FBR on panny E100

davee b

Active Member
Just trying to get my head around the slightly confusing manual for the E100 regarding recording with flexible bit rate.

suppose i have 2 hours 20 minutes i want to dub from the HD to dvd-r. If i select FBR will it record as much as it can in SP then finish off in LP or does it write the whole disc at a bit rate slightly less than SP ie is the process stepless or not.

my other question regarding high speed dubbing is if you can dub EP to EP at 24x does that mean you need a 24x dvd-r to record it on (as i thought they only went up to 8x).

many thanks to anyone who can put me right. :smoke:
 

Big Al

Standard Member
FBR records your dub in real time. It will use up as much disk space as the rcoring requires. ie a 70 minute programme will fill the dvd and be recorded at the best possible quality, whereas if you use one of the other options you will have disk space left.

Not sure how FBR works but in certainly seems to give the best PQ on a variety of recordings.

High speed dubbing works very well, although you will not get the best PQ.

Big Al
 

davee b

Active Member
Thanks big al. does the entire recording in fbr look like it is at the same quality. in the example i gave i dont want part of the recording to be in a lower quality ie LP, so if it uses the part SP, part LP method i'll trim the footage down to 2 hours and do it all in SP, however if it records everything in slightly lower than SP quality i'll record the full 2-30. ;)
 

Big Al

Standard Member
Allrecordings I have made in FBR have the sam PQ all the way through. I guess the E100 uses lesser quality on satic or low bit rate scenes?

Big Al
 

OARDVD

Standard Member
Hi davee b, I’ll try to answer your other question. First off, you said “dubbing EP to EP” at 24X. I’m not sure that’s the best way of expressing it because that sounds like playing a title made in EP and recording it on to a DVD-R in EP quality. Obviously that would be 1X speed. So I think it’s better to say 'High Speed dubbing an EP recording'.

Now, Panasonic claim up to 24X dubbing on the E100. This is achieved by High Speed dubbing an EP recording to a 4X DVD-R. Basically this is a file transfer from the HDD to the DVD. The time it takes is 24X faster than dubbing it in realtime. (It’s also lossless, but that’s another matter).

So, how do they come up with the 24X figure? Well, a title recorded in XP (1 hour mode) will take the same time to dub in “High Speed” mode to a 1X disc as it would if you played it in realtime*. EP is 6 hour mode and the same title recorded in EP is 1/6th of the file size compared with XP. Therefore, it is 6X faster to dub to a 1X drive. However, the E100 has a 4X DVD-R drive (DVD RAM is 2X), so if you use a 4X disc it is 4X faster on top of that.

And 6 X 4 = 24 …. ie. 24X faster than playing in realtime. So, to finally answer your question: No you only need a 4X DVD.

Time taken to High Speed dub compared with realtime:
------On a 1X drive (eg. E80):--------------On a 4X drive (eg. E100):
XP------------1X-----------------------------------4X
SP------------2X-----------------------------------8X
LP------------4X----------------------------------16X
EP------------6X----------------------------------24X

With future generations of Pannys having an 8 hour mode and probable 8X drives you can see that it won’t be long before we see claims of 64X.


* Because High Speed dubbing to a 1X drive uses the same data rate as writing a DVD in realtime in XP mode. This is 9.8Mbps and is the maximum rate permitted in the DVD standards.

I'm sorry this has been a bit long winded but hopefully you understood it :D
 

kenfowler3966

Active Member
Fixed bit rate keeps the same settings for the whole recording, this is essential if you may want to import to a computer later.
Variable bit rate will swap to a lower resolution for a few minutes, if the visual scene is very busy. This gives a less blocky picture which is easier to view. This is best unless you need to play back in a player that can't handle the resolution changes.

High speed dubing, particularly at 24 speed is a headline grabber to sell the machine, but of little practical use. First you have to record to the hdd at ep mode to be able to dub at that mode, and the consequential quality will be very poor.
 

OARDVD

Standard Member
Actually it's Fixed resolution ,Ken, not bit rate. The Panny's always record in variable bit rate regardless of the setting of the Resolution option.
 

davee b

Active Member
Thanks Ken & oardvd. I've decided i'm not keen on the high speed dubbing. i did a test one onto a dvd ram disc and the pq was noticeably worse (although still ok).

my problem is that i copied 3 hours (54 songs) of music video footage onto the HD as one track, then split all 54 tracks off to make a playlist. i thought that by doing this it would allow me to skip each track when it was saved to dvd-r. i now know this isnt the case unless recorded in high speed mode (which seems a little strange). at normal speed it just inserts chapters every 5 minutes so i cant access the start of each song with the skip button. Any idea how to convert my playlist of 54 songs (one title) into 54 titles so the resulting disc should act like an audio cd and begin each consecutive track from the start. I've trawled the manual but not got much help from it. cheers guys.

ps you're absolutely correct about the variable bit rate oardvd, it varies around a set average based on the quality selected.
 

Yuccaman

Standard Member
davee....

Make a separate playlist for each track and then dub all 54 playlists....

you'll then be creating a separate title per track which you can jump forward to (but no back - well, not on my Panny S75 player that is !!!!!)
 

OARDVD

Standard Member
I've decided i'm not keen on the high speed dubbing. i did a test one onto a dvd ram disc and the pq was noticeably worse (although still ok).

I'm a bit puzzled by this as HS dubbing is completely lossless and produces identical pq :confused:
 

davee b

Active Member
Originally posted by OARDVD
I'm a bit puzzled by this as HS dubbing is completely lossless and produces identical pq :confused:

it was recorded onto a ram disc and had slight tizzing and blocking compared to the hdd original. i'm confused as well :rolleyes:
 

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