Entry level HD 1080i Camcorder?

Discussion in 'Camcorders, Action Cams & Video Making Forum' started by AngelEyes, Apr 29, 2007.

  1. AngelEyes

    AngelEyes
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    Hi,

    I have done a little research and read a few reviews but I am still none the wiser what I should be looking at.

    All I want is decent video PQ and SQ. I am a point and click amateur but just find my current JVC GRDVP7E a bit poor PQ compared to what I want.

    I don't need any fancy gadgets but obviously the best for my money.

    Budget sub £1000, preferably closer to £600 but I don't know what is available reallly.

    Thank you.

    Adam
     
  2. senu

    senu
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    Have a look at this

    http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=498017

    There are now a lot more models by Sony ( mainly AVCHD) , JVC and Canon

    The Main formats are MiniDV for HDV ( established editing support) and HDD for AVCHD with emerging editing support : Sony Vegas and Pinnacle Studio 11 , and in the case of Sony, a new one with memory stick

    Unless you think tape is dead: I would look at the HDV models
    Sony HC 5 and 7
    Canon Hv 10 and 20
    All of which are sub £1000

    Redsox_mark is our Expert on these camcorder models , he ( as they say) has his finger on the pulse and will hopefully come along shortly
     
  3. AngelEyes

    AngelEyes
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    Thanks Senu,

    I have read that AVC is not quite as good quality as HDV with some artifacting present but perhaps this is offset by the convenience of a HDD and quieter use (I am guessing here but my DV tapes could usually be heard whirring in the BG when I used my JVC).

    I use Premier Pro 2 for fiddling about with video but no real fancy editing, does it support AVC or will I need some plugin or such?

    Of the reviews I have read the HC3 seems 'ok' but I do fancy the HDD option if I can afford it and the PQ isn't significantly poorer :)

    Please base recomendations on what I am used to, this is for vid of the kids and holiday and such nothing to clever needed :D

    Thanks.
     
  4. redsox_mark

    redsox_mark
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    You won't be able to edit AVCHD in Premiere Pro 2. Adobe hasn't announced when they will support it, and if it will be free or if you will need to upgrade.

    Vegas and Pinnacle are the only ones I know of who have announced AVCHD support.

    Today, comparing AVCHD to HDV:

    - HDV quality is a bit better. (Not hugely better, but better).
    - HDV is easy to edit, AVCHD support is just coming available, and it also likely require a more powerful PC
    - HDV models are cheaper

    I can't hear any noise from the tape with my HC1.

    Unless you really are anti-tape, HDV is the best value...You can get a Sony HC5 online for around £600, which is easy to use and should meet your needs. The HC7 and Canon HV20 have a higher spec and cost a bit more (£700-750). All prices are cheapest UK online prices... high street prices will be higher, imports from abroad may be cheaper...

    If you don't want tape, you have the Sony SR1 (HDD) or Panasonic SD1 (SD memory card). Web prices of both of these around £800.

    Lastly, the new JVC HD7, which is HDD but is not AVCHD... it's it's own version of MPEG2. Not available in the UK directly yet, but can be imported from Japan.
     
  5. AngelEyes

    AngelEyes
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    Thanks mark,

    I'll look into the HC5 as the price is more in my league and as much as I like the latest wizz-bang gadgets I have to accept I don't need the very best on this occasion :)

    Adam
     
  6. KelvinS1965

    KelvinS1965
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    I've got my eyes on the HC5 as well. Anyone know where I can download the manual? There doesn't seem to be an option on the Sony website and my usual Sony manuals portal seems to have gone.:eek:

    Also, am I right in thinking that this machine will be able to play back recordings made on my SD DV Panasonic Camera (in case it packs up in the future)?
     
  7. redsox_mark

    redsox_mark
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    Link to manual
    http://pdf.crse.com/manuals/2319807121.pdf

    Also, am I right in thinking that this machine will be able to play back recordings made on my SD DV Panasonic Camera

    Only if you shoot in DV mode.... if you shoot HDV you will only be able to play it on a HDV camcorder.
     
  8. KelvinS1965

    KelvinS1965
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    Thanks for the link.:clap: I meant the other way round for the tapes BTW; old DV tapes from the Panasonic being played back in the new Sony...but I guess the answer is 'yes'.:)
     
  9. redsox_mark

    redsox_mark
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    Ahh... sorry I misread that. Yes, the answer is yes - you can play DV tapes from other camcorders on the HC5.

    The only disclaimer is if the recordings are in long play (LP) there may be difficulty playing them.. but this is not specific to the HC5 or HDV camcorders... that is a general issue with LP (and why it is best to avoid using it).
     
  10. RohanM

    RohanM
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    Just to say I recently bought a Sony HC5E from Dixon online (paid the standard delivery, but still got it within 48 hours :smashin: )

    Like AngelEyes, my main needs are based around pointandclick holiday'n'kids kinda stuff, but wanted to go HD and also widescreen, and this camera is damned fine for that, and much more. It's a bit bigger and heavier than the stuff you get for around £200 these days, but that means it is more stable - and you can feel the difference in build quality.

    My take from reading the advice on these forums was that the HC5E is probably overkill for my needs, but it was the best compromise in terms of quality, performance, price and it was HD. (Give it a year, and HDD with HD will probably be cheaper and will Rule The World).

    I also like the fact that I can keep the (nowadays astonishingly cheap) miniDV tapes as HD 'masters', it's easy to burn DVDs on my DVD Recorder using firewire (OK, only SD for the moment, but when Bluray/HD-DVD recorders are cheap and plentiful... ); and don't have to worry about archiving off from an HDD onto a PC/whatever other storage medium.

    And if i ever get my ar$e in gear and do some editing/more creative stuff, the software is well established...
     
  11. Easypz

    Easypz
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    Hi, I bought my HC5 last month from cameras2u.com for £680 in a bundle that included a decent carry bag and 3 blank dv tapes. All in all really pleased with it -currently editing some footage in prem pro 2 which has hdv capture capability :)
     
  12. MR ETOME

    MR ETOME
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    Anyone know how good the DD5.1 sound recording is in the latest Sony models?
    I would really like this feature but am wondering if it's worth the extra cost.
    TIA
     
  13. redsox_mark

    redsox_mark
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    The built in 5.1 mic is on the Sony AVCHD cams (e.g. the SR1, and the new SR5, SR7, SR8). The mics on the HDV cams (HC5, HC7) are stereo.

    In my opinion: They work, but are mainly a gimmick. Surround sound in a movie is great, but that involves selectively mixing some audio to the rear channels for effect. The dialog is all from the front (centre), and the rear channels are used quite sparingly.

    Generally when you are videoing something, you want the audio from what you are shooting at, not what is all around you. For example, you are shooting your child on the stage at a school performance, do you really want to hear the parents talking in the row behind you?
     
  14. senu

    senu
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    Yes...:eek:!
    Not really..


    There are software based solutions: ... For instance I know Pinnacle Studio, Liquid and now Uleads latest offerings which allow you to "create" 5.1 from a stereo source..
    They feature Mixers which give you some control over just how the sound comes out and are great in the right hands for videos with music .. but otherwise.. They are a bit of a gimmick and

    Stereo is it

    Their advantage though is that unlike with the microphones, these created effects are reversible( non permanent).. if you've made a hash of it....Its a matter of hitting the undo button

    The other advantage is that unlike the camcorder solutions you dont need to pay Sony extra for the microphones ( They never come as standard :()
     
  15. redsox_mark

    redsox_mark
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    There are software based solutions

    I agree.. that that's fine. I'm not against editing 5.1 "properly" if you have the time. But that would be done using multiple audio sources mixed together.

    The other advantage is that unlike the camcorder solutions you dont need to pay Sony extra for the microphones ( They never come as standard)

    That's true for models which take an external 5.1 mic. The SR1/5/7/8 all have a built in 5.1 mic.
     

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