Flashing macro-blocking discussion (UPDATE: LG's FW fix now available)

ozzzy189

Well-known Member
I watched episode 1 of Chambers last night on Netflix. The setting sun showed zero gradation issues on my set on .31
I will update to 55 but am still using 1.9 gamma. I don't care if its incorrect, it solves the darkness issues for me and provides a fantastic picture imo.
 

TremendousTea

Active Member
I watched episode 1 of Chambers last night on Netflix. The setting sun showed zero gradation issues on my set on .31
I will update to 55 but am still using 1.9 gamma. I don't care if its incorrect, it solves the darkness issues for me and provides a fantastic picture imo.
What about Dolby Vision and HDR?
 

Autopilot

Distinguished Member
I watched episode 1 of Chambers last night on Netflix. The setting sun showed zero gradation issues on my set on .31
I will update to 55 but am still using 1.9 gamma. I don't care if its incorrect, it solves the darkness issues for me and provides a fantastic picture imo.
Agreed.
 

TremendousTea

Active Member
Each to their own, but it seems like fixing one small problem to introduce a bigger problem.

As the attached image shows (thanks to Only1hammy on the C8 discussion thread for testing) where 1.9 is from 2.4 and what it does, is washing out a lot of the image. Canary-Jules confirmed the crush also affects HDR and Dolby Vision.

Again if someone is happy with that then that’s great, I’m just trying to share the information I’ve learnt. Trying both myself I’d rather have the 2.2 with adjusted IRE, makes much more sense. Reason I’m staying on .20 is due to HDR, DV and gaming, I don’t have the tools to fix those setting and won’t spend a few hundred pounds to fix a picture rather than improve.
 

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Matson

Distinguished Member
Its the reason why im not going to update,. My picture is very accurate out of the box and while I do have the tools to calibrate SDR if the update also ruins HDR and DV I don't have the tools to correct those accurately and im not paying for a calibration to fix something that LG ruin. The flashing is annoying though when it does appear but ill live with it.
 

ozzzy189

Well-known Member
Each to their own, but it seems like fixing one small problem to introduce a bigger problem.

As the attached image shows (thanks to Only1hammy on the C8 discussion thread for testing) where 1.9 is from 2.4 and what it does, is washing out a lot of the image. Canary-Jules confirmed the crush also affects HDR and Dolby Vision.

Again if someone is happy with that then that’s great, I’m just trying to share the information I’ve learnt. Trying both myself I’d rather have the 2.2 with adjusted IRE, makes much more sense. Reason I’m staying on .20 is due to HDR, DV and gaming, I don’t have the tools to fix those setting and won’t spend a few hundred pounds to fix a picture rather than improve.
But these panels vary hugely, that's why some are affected far worse than others. Mine was an absolute horror show. I'll get it re-calibrated in the next couple of months but for now I'm happy.
 

TremendousTea

Active Member
But these panels vary hugely, that's why some are affected far worse than others. Mine was an absolute horror s how. I'll get it re-calibrated in the next couple of months but for now I'm happy.
The 2.2 you have on HDR and DV will be crushing detail also, the exact same as it is for SDR, the TV will follow that gamma curve regardless.

Oh of course, that’s why I stated many people will agree or disagree. It’s hugely down to panel variance, that’s why we’ve had such conflicting reports. I just cannot see many, or if any panels tracking that bad which makes 2.8 look good? Are TVs really tracking around 1.8/1.9 out the box??

My main problem is the blanket fix issued, I’d like the dithering but without the crush. If the crush has helped panels, why are the others left with choosing one or the other (or even another by paying for calibration). A lot of people are expecting LG to play with the gamma curve, or believe it may be a mistake by LG having that in, but the longer it takes the more it seems intentional.

If someone can post their TV set to 2.2 and show a graph of it hitting 1.8 in and around 5% IRE I’d take it back.
 

flaviowolff

Novice Member
The latest episode of Game of Thrones is a macroblocking horror show. There are huge clouds of macroblocking even on actors faces, because the episode is very dark. Latest firmware here. I don’t think it’s ever going to be fixed, it’s an OLED issue. Seen it on a galaxy s7 and xiaomi mi 8. LG can only mask the issue by messing with the near blacks, but not entirely.

oLed is supposed to be awesome for dark scenes, but it’s been proving the opposite. I’m feeling very anxious when watching any dark movies on my c8, searching for macroblocking and actually finding it
 
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flaviowolff

Novice Member
Try increasing it a little.

Ire5 - 12
Ire10 - 10
Ire15 - 8
Ire20 - 6
Ire25 - 4
Ire30 - 2

On my panel this actually gives a fairly similar look compared to my 3dlut. Not exact, of course, but not a million miles away either.
Can someone confirm if this is also recommended for 2.2 gamma?
 

Slugsy01

Well-known Member
The latest episode of Game of Thrones is a macroblocking horror show. There are huge clouds of macroblocking even on actors faces, because the episode is very dark. Latest firmware here. I don’t think it’s ever going to be fixed, it’s an OLED issue. Seen it on a galaxy s7 and xiaomi mi 8. LG can only mask the issue by messing with the near blacks, but not entirely.

oLed is supposed to be awesome for dark scenes, but it’s been proving the opposite. I’m feeling very anxious when watching any dark movies on my c8, searching for macroblocking and actually finding it
I’m not sure it’s a OLED issue, more the content itself. I think it’s bad on pretty much every TV, I could certainly see issues on my Kuro.

Why did last night’s ‘Game of Thrones’ look so bad? Here comes the science! – TechCrunch
 

j82k

Active Member
Yeah GoT quality is terrible. I checked the latest episode on my monitor which usually doesn't show issues with lower quality content and even there it looked bad.

I didn't even try it on my C8 but this looks to be the kind of content that is also very prone to showing the near-black overshoot severely, at least on firmwares before 04.10.31.
 

TremendousTea

Active Member
Erm well no form of HDR uses the gamma curve.
HDR10 and Dolby Vision use PQ, and HLG uses a Hybrid of Log and Gamma :)
True but it’s still crushing shadow detail with HDR as I’ve seen others on AVSforums etc posting edited HDR IRE settings to fix the issue. Canary_Jules has calibrated TVs since .31 and verified it is affecting HDR and DV coming out of the lower end of the EOTF.

I tried a few scenes on Black Summer via Netflix in a few dark scenes with lockers in a dimly lit hallway. Those lockers were just a black hole on .31 and .55 compared to .20
 

TremendousTea

Active Member
Regardless, I think these TVs create a stunning image when fed great quality material. Just booted days gone for the first time and these photos I’ve just taken early on really popped for me. Best HDR and quality I’ve seen in a game since Uncharted.

*Highlights not blown in person of course :)
 

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flaviowolff

Novice Member

Slugsy01

Well-known Member
Nice read, but people who watched the tv broadcast also complained about banding and such. Isn’t that supposed to be a streaming only problem? Or is HBO broadcasting steaming video over their cable channel?
Are we talking colour banding or banding a la ‘poor panel’?
 

Autopilot

Distinguished Member
The latest episode of Game of Thrones is a macroblocking horror show. There are huge clouds of macroblocking even on actors faces, because the episode is very dark. Latest firmware here. I don’t think it’s ever going to be fixed, it’s an OLED issue. Seen it on a galaxy s7 and xiaomi mi 8. LG can only mask the issue by messing with the near blacks, but not entirely.

oLed is supposed to be awesome for dark scenes, but it’s been proving the opposite. I’m feeling very anxious when watching any dark movies on my c8, searching for macroblocking and actually finding it
GOT PQ is terrible on most TV’s, there is talk all over the internet about how bad it is. This isn’t the C8’s fault this time.

How to fix your TV settings for a rewatch of last night’s Game of Thrones
 
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Rizvan

Well-known Member
Finally got my LG C8 65" mounted on the wall.
Great PQ, even when feeding it content from my 1080P Sky Q Minibox :D
I ran it to some big problems in getting my Sony BDP-X700 to play ball when connected directly to the C8 or my Samsung Soundbar. It appears it was down to the HDMI cables. :(
 

Bigbro00

Standard Member
Can someone confirm if this is also recommended for 2.2 gamma?
I adjust the gamma using this table. It runs even further until IRE 100. I also use gamma 2.2. My picture is now back, or maybe even better than it was when I used the .15 fw. I now use the ridiculous .31 fw but with these adjustments I am very comfortable. No more updates for me.
 

ozzzy189

Well-known Member
Erm well no form of HDR uses the gamma curve.
HDR10 and Dolby Vision use PQ, and HLG uses a Hybrid of Log and Gamma :)
That's why it's greyed out then, it's showing 2.2 but it's greyed.
 

RudiSt

Active Member

Zigourney

Active Member
just my observation, think this macroblocking issue is more to do with the bit starved streaming content in general. I do see slight macroblocking issue on my 65C8 when watching dark scenes/content on Netflix or other low bitrate content including GOT.

However, I do not see any macroblocking issues at all in any of my high quality 1080p remuxes or any of my 4k rips.

So in my non-technical opinion, my observation is that this issue is entirely down to how the tv handles low bit rate content - obviously quite poorly!
 

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