Question Dynamic Volume on Denon X2300x not working?

Daveyboy1985

Active Member
Hello all.

I have a Denon X2300w which I've recently bought.
I've done the 8 point Audyssey calibration and it set it all up fine.

I turned off audyssey dynamic EQ as this was just too loud for me as boosed all the surrounds and bass and where I live I cannot have sound too high or bassy.

I did turn on Dynamic Volume as reading on the forums and information about it my understanding was that I would help with louder moments and bring all the aound levels to a more equal sound across all speakers.

TV sound is fine and DVD playback is ok but have to increase the dialogue enhancer to +5 or +6 for dolby digital.

My issue as it was on a previous system is blu ray films as I know the sound on those are very dynamic so surround and fronts can give loud explosions where as the speech will be much lower.

I have dynamic volume set to medium and with this on i listen at -46 to - 50db.
Now with this setting the front and surround sounds are just about right but centre speech volume is still too low so I have to actually boost this to +12 for most blu rays at this volume and then everything sounds ok, the speech I can now easily hear and the effects are all balanced and not too loud.

I messed around then with the different settings between light medium and heavy on Dynamic Volume but it doesn't seem to change anything. Leaving at the volume I've set it all at (-48db and +12db for dialogue enhancer), changing from light to heavy I can not hear any difference at all. I was under the impression that it would maybe boost the speech and lower the effects so they were all roughly the same volume so speech enhancer wouldn't need to be at +12 but as I say I didn't notice any difference so not sure if it's something I'm doing wrong.

I know when I used to have a panasonic HTIB that it had a dolby midnight mode and this seemed much better as turning that off would mean everything was loud and unbalanced but turning on meant I could listen at much lower volumes and be able to hear speech without the effects being overpowering but with audyssey dynamic volume it doesn't seem to be same effect. Is is because DTS sound has a much wider dynamic range that it cannot boost the speech and lower the effects to about the same volume or is this not really what dynamic volume does.

So just really looking to see if it is actually working as intended and if it's something I'm doing wrong.

Thank you.
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
Dynamic Volume would simply increase the audible level of quieter aspects of the soundtrack relative to the master volume and would not decrease the level of the louder effects. The effect of Dynamic Volume is greater the lower the master volume, but the levels you are listening at are inordinately low and lower than the levels most people would listen at.

Also note that Dynamic Volume will not be in effect if using the PURE DIRECT mode.
 

Daveyboy1985

Active Member
Many thanks for your reply.

Ah I see, so it acts differently to say the DRC or midnight mode on devices for dolby encoded sound? As that mode always increased speech but lowered the other effects as well so it was all roughly the same.

From reading about dynamic volume I was under the impression it would act similar to that as stated it stops the loud moments and says you can put it on heavy if watching at night. But again if I turned sound right down to a night time viewing volume then heavy doesn't seem to make any difference really.

So with dynamic volume is it mainly only effective if the volume is much louder?

The levels i currently listen at are using audyssey dynamic volume. If i turn that off then everything goes quiet and I have to increase overall volume by 10-15db to get the same sort of level it would have been at with dynamic volume on.
But the loudness is definitely loud still and any louder I think I'd be getting on neighbours nerves which I wouldn't want to do.

Is it fine leaving the speech enhancer on +12 especially for blu rays as to me it sounds much more balanced and I don't need to keep reaching for the remote to turn it up or down on that setting?

Thanks again
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
It acts relative to the master volume. THe closer to 0db reference the master volume then the less Dynamic Volume will be in effect. It is similar in principle to standard DRC, but its effect is variable depending upon the master volume levels.Its purpose isn't to diminish loud effects and is there to make quiter aspects of the soundtrack more audible at lower volume levels.

I think it more a matter of your desired listening level being a lot lower than most would ordinarilly listen at. Most people listen at level in the region of -30 to -20db for day to day and general listening. You'd not really disturb neighbours at this level if the receiver is correctly calibrated.
 

Jase

Distinguished Member
It might be worth switching off Dynamic Volume and using the Dynamic Compression option. It's in the main setup menu - Audio - Surround Parameters - Loudness Management - Dynamic Compression.

Once Loudness Management is switched on you can then set Dynamic Compression to Auto, Low/Medium/High or Off.

Bear in mind this only works for Dolby material. For DTS you'd still need to use Dynamic Volume etc.
 

Daveyboy1985

Active Member
This is starting to make sense now. Thank you for explaining.
However, if I have dynamic volume switched off then the level I listen at is in fact between -20db and -30db. As soon as I switch dynamic volume on though the volume dramatically increases and I have to turn all the way down to about -38 to - 42db for most tv or DVD and lower still to about -48db for most blu ray.

So I do listen at that volume but without having dynamic volume on. Should turning on then not have the effect it does? Why does turning on actually increase the volume by about double what it was before?

Also I noticed that I have on eco mode. With dynamic volume off it shows energy use much higher than when I turn on Dynamic Volume, again any idea why that would be as volume level coming out sounds at same level but obviously at different levels on the receiver due to dynamic volume being on causing it to sound much louder. So is it actually using less power by having dynamic volume switched on, which according to the bar is about half as much as using it without dynamic volume on or is this just a bug in the software as don't know how it could use more if sound volume sounds the same?

Thank you as well Jase for your comment. In order to run DRC do I need to turn off dynamic volume first I guess as assume that overrules the DRC setting? I sort of need it for blu ray (DTS) though so it won't probably be an option but for now I think I have settings about right. I have receiver set to medium on Dynamic Volume and when watching t.v. or DVD I set dialogue enhancer to around +5 or +6 and that seems to be ok and then for Dts master audio I have it set same but have to lower master volume a bit but raise dialogue enhancer to +12 and again that seems to give me clarity in the voice then and nice surround sound etc but without it being overpowering for my living room.
 

Jase

Distinguished Member
Thank you as well Jase for your comment. In order to run DRC do I need to turn off dynamic volume first I guess as assume that overrules the DRC setting? I sort of need it for blu ray (DTS) though so it won't probably be an option but for now I think I have settings about right. I have receiver set to medium on Dynamic Volume and when watching t.v. or DVD I set dialogue enhancer to around +5 or +6 and that seems to be ok and then for Dts master audio I have it set same but have to lower master volume a bit but raise dialogue enhancer to +12 and again that seems to give me clarity in the voice then and nice surround sound etc but without it being overpowering for my living room.

Leaving Dynamic Volume on won't be an issue with DTS as the DRC setting has no effect any way. With Dolby material you may find the DRC options aren't available or greyed out if Dynamic Volume is on and vice versa (I'll check mine later). If they're both available then you could either use them together (which might conflict) or one or the other. I'd be surprised if both are able to be used together though.

You appear to have things sorted so far but having to raise the dialogue by +12db is quite unusual. Is your Centre speaker ok or in a strange position?
 

Daveyboy1985

Active Member
Yes I have a feeling that with DRC turned on if audyssey dynamic volume is on as well I think it disables DRC but will have to have a look.

Like I say I think by setting as I have done already I can probably get away with not using the DRC setting.

Speakers I have are the pioneer S-HS100. They sound really good even though they are smaller satellite speakers but as I don't have volume really loud they are more than adequate. The centre speaker is set up placed on same shelf as tv directly in front of it.

Audyssey set up the centre speaker at -0.5db. I have now changed this to 0db and like I said I just amend the dialogue enhancer a bit as and when I need to. The only time I need to go to +12 is on a blu ray DTS track. Without going this loud on the centre, I have found the effects to be too overpowering for my living room and lowering the overall volume to make the effects about right would mean not hearing speech which is why I need to adjust it for these films. DVD is much easier as I believe dynamic range in dolby is not quite as much so only need to add a few db to centre to hear it all perfectly.
 

Jase

Distinguished Member
Just checked my Marantz and it will let you have both Dynamic Volume and DRC on at the same time for Dolby material. Won't be using either personally but it seems odd it will allow you to have both on.
 

Daveyboy1985

Active Member
Thanks for checking. I expect with them both on then dynamic volume will overrule the DRC setting.

I may try with DRC on actually as a DVD I watched yesterday which probably wasn't mixed too well was so loud in places and very quiet still in others and that was with dynamic volume on heavy, so for me it's not helping in those situations. Whereas I think the DRC control on medium or high would probably cure the issue and as you said then with blu rays I can see how it is without dynamic volume but I know they work fine with it on so would just need to turn it on in those circumstances, as at the moment I'm messing with the audio settings in everything I watch as the sound is not quite right as one thing will be loud whereas next film will be quieter so have to change settings again.

Do you know why dynamic volume on is much louder than with it off? Also, with it on as the volume is lower in the unit it shows on the eco information that it's using a lot less power.
 

Jase

Distinguished Member
Do you know why dynamic volume on is much louder than with it off? Also, with it on as the volume is lower in the unit it shows on the eco information that it's using a lot less power.

To be honest I don't know. It's not something I use apart from testing to see what it did.

I tried it at -40db just watching BBC1 and the Light setting immediately sounded louder. Switching over to the Heavy setting and I found that there wasn't much difference between Off and Heavy at -40db in terms of overall volume level. However, when I tried at -20db then I had the complete opposite. Light didn't do a great deal but Heavy sounded a lot louder.

Presumably that's how it's supposed to work but it's not something I'd be using. It might be useful for those who watch TV a lot and don't want those big volume jumps when adverts come on.

ECO mode power consumption is volume dependent going by what it does when I was keeping an eye on the little OSD bar. I use my Marantz as a Processor so none of the internal amps are being used yet with ECO On the consumption still goes up and down. It's not powering any speakers at all so you'd expect it not to change but at -20db it's using more power than at -40db.

Weirdly, Auto did bugger all as it just stayed at the same higher consumption at both -20db and -40db.

ECO is again something I wouldn't use (especially if powering speakers) as it severely cuts the amount of juice going to them.

Not sure if that's really helped with your questions though!
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
Thanks for checking. I expect with them both on then dynamic volume will overrule the DRC setting.

I may try with DRC on actually as a DVD I watched yesterday which probably wasn't mixed too well was so loud in places and very quiet still in others and that was with dynamic volume on heavy, so for me it's not helping in those situations. Whereas I think the DRC control on medium or high would probably cure the issue and as you said then with blu rays I can see how it is without dynamic volume but I know they work fine with it on so would just need to turn it on in those circumstances, as at the moment I'm messing with the audio settings in everything I watch as the sound is not quite right as one thing will be loud whereas next film will be quieter so have to change settings again.

Do you know why dynamic volume on is much louder than with it off? Also, with it on as the volume is lower in the unit it shows on the eco information that it's using a lot less power.

AS I've already said, Dynamic Volume doesn't decrease the volume of louder effects and only enhances quieter aspects of the soundtrack. If the louder aspects are too loud then you have to decrease the master volume in order to diminish them. The Dynamic Volume is more in effect at lower volume levels and is applied relative to the proximity of the volume to 0db. The closer the mster volume to 0db then the less Dynamic Volume will be in effect.

The issue with using standard DRC is that it level of application is irrespective of the master volume.

No, the overall volume is not louder with Dynamic Volume on. Only the quieter aspects of the soundtrack are boosted and the louder aspects would be unadulterated and relative to the master volume level.
 

Daveyboy1985

Active Member
I have been using auto on eco mode as I guessed that as I have volume a bit lower the most would probably be listening at then it wouldn't make much difference in audio quality. Or am I wrong? What sort of wattage would be used if I turned it off?

No you have been very helpful and I appreciate any input so thank you for all the help.

Thank you, I understand a bit more I think now how this works so would best thing to do then if it's still a little too loud in overall sound eg. Effects be to lower overall volume and increase the dialogue enhancer to maximum (+12db)and that will be ok to do?

Oh ok I still don't quite understand the last paragraph as when I turn it on it all sounds really loud so have to turn master volume down so that it's not overpowering but that I can hear speech and then as soon as there's loads of music or something else going on other than talking then it sounds over top loud again, so a little confused I guess at what the best setting is still.
Thanks again.
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
Yes. If still unable to hear the dialogue at lower levels then maybe increase the dialogue level a little.

Dynamic Volume only effects softer and quieter aspects of the soundtrack and doesn't effect the louder aspects. You need to reduce the master volume in order to diminish the louder aspects of a soundtrack. Dynamic Volume simply pushes the quieter aspects up and makes them more audible at lower volumes.

You are not saving yourself a fortune by engaging the ECO mode. Everyone would love to reduce their carbon footprint, but there's no such thng as a magic button you can press that doesn't have a negative side to it as far as performance is concerned. If this were the case then there wouldn't be an ECO mode and every electrical device would be implementing such technology by default as standard. ECO mode on the AVRX3300 reduces the receiver to only being able to output a maximum of 20 watts per channel.

If you want the upmost performance then you should turn ECO mode off, but if you are more concerned about the planet and your bills then turn it on. Only the individual can decide, but don't assume you are getting the same performance while using such modes because you aren't or the mode would not be in existence to begin with.
 
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Daveyboy1985

Active Member
Thank you again for a very detailed response.

So I messed about with settings more and noticed that turning dialogue up and turning down master volume didn't really do a lot, it sounded well still loud but speech wasn't really loud enough. So I then turned off dialogue level control completely and instead turned up the centre speaker in the source level control by pressing the options button.
What a massive difference. I was able to up the volume on the speaker so i could comfortably hear it and the effects stayed lower. I tried with a few things including blu ray and it seems to have worked.

So, my understanding was that all dialogue level control did was just raise the centre speaker volume but this doesn't seem to be case as like I say it didn't seem to have much affect when using dynamic volume but actually just increasing overall centre volume did and it sounded better as well doing it this way.
Have you or anyone found this also?

Ah that makes sense regarding the eco mode so if in fact it doesn't really save much then I guess it might be better turning it off if it does have a negative impact on sound quality.
One thing I noticed is that when eco mode Is switched on or off, the unit clicks. I'm assuming that is normal?
 

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