Fake ALR. Is there such a thing? / Are all grey screens ALR?

Tyler Durden

Distinguished Member
In an attempt to improve contrast of my Epson EH-TW7300 projector I have bought a new screen.
This one - Luxburg 120" Electric Projector Screen Ambient Light Rejection
It is essentially the cheapest 120" ALR screen I could find and it has made me wonder if it is possibly just a grey screen without specific ALR properties.
Is it possible for me to test this theory when the screen arrives?
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
u will be able to tell by the viewing angles. if the viewing angles are off then its ALR lol
 

Tyler Durden

Distinguished Member
u will be able to tell by the viewing angles. if the viewing angles are off then its ALR lol
Thanks. In my room all viewing angles are quite small so shouldn't be an issue.
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
Thanks. In my room all viewing angles are quite small so shouldn't be an issue.

the viewing angles have to be poor as its obviously rejecting light from the sides.

i agree, i had a similar room with an ALR and wasn't a problem. Even if it is a bit of an issue, its worth it for the PQ benefits and to be able to watch PJ during the day.
 

markymiles

Distinguished Member
Even if it is just a grey screen it will still be better than white for during the day. It does specifically state ALR though. I looked at those recently, seems almost too good to be true for that price. Fingers crossed you get a good one.
 

Peter Parker

Distinguished Member
A grey screen is lower gain and reflects less light than a white screen, so less light bounces onto the walls/ceiling and less light bounces back, helping to comparatively maintain some ANSI CR. A screen with gain reflects the light back more towards the source or audience, and less towards the walls and ceilings, so that can also help reduce the effects and maintain more ANSI CR. Combine the two for even better results (which is what ALR screens usually do), but depending on how the gain is achieved, can add some visible artefacts to the image.
 

3t3p

Active Member
I know grey is not strictly ALR but the effect is similar no? At least in my experience of one it had the overall effect of ambient light rejection.
They're game changers in a non treated room.
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
I know grey is not strictly ALR but the effect is similar no? At least in my experience of one it had the overall effect of ambient light rejection.
They're game changers in a non treated room.

Yup.

ALR's are far more effective though but Grey does help have a similar-ish effect.
 

Tyler Durden

Distinguished Member
Thanks everyone for your input. The new screen should be with me tomorrow. I wonder if there is anything I can do scientifically to measure the difference between the two.
I only have my phone to measure light output etc....
 
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alebonau

Distinguished Member
grey screens are not necessarily ambient light rejecting ... grey screens came about to basically make some effort to improve the poor contrast of projectors from yesteryear eg old DLPs.. they shift the black floor so what you give up is ability to ever do pure white... they seem to have hung on and used in certain circumstances ..

where i am you hardly ever see them anymore and thats because projectors contrast capabilities has come a long long ways over the years...

ALR screen on other hand you will find while might look grey actually has a special construction.. so accepting light from the projector but rejecting light from walls and other sources around the screen ... for ultra short throw projectors they are even more special in construction taking light only specifically from the angle of projection as you get from UST projectors ...

the reason for construction of ALRs screens can also mean very poor viewing angle and also a small cone of viewing.. there are however ton of different ALR screens and tech so will really need to check out for self

I wonder if there is anything I can do scientifically to measure the difference between the two.
really only see if there is any ambient light you can turn on in the room and see how much of it impacts the picture on screen. ALR screens dont do miracles...they are still impacted by ambient light jsut a bit less so than pure white :)
is they can have relatively poor gain and there fore throw less light off the screen

I only have my phone to measure light output etc..
i dont understand how would utilise a phone as a light meter. but you could use a light meter (even an affordable one) to check ambient light in a room...
 

Tyler Durden

Distinguished Member
i dont understand how would utilise a phone as a light meter. but you could use a light meter (even an affordable one) to check ambient light in a room...
Phones have cameras and light meters in them.
Apps like this should give me an idea. I'm more interested in the method of testing.

 

alebonau

Distinguished Member
Phones have cameras and light meters in them.
Apps like this should give me an idea. I'm more interested in the method of testing.

good luck with it. :) am unaware of anyone using those.. light sensors on light meters are very sensitive ! :) if trying to measure ambient light in a room.. you need a very sensitive weight meter .. which most will do, unaware if a phone will work in that regard.. and you can find out i guess :)

ps as a headsup...its actually not at all related to the cameras on the phone...see note below on the specific app from the maker

"Thank you! 😊 The app doesn't use any camera, neither front or back. It uses the light intensity sensor of a phone, which is located on a front panel of the phone. 👍🏻"
 
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Russ 66

Distinguished Member
In an attempt to improve contrast of my Epson EH-TW7300 projector I have bought a new screen.
This one - Luxburg 120" Electric Projector Screen Ambient Light Rejection
It is essentially the cheapest 120" ALR screen I could find and it has made me wonder if it is possibly just a grey screen without specific ALR properties.
Is it possible for me to test this theory when the screen arrives?
Easiest way is to shine a torch on it. Straight on will be a lot brighter than an angle if it's an ALR.

Hope it's ok, every cheap ALR screen sample I have seen are very glittery, even some expensive ones.
There is only one way to get lumens back with a grey screen and that's with reflective particles in the surface.
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
Easiest way is to shine a torch on it. Straight on will be a lot brighter than an angle if it's an ALR.

Hope it's ok, every cheap ALR screen sample I have seen are very glittery, even some expensive ones.
There is only one way to get lumens back with a grey screen and that's with reflective particles in the surface.

This^^^

Very easy to test ALR because it won't accept light as easily from the sides.

In my experience, electric screens are just very expensive. I'd just sit tight and wait for a deal. I sold a Draper React 3.0 electric for like £650 I think a few months ago. They do come up for sale, and sometimes when they do they sit on the classifieds for a week or so until someone realises how good of a deal it is.

If you can wait, in the mean time get a fixed screen. If you can't wait, then yeah sure go for it.
 

panman40

Distinguished Member
In an attempt to improve contrast of my Epson EH-TW7300 projector I have bought a new screen.
This one - Luxburg 120" Electric Projector Screen Ambient Light Rejection
It is essentially the cheapest 120" ALR screen I could find and it has made me wonder if it is possibly just a grey screen without specific ALR properties.
Is it possible for me to test this theory when the screen arrives?
Did You receive the screen yet ?, be interesting to hear your thoughts on it.
 

Jester1066

Well-known Member

Tyler Durden

Distinguished Member
Sorry guys. The screen delivery has been delayed. I'm now hoping to get it tomorrow.
 

Tyler Durden

Distinguished Member
The screen arrived and I have used a tor h to see if I can tell if the ALR is real.

I can't see any difference in light reflection from any angle while doing this.

This image shows the light coming from a window to the right. The dark section to the far right of the screen is caused by a shadow cast by a wall to the right.

IMG_20220321_181041.jpg


The screen does look to be well made, and it is obviously darker in general. I fully expect the blacks to be better as a result of this. However I can't confirm the ALR properties at the moment.
 

Tyler Durden

Distinguished Member
This is the ALR (Grey) Screen.
IMG_20220321_184816.jpg

This is the White Screen.
IMG_20220317_124945.jpg
 

Tyler Durden

Distinguished Member
I haven't changed any of the picture settings, I only changed the screen.
I set the camera to the same settings for both photos.
 

Jester1066

Well-known Member

Tyler Durden

Distinguished Member
To me the white screen looks better/brighter. I'll caveat that by saying I saying I have zero knowledge when it comes to PJ'S & screens. (I am doing extensive research in the area though!)
Yes, unsurprisingly the whites are better on the white screen, and the blacks are better on the grey screen.
I am yet to do any calibration with the grey screen up.
I am considering sending it back.
 

Jester1066

Well-known Member
I'd be interested to see a good quality source image compared between the 2 screens is like. What PJ do you have?
 

Tyler Durden

Distinguished Member
The projector is an Epson EH-TW7300.
 

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