. Diesel is heavier then petrol, so the petrol may never have got to the engine anyway and just floated on top of the diesel.

Modern low sulphur diesel contains a solvent anyway, so a new car shouldn't have any rubber seals in the fuel system to damage.
 

quietlife

Active Member
Common rail diesels and petrol DO NOT mix! Search the net and you'll find some real horror stories. Stick a post up on the honest john forum, you'll get an expert answer.
 

hornydragon

Well-known Member
While it may be fine let the dealer take the risk, at the very elast have something in writing from FORD that they wil honour warranty. I would Reject it and insist on a free courtsey car while a replacement is sourced.
 

majorstare

Active Member
I would contact the dealer and FORD, stating you want a written document - that in the event of any engine/fuel/CAT failure due to there incompetance you will be fully covered for any labour/parts or recovery.
If they decline, contact FORD and refuse the vehicle.
 

Icm76

Novice Member
30% petrol may be mixed in with diesel in cold climates to prevent waxing
Common rail diesels and petrol DO NOT mix! Search the net and you'll find some real horror stories. Stick a post up on the honest john forum, you'll get an expert answer.
Quietlife is spot on, this is why my gut reaction was to reject the car immediately! I've seen the advice of putting a little petrol in diesel before, I don't know if it really works with older more agricultural engines but it's not something I would like to take a chance on with a common rail diesel - especially as manufacturers, the AA, RAC & other motoring advice is so strongly against it (they all say don't even put the key in the ignition, just get it towed)

Diesel is heavier then petrol, so the petrol may never have got to the engine anyway and just floated on top of the diesel.
Modern low sulphur diesel contains a solvent anyway, so a new car shouldn't have any rubber seals in the fuel system to damage.
I'd hope this is the case, but there is always that doubt that even if things appear to be fine now it may not be. I know that's a bit paranoid, but hey it's £10K+ so I'd want to be absolutely 100% happy.

While it may be fine let the dealer take the risk, at the very elast have something in writing from FORD that they wil honour warranty. I would Reject it and insist on a free courtsey car while a replacement is sourced.
I would contact the dealer and FORD, stating you want a written document - that in the event of any engine/fuel/CAT failure due to there incompetance you will be fully covered for any labour/parts or recovery.
If they decline, contact FORD and refuse the vehicle.
This is pretty much the action we're taking to begin with and since the fault & liability has been acknowleged I think it's going to be much easier to reject the car later if necessary.

Its a shame as Ford make some great cars which are let down by the shambolic dealer network having said that neither Audi or BMW seem to be much better from my experiences.
Agreed, you just can't avoid human error. This type of thing can happen to anyone, but even so a car dealer should know better. How many different cars do they fuel each day? :rolleyes:

In this case, because my uncle worked for Ford for most of his life the family has been buying Ford cars from the same dealer for many years. I think the salesman is very keen to make things right because they could lose a lot of future sales if they don't.
 
ok on this issue take my word as gospel!

I work quite high in ford crc/tech team and liase with waranty and make decisions daily on wht ford will nd won't pay for.

under no circumstance will ford pay for anything that's failed and could of been caused by fuel contamination of any sort inc incorrect fuel.

even if the ford dealership done this as ford motorcompany whom pays for warranty etc is independent from any dealer, ford will say see your dealer.

so if in the future injectors fail, and ford want a diagnosis from bosche they will tell diesel has run threw it, fuel pump fails, anything relating to fuel system will be dismissed by warranty.

reject it to your dealer, all rejections have to be to point of sale, ford can decide to buy that car back from the dealership or give them money to fix up and cover any losses, but on this one theyl be on there own.

DO NOT EXCEPT THIS CAR

yes it may b fine and not caused damage however the fact it happened will put fuel system warranty on the line
 
oh and the dealer cannot extend the ford manafacturers warranty.

and if he has done an engine flush that too will effect any warranty claims on the engine as ford motorcompany do not recommend any engine flushes or additives added to fuel or oil.

however dealerships do and ford can't understand why and have sent out clear documents advising them not too.
 
J

jackal

Guest
Seriously ICM, tell your mother not to accept this car and reject it.

It could prove to be a world of heartache for you and your family. The dealer has made a mistake - as it stands you have every right to reject the car.

Don't fall for the dealers sweetalk - of course they will try each and every way to try and get you to accept - don't buy it.

Put your trust in DAddyK who from my point of view is in a position to tell you the truth.

As to the above poster Pjclark who said 30% petrol in a modern diesel is OK - frankly don't give rubbish advice unless you really know what you are talking about.

The manual for my Merc ML320Cdi has strict instructions on what to do if petrol is introduced to the common rail diesel engine - you really are quite wrong Pjclark and I find what you have posted quite annoying TBH.
 

BrianC

Novice Member
I'd reject the car and the sooner the better. The longer you have the car the harder it is to do so.

However my wife put petrol in her modern diesel (C4 with the 2.0 146 BHP engine) nearly a year ago and its been fine ever since. Speaking to the garage who cleaned out the engine - and thats all they do day in day out - they say that they have never had a problem post flush. I'd still insist on the dealer swapping the car, better safe than sorry.
 

quietlife

Active Member
Take it straight back to the dealer and leave it there. If you keep it, you won't get rid of it.

Imagine in 12 months time. Fuel system failure..."Oh sir. It was OK after the original incident. YOU must have put petrol in it recently"

How could you ever prove you haven't!
 

co55ie

Novice Member
Take it straight back to the dealer and leave it there. If you keep it, you won't get rid of it.

Imagine in 12 months time. Fuel system failure..."Oh sir. It was OK after the original incident. YOU must have put petrol in it recently"

How could you ever prove you haven't!
This is very true.

Write a short letter stating your rejecting the car and the reasons why. Ask for a similar or higher spec replacement or a full refund if the dealer is unable to provide a replacement.

Take the car with the letter to the dealer ,park the car at the dealers and hand the keys and letter to the reception then see if you can sort the matter out with someone there but be prepared to leave without the car if you cant, but under no circumstances no matter what promises are made take the car with you again, as you are accepting it legally and it will make things much harder at a later dateif you need to go down the legal route.
 
basically what im saying is, yes it may be fine now, and it may not of caused any damage!

however if an associated part failed for another reason!, or your engine failed for some other reason the fact that an engine flush has taken place is reason the wraanty would be void on that repair.

if your injectors fail in 30k miles time and we ask for a bosch report they may well come back highlighting it shows signs of fuel contamination of any sort ford will not cover you.


fords warranty does not cover any accidental damage, including that caused by a silly ford dealer,

and no letter from a cheasy sales man saying "i here swear tipped the sweet stuff when i should be tipping the dirty stuff in the tank" will unvoid a warranty claim.

dealership will have to handle rejection, ford will not assist them with any costs in this,

usually if what the customer thinks is ford buying back the vehicle ford actually agree to buy it back from dealer at an agreed value, or allow the dealer to fix under warranty, resell and give them upto £2000 to cover any losses from selling it as used etc.

if the dealer says we have to see if ford will buy it back hes lying.

inform him you mean the "assisted buy back scheme"

in which ford assist the dealership in buying back the vehicle, he may then know he cant pul wool over your eyes.


the only reason i am recomending you reject is in case one of those parts fail in the future, yes it may not be down to this incident but it will put your warranty at serious risk!
and its not your fault!

as for an exchange on an instock vehicle
 

Icm76

Novice Member
if your injectors fail in 30k miles time and we ask for a bosch report they may well come back highlighting it shows signs of fuel contamination of any sort ford will not cover you...

...it may not be down to this incident but it will put your warranty at serious risk!
and its not your fault!

Thanks - you're just reinforcing what I think about the situation.

A little extra info:

According to the service manager at the dealer they changed the fuel filters, pulled out old fuel, refilled with diesel, then drained again, then refilled proper. The same draining, refilling process would have been done with the fuel pump.

This car was bought under the Ford Privilege scheme & we spent a bit of time researching which car to get, so any replacement now is going to have to be brand new, same model, same colour, same trim - basically a new one to order (pain in the rear and if it was only up to me that's what would be happening already...)


I plan on talking to Ford next & get something official from them explaining their position (which I expect to be pretty much as you've already explained Daddy K) Hopefully then my mother will agree to reject the car, if not I'm going to have to come up with something extra from the dealer e.g. they agree to warranty the car themselves/pay for any costs that result later on (like your fuel injectors failing at 30K example)
 
id get in writing from delaer principle or service manager stating any repairs required to the fuel system that ford motor company will not cover as a possible result of fuel contamination they will repair at their cost.
 

co55ie

Novice Member
I really wouldnt hang around making a decision as time is of the essence, the longer you keep the car the harder resolving the matter can become.

Your mother allready accepted a resolution by taking the car in the first place.
 

Greg Hook

Moderator & Reviewer
Just reject it.

As the Ford guy said, Ford will not honour any warranty for fuel contamination. So your warranty will be with the dealership.

What happens if they go out of business next year? If your engine fails you will be left with a huge bill that you have to cover.

Not worth the hassle IMO. Just reject the car, if that is possible now.
 

Icm76

Novice Member
Spoke to Ford CRC directly & they confirmed that the warranty will be unaffected provided that we get in writing:

* that the incident occured & was the fault of the dealer
* a complete description of the corrective action taken
* a statement that the warranty is unaffected

This obviously doesn't mean the warranty is going to cover any failures due to the misfuel (as that wouldn't be under warranty anyway) so we will also get in writing that the dealer will cover all costs relating to this should a problem arise at any point in the future. I will raise the point about them potentially trying to get out of later on by saying someone else misfuelled it since the 1st incident & if we aren't satisfied then I think I can persuade my mother to give up & reject it entirely.

I'll make sure this is all taken up with the senior at the dealership head office so it's on file there & at the local branch.

I take the points raised about rejecting the car now (& rejecting now is easier than doing it later) However I think acceptance is conditional, and the dealer has given assurances that the car is 100% as it should be. We will now make it clear in writing that acceptance is conditional and that if the car does fail we are reserving all our rights under the Sale of Goods Act & will reject it if necessary. I think as the dealer has made one attempt to remedy the situation it will be very easy to reject the car within the first few thousand miles (or whatever is a reasonable time) should a fault develop.

I believe there is quite a lot of precedent for people getting replacements or refunds with problem vehicles quite a long time after delivery.


Greg - that's a good point about the dealer going out of business, I'll see whether they can provide a 3rd party insurance policy to cover the parts relating to the fuel system (I'd rather not be doing this, as I said previously I'd prefer just to reject it, but's not my car & not my choice)
 

pjclark1

Novice Member
Put your trust in DAddyK who from my point of view is in a position to tell you the truth.
Lack of literacy may affect a persons credibility.

As to the above poster Pjclark who said 30% petrol in a modern diesel is OK - frankly don't give rubbish advice unless you really know what you are talking about.
I was just pointing out fairly common cold weather advice found in some German Mercedes diesel car handbooks. I don't believe the word "modern" appeared in my post.

I rather suspect the OPs parent driving the car away from the dealer may have made any subsequent advice given in this thread (good or bad) completely pointless.
 
Ford CRC cannot state warranty will not be effected!
only ford warranty can!

was a case set up for yourself?
as no one in crc is in a position to state your warranty will not be effected!

however i have spoken to the warranty assesor and in simple and short terms states :

that if the dealers have turned the engine over they should replace all the fuel pipes/lines and injector pipes etc as the petrol would of stripped the lubrication in these parts.

this will not be at fords cost (ie warranty)

also you should get in writing confirmation that any failure as a result will be covered by them as even once those repairs are carried out as ford state, fords warranty will not cover a part that may of been effected by this at a later date!
 
pjclarke1:

its more typo errors i am too busy to correct!

even more so whilst using a pda on a 320x 160 something screen using an on screen keyboard at gone 1am in the morning
 

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