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Euro 1080 to be encryped!!!

Discussion in 'TVs' started by rigman, Nov 21, 2003.

  1. rigman

    rigman
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    Just got the latest edition of What satellite and it says that Euro1080 will be encrypted on both channels and that if you want to view there will be a one off cost of £70.

    Bad news as all the articles I have read before now have said it will be free to air on one of the channels specifically directed at the home market.

    They have a limited market as it is and this will not do them any favours as far as take up goes.

    They also say that the receivers will be available before the end of the year but I have not seen anywhere advertising them on pre order.

    There is an article on setting it up on your PC for those that are interested.

    Darren
     
  2. Chris Muriel

    Chris Muriel
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    I wonder when/why they changed their stance.
    I think we should all email them and point out how they will be stymying their intended market - biting off the hand that feeds them.

    Chris Muriel
     
  3. Howard Pitfield

    Howard Pitfield
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    ...yes rushed out to get the latest edition - useful article and so have ordered the Pinnacle PC sat card (with CI) in case.

    However their website at Euro1080 still states it will be FTA - just for the reason that it will encourage take up - could be Wotsat got it wrong and meant the other channel (Events) is encrypted.

    H
     
  4. Boris Blank

    Boris Blank
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    This is from the Euro 1080 website (faq page)
    Edit - link to faq here http://www.euro1080.tv/faqs.htm ;

    Question: “How can you protect the content of the Right Holders and how do you avoid illegal copying”

    Answer: “We produce and distribute content in superior technical quality and realize the artistic and commercial value of the productions we have. Protection of this content against piracy or other illegal use is of great importance to us – without it we do not have a business case. Encryption, secure key management and distribution, physical protection of servers, use of smart cards for authentication and verification, and other security measures are, and all on a high professional level form part of our operation”

    Not entirely clear what this actually refers to, sounds more like physical protection of the source material but could aslo encompass broadcast encryption perhaps? Maybe we are looking at a mix of FTA and encrypted stuff?

    Paul
     
  5. Boris Blank

    Boris Blank
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    Aha, check this bit out - refers to having a main channel and another exclusive event channel which presumably could be encrypted!

    Question: “Why do you think that consumers are willing to buy expensive tickets for these events, which you can also see on TV now”
    Answer: “First of all, the events we will show will only partly be available on the regular TV stations. Examples are the Portugal 2004 soccer games. Other events, such major live rock concerts, big classic events, will NOT be on regular TV, nor on our Main Channel, so for these premium events are exclusive for the Event Channel. Furthermore, we have experienced that this type of environment that we can offer, large screen, perfect surround sound and sharing the event with hundreds of others, is perceived to be enormously attractive.”

    Question: “Is the Main Channel going to show the same content as Event Channel”
    Answer: “There will be events that are going to be shown on both Channels, but the Event Channel will have premium content that will be exclusive for that channel”

    Edit - yep, near the bottom of the faq it states that the main channel will be FTA. This most likely means that the exclusive event channel won't. Re-reading the faq, I think the Event Channel may not be readily available to home-users - anyone else read it like that?

    Edit 2 - and to pile on yet more agravation, it looks like the STB's don't have RGB output, only component and S-Video! HTPC may be the only option for CRT'er's and some of the digital gang - transcoders should work though but we'll have to see!

    Paul
     
  6. Boris Blank

    Boris Blank
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    Just found this confirmation at http://www.mybroadcastbuyer.info/article_1376.shtml

    "The satellite service will include two channels: a main channel that distributes free programming to households, sports bars, hotel chains, and other small public venues; and an event channel that distributes pay-per-view events to theatres equipped with electronic projection and surround-sound systems."

    I think its fairly clear that the best stuff will simply not be available to us home-users, even ppv is looking as if it will restricted to theatres? I wonder if we could still manage to access it via PC ;) ?
    Paul
     
  7. Dutch

    Dutch
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    Paul,

    I read that the Smart Imperator receiver will have a DVI output - which is nice! :smoke:

    Steve
     
  8. Boris Blank

    Boris Blank
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    Hi Steve,
    Ah, I forgot about that one. (Thumps head in annoyance) I'm thinking "euro1080 = Sky = need special box" which is wrong of course.

    DVI will be great as long as we don't get the encryption flag which would be unlikely I think - the DVI equipped crowd will be mega happy in any case!

    Us analogue folks would still need a transcoder but thats just (minor) hassle rather than a problem.
    Cheers,
    Paul
     
  9. zAndy1

    zAndy1
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    Forgive me for being thick but if this turns out to be true I guess that means getting a dish and a Skystar2 card etc is a waste of time and the only way to view this will be through a set top box? Glad I didn't rush out and buy the dish etc!

    Cheers,
    Andy.
     
  10. rigman

    rigman
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    well that depends on the encryption. Software is a wonderful thing. ;)

    Darren
     
  11. Gordon @ Convergent AV

    Gordon @ Convergent AV
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  12. zAndy1

    zAndy1
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    lol, yeah of course I'll still need a dish (I hadn't forgotten, honest).. but I don't see any point investing in a PCI DVB card right now if it turns out you can't use it anyway. Best sit tight and see what happens in the new year me thinks..

    Cheers,
    Andy.
     
  13. helipilot

    helipilot
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    Arghhhhh !!

    This is typical, I have just invested in all the gear to receive Euro1080 and the goalposts have been shifted !!


    I have emailed Euro1080 for clarification.

    The chances of it being a typo seem a bit slim so what are the options for PC Viewers ?

    1) An add on viewing card reader for the PC ?

    2) A software decoder that has to be purchased from Euro1080 ?


    I am new to this PC satellite game so my knowledge is limited, does anyone know if either of the above is even feasible or possible ?



    Alan
     
  14. Boris Blank

    Boris Blank
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    I'm firmly in the wait and see camp. It will likely be easily receivable via PC but I'm happy to hangfire the 6 weeks before we find out for sure and play catch up once the dust settles.

    I suspect we'll know sooner than the start-up date as they need to make sure their intended audience is ready and waiting!
    Paul
     
  15. Boris Blank

    Boris Blank
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    More info. Apparantly (and this is informed speculation rather than fact I think but it ties in with everything being said above) Euro 1080 is going to be encrypted under Irdeto 2.

    Likely this will be just for the Event channel as the Euro 1080 faq states that the main channel will not be encrypted.

    Chris - if true, how would this impact reception of the Event channel via PC cards such as the Skystar2 etc?

    Paul
     
  16. Chris Muriel

    Chris Muriel
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    Erm , what I can say is the there is some interesting educational 3rd party software and utilities around for Skystar cards.
    NB : I do not actually have a Skystar card . I have 2 other cards.
    1 is a Broadlogic BL2030. These rarely appear in UK but right now if you search on Ebay.co.uk for Broadlogic you should actually find some (with a Buy-it-now" tag).

    Chris Muriel.
     
  17. pietnoeck

    pietnoeck
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    Do these BL2300 also work with third party software on the necrypted channels or are these card only good for HDTV ?
     
  18. Chris Muriel

    Chris Muriel
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    They're good for any FTA (Free |To Air) DVB TV ; with ProgDVB and certain additional utilities you may have some luck with some encrypted stuff.
    I use DVBApps, which does nothing with encrypted signals - but I find it far easier to use than ProgDVB (and anyway I am an alpha-tester and technical ideas provider for Hans - the author of DVBApps). Lots of Broadlogic info also on his site - even in the unregistered open area : www.dvbapps.com

    Chris Muriel, Manchester.
     
  19. rigman

    rigman
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    The Skystar 2 arrived today and I have managed to get it working with FTA and encrypted stuff although it took a bit of work. My 1 gig athlon is struggling with the normal type programs and locks up after a while. I will try the Hidef stuff tomorrow but do not hold out much hope. :(

    zAndy1
    if you get a dish and a card now then you will be an expert by the time you need it for real when Euro 1080 does go mainstream programming. ;)

    Darren
     
  20. Gordon @ Convergent AV

    Gordon @ Convergent AV
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    MY understanding is that the channels will be encrypted after a couple of months. At that point there will only be a FTA 2hr demo loop like there is now.

    Gordon
     
  21. Boris Blank

    Boris Blank
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    That makes sense, the phrase I heard used was "conditional" FTA which ties in with the £70 one-off fee for a card or whatever then thats it for life - bit like Freeview I suppose!
    Paul
     
  22. helipilot

    helipilot
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    As of yet there is no update on the Euro1080 web site.


    Last update
    September 11, 2003

    It still says :-


    " Euro1080 HDTV Main Channel to consumers and small venues
    The characteristics for the channel as delivery chain for HDTV to the consumers in its first years will be as follows:

    Free-to-air, so no special decryption or subscription required."


    I have had no feedback from Euro1080, hopefully they will at least reply to clarify the situation.


    Alan
     
  23. Muf

    Muf
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    Perhaps the one time payment of £70 refers to the purchase of the "special set top box" which would be required by the average viewer, but hopefully not the PC wizard. I have not seen the magazine article that sparked this off but it might be a good idea to ask the publishers to clarify.

    Jim
     
  24. Boris Blank

    Boris Blank
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    There is to be a major article in the forthcoming January edition of What Satellite (available 18th December from all good newsagents) about Euro 1080 and how to receive it (December's edition was just a taster!).
    paul
     
  25. pietnoeck

    pietnoeck
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    Well don't hold you're breath, here is what I found on a Dutch board :
    "Can you please give some more information about the HD STB. Where and
    when
    to buy and at what cost?

    Dear,

    Thank you for your interest in Euro1080.

    To receive the Euro1080-signal you need a dish on your roof
    (transmission via satellite), a decoder (a set top box) and a
    HD-display.

    The STB with CA will be available on the market for the costumers from
    March 2004 on. Before that time, there will be DEMO-boxes at the
    distribution chains where we have a partnership with, without CA-card.
    We are in the last faze of this partnership deals, but I cannot tell you
    anything specific at this moment.

    If you cannot wait till that moment, please feel free to order already
    (without CA) at:

    ZINTEC HOLDING B.V.
    Einsteinstraat 27
    2811 EP Reeuwijk
    Tel: +31 0182 393 228
    Contact: Gerard Meijer
    gmeijer@zintec.com

    Best regards,"

    CA doesn't sound good at all if you ask me.
    What this means for pc users I dare not sy.
     
  26. Muf

    Muf
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    pietnoeck that looks 'not so bad'
    call me an optomist if you like but the way I see it, the STB is a multi format receiver able to receive SD channels as well as HD, both encrypted and non encrypted.
    So you could interpret the reply as: If you want to receive HD immediately go ahead and order the STB without CA but if you want a full function STB with CA wait till march 2004 which means the HD channel is FTA.
    It's a pity we dont have a clear cut answer and have to speculate like this.

    Jim
     
  27. Boris Blank

    Boris Blank
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  28. Gordon @ Convergent AV

    Gordon @ Convergent AV
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    The Zinwell box is FTA. It will show other FTA programmes on the satellite as well as Euro1080i. It can output at 576P, 1080I and I think 720P?

    I might get one as I believe they are available now.

    If anyone else fancies one let me know by email ( NOT PM as it's always close to full) and we'll see if we can get numbers up high enough to get them cheaper. Currently looking at 350euros plus VAT I think.

    Gordon
     
  29. Paul D

    Paul D
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    I'd be up for one!:smashin:
     
  30. Boris Blank

    Boris Blank
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