DVI to HDMI adapters?

Discussion in 'Computer Components' started by lostbok, Sep 21, 2007.

  1. lostbok

    lostbok
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    I'm looking for a ATI Radeon 2600XT to output sound and video for an HTPC.

    Do any old DVI to HDMI cables / adapters work or will I have to make sure that I buy an adapter from the same manufacturer (or buy a card that includes an adapter)?
     
  2. Pincho Paxton

    Pincho Paxton
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    They all work, but you don't get sound through them. You need seperate audio cables.
     
  3. Badger0-0

    Badger0-0
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    HDMI is built to a standard.
    DVI is fully compatable with HDMI.

    So, it follows that anything should do, unless you're approaching the limits of the standard.

    If you have a short connection, say 2M or less, anything should work.
    Just avoid the absolute cheapest, IMO.
     
  4. lostbok

    lostbok
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    I'm fine for the HDMI cables: I've got a 1.5metre (and 0.75m) ProfiGold OxyPure cable (see spec below - it's decent stuff!).

    I also have an HDMI to DVI converter that I have used for transferring a signal from my laptop to the TV in the past (and I have run the audio via a co-axial lead into the amp).

    The question that I am asking now: The ATI Radeon 2600 series will provide both AC3 (surround) audio AND the HD res video. But some manufacturers say they include the "optional adapter" and some do not.

    Is this "optional adapter" doing anything that is custom / specific to this ATi feature (audio and video from DVI to HDMI)... or will any old HDMI/DVI adapter do?




    ProfiGold OxyPure info:

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  5. Badger0-0

    Badger0-0
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    Snake oil springs to mind ;)

    At short distances, all audio and video will be fine.

    You hear this frankly, balls, stuff about you need this super-duper cable at £200 quid or a £50 adapter all the time.

    Digital either works or it doesn't, there is no in-between.

    It's offering nothing special, apart from the fact that if your connection is on the limit, it might do a better job.

    What on earth does IAT do that a sufficiently screened lead can't :confused: EDIT this is probably a ferrite job, 50P worth EDIT

    Save your dough mate ;)
     
  6. Spinke

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    It's a special dvi-hdmi adapter from ATi. I tried to find one when I briefly had an HD2400Pro and it's next to impossible to find in the UK, as is the component breakout cable for ATi cards. I got no help with sourcing one either, GeCube nor AMD/ATi replied to my requests for help (I shall be buying nVIDIA in future!)

    Good luck, I hope you fare better than I did in finding one.
     
  7. Pincho Paxton

    Pincho Paxton
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  8. Badger0-0

    Badger0-0
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    It combines audio, that's all.

    Interesting though :smashin:

    I'd still go with the normal adaptor with a coax/optical , considering it's a one-off.
     
  9. lostbok

    lostbok
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    Pincho, ta for the link, unfortuantely most US companies refuse to ship to the UK (Newegg / TigerDirect or any of the bigger ones) and of the few that will... they often ship faulty / off-spec equipment 'cos they know it'll cost too much to ship it back... for the sake of the $11 gamble, I'll bear it in mind though - I can get stuff shipped to familly in the US, but it'll create extra cost / delays...

    Badger - that's the point: there is no co-ax / optical.... the only soundcard is actually on graphics card.
    And I had the cheap cables... several of them... all 3m or less... and I thought very much the same as you: "digital, it works or it doesn't", but it's not that straight-forward with HDMI... I was getting HDCP connectivity problems (menu's but no broadcast), intermittant picture outages and generally strange problems: borrowed a friend's Supra cable and all the stress went away... so went and bought some of my own stuff: already got the Profigold stuff and compared to the nasty plastic stuff it really looks the business: the only downside, it that with all the extra chunky shielding, etc the .75m cable is only JUST able to loop back on itself from the source (PS3) to the amp on the shelf below.

    Spinke - thanks, that's what I was worried about - Pincho's link might come in handy, personally, I'll just limit my choices slightly and stick with the ones that say that they provide the adapter / cable already.

    wrt to the graphics: Keep the faith, ATI have done some very good products over the last few years.... I was a complete nVidia fan from my first RIVA128 and then a TNT, TNT2 Ultra, GeForceDDR and then a had a few glitches: GeForce2 and three GeForce2 Ultra's died on me before I decided on a completely new rig.... and went with a GeForce3 Ti500... which I had some many strange problems with and eventually I got rid of it because of the poor quality (noisy) cooler on it... then went Radeon (9700PRO) - turns out I jumped ship just as ATI started to sort out their drivers... it was a beaut': the Hurcules version with about 9 heatsinks... set me back about £300!!... and a friend of mine is still using that to this day as his main gaming card (all he plays is unReal Tournament and that was better than his GeForce 4 MX :smashin:)... then an X800XL (not bad, passive cooling, but struggled with some games at 1600x1200)... an X1800XT - brilliantly fast (18 months ago), but the cooling was a bit noisy, so I got rid of it after about 3 months and sold it to CEX for the same price I'd got it for in the US :D and bought an X1950XTX as soon as they came out... which is what I'm running now...
     
  10. lostbok

    lostbok
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    word of warning... I thought I had bought an HIS card (2600XT, 512Mb) with the adapter - it's on the newegg site as beign part of the standard bundle, it's on the HIS site as being part of the standard bundle... and it's even on the OverClockers.co.uk site as being "integrated HDMI" and "audio and video all-in-one solution"....

    This was the label on the box I was sent....
    [​IMG]

    Scrape off the bit of black plastic on the box....
    [​IMG]

    So it looks like overclockers are shipping off-spec bundles!
     
  11. DeadEye

    DeadEye
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    That's not strictly true. The high frequencies generated by the sheer bandwidth require a fairly good quality cable. I read somewhere that clipping can occur in cheap cables resulting in a deminished picture quality.
     
  12. Badger0-0

    Badger0-0
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    If the cable is designed to the HDMI spec, it should do the job.
    Of course, if you're moving to a newer spec (1.3 etc) obviously you need a better cable, designed to meet that spec.
    Point is, it still shouldn't cost a fortune.
     
  13. Tech_Boy

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    I was also looking for the same card as yourself and found the only manufacturer to include the adapter is Sapphire. All the other brands stated requires additional adapter, this included HIS, Powercolor and Club3D. I looked at the 512mb card but believe it is using the old GDDR3 memory which I didn't want so have bought the 256mb Sapphire 2600XT GDDR4 from Scan Computers and being a AVF member you get free shipping on all purchases thanks to the new loyalty scheme. Anyway here's the link: http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/ProductInfo.asp?WebProductID=633077
     
  14. lostbok

    lostbok
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    Badger - it's got nothing to do with cable spec: the DVI out on the ATI cards needs a specially mapped adapter.... got my parents to order one (in the US) and then they'll post it through.

    Tech Boy - the HIS spec from the US DOES include an adapter... agreed - the only Euro-spec that explicitly includes the adpater is the Sapphire.... you're not gonan get anything extra with GDDR4, it's a pretty poor gaming card whichever way you cut it... I only got the 512 'cos it was in stock and the 256 wasn't.... 256Mb of GDDR3 is going to push the GPU to 99% of it's potential anyway.... that's where the bottleneck is....

    Good to hear about the Scan free delivery option - would have saved me a fortuen this year!!
     
  15. RDarling

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    I am having difficulty getting any sound out through my DVI to HDMI cable so will probably try this.

    URL removed as it would not fix the problem.

    At least it is a UK site.

    Robert
     
  16. lostbok

    lostbok
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    Robert. Stop!

    I've GOT one of those - it works perfectly for video... but NOT audio.

    You can get the basic HDMI to DVI cables from market stalls for about £2 and the fully wired, gold plated, etc versions from Comet / Currys for <£10 (or less online)... but these are only designed to do video.

    On my 2600XT, Vista has detected and installed all the Catalyst drivers for the "ATI HD Audio Device" and is supposedly outputting AC3 audio, but without the special ATI version of the HDMI-DVI adapter, you will not be able to get any audio over.

    Problem is that nobody had previously envisaged a graphics card having an audio card built onto the same board, so the DVI to HDMI pin-out is just designed to do video... ATI have their own little custom mapping where specific DVI pins that aren't required for video are then used to send the surround sound.
     
  17. dave_bass5

    dave_bass5
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    Hey Guys.
    I ordered a Sapphire HD2600XT AGP from microdirect. It comes with a DVI-HDMI adaptor. Well, it would hav eif they had sent me the right card. As it was they sent me the VGA/TV/DVI card that doesnt. I was going to return it but couldn't be bothered as i have a feeling it would be a long process to get it replaced (it was already going that way).
    Anyway, what i found is that you have to use the ATI adaptor for sound, nothing else will do other than ones on ebay (that seem to be out of stock).
    A normal one wont carry the sound as others have said.
     
  18. RDarling

    RDarling
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    Yes, I had realised that this would not work after reading up some more.

    I will just have to look at getting a real ATI one, although they are pretty difficult to come by in the UK.

    Robert
     
  19. lostbok

    lostbok
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    I've just ordered one from the AMD website, but had to get it sent via my parents in the US. Only £3.50 for the adapter though!

    I will be trying it out tonight!
     
  20. Kyrt

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    For interested parties, I have found what looks to be an ATI-specific adapter for sale in the UK from Komplett. It is listed as "HIS DVI to HDMI adapter". The Komplett site is sparse on details, but this is the same product as that listed on newegg (same part number) which does specify designed for HD 2X00 models.

    http://www.komplett.co.uk/k/ki.aspx?sku=342932

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814999007

    I haven't bought this yet myself as I don't actually own an HD television, but I'm thinking for the future. If anyone does buy this, could they report their success in getting audio to work please? I would not be able to test it myself.
     
  21. alberto17

    alberto17
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    Hi guys,

    I'm close to ordering a desktop PC from Dell which will include the following:
    256MB ATI® Radeon™ HD 2400 XT graphics card

    I'm also getting a Panasonic TH37PX70 on Saturday.

    Having read through this post I understand the following:

    I need to buy a DVI to HDMI adapter and plug that into the graphics card. Then I need an HDMI cable that plugs into the adapter and into the television.

    Will this will then take care of both the video and audio feed to the television ignoring the normal onboard sound card?
     
  22. dave_bass5

    dave_bass5
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    Thats about it. Just make sure you get the ATI adapter.
    You then need to set your windows sound device to HDMI audio and your good to go...sort of ;-)
     
  23. pjclark1

    pjclark1
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    Ati have deliberately disabled the sound chip on their graphics cards, the ati HDMI/DVI adapter is a custom dongle that appears to link two of the normally unused DVI pins, to tell the soundchip to turn on. If you use any other make of adapter or an DVI to HDMI cable then the sound over HDMI will not work.

    Just to point out that the audio packets and video packets on an HDMI lead go down the same wires, there is no custom mapping, Ati deliberately disable the sound output on their graphics cards, to force you into buying their adapter.
     
  24. Wo0zy

    Wo0zy
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    Try http://www2.computeruniverse.net/default.asp

    These adpters will work and they ship to the UK.

    Also. Don't stress to much about getting HDMI audio working at all. ATi's current solution offers nothing over SPDIF other than a single cable to your receiver for video and 2-channel PCM or AC3, or a single cable to your TV for video and 2-channel PCM. There is no audio quality advantage at all.

    Here's hoping for an HDMI 1.3 solution soon. Alternatively Intel G35 as it offers multi-channel PCM over HDMI.

    I can't believe we're in 2008 and the HTPC industry is still playing catch-up :suicide:

    Cheers,

    Wo0zy
     
  25. dave_bass5

    dave_bass5
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    I agree with WoOzy about having audio over HDMI is no big deal but i do find it useful for normal day to day PC work like web browsing on YouTube for example. I cant always be bothered to turn the amp on and this works great IMHO.
     
  26. Wo0zy

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    Fair play.

    I'm so wrapped up in Home Cinema use these days I tend to forget about everything else. Having said that if the receiver is off and you connect audio and video through it how do you get sound when the receiver is off?

    If you run SPDIF or multi-channel analogue to the receiver and HDMI directly to the TV surely you need to switch default audio outputs depending on your requirements? Probably good for the environment but is it easier than pressing an on/off button?

    Just kidding. You could be running XP :D

    Cheers,

    Wo0zy
     
  27. dave_bass5

    dave_bass5
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    Good points and i guess we all have different needs.
    My PC isnt really a HTPC. It used more for net, photo editing and music writing than HTPC. I have my HD2600XT connected to my 40" TV via the HDMI lead (with audio) and a SPDIF connection to my amp.
    Its no so much that i dont need surrond most of the time but as we have a smallish flat and two kids i find the sound from the Tv is less Room shaking than having the amp on during the evening. plus if i then turn the Tv over i have to turn the amp off. It all make sense to me.
    Your right, i am using XP pro and i do have to switch between SPDIF and HDMI but we only whatch films maybe once or twice a week from the PC so its not the end of the world to change over. plus the girlfriend can work the Tv but has no idea about whats needed at the PC end.

    I do have Vista ultimate as a duel boot but cant get MCE to start up in the correct aspect ratio so i dont tnd to use it much.
     
  28. alberto17

    alberto17
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    dave_bass5 , thanks for the reply :thumbsup:

    May I please bother you guys with a few questions: (sorry for any stupid questions, I havent bought a PC for myself in ages)

    1. I want to connect my PC (most likely the Dell Inspiron 530s currently at 499 quid on their website) to my Plasma TV (Panasonic TH37PX70) ( both of which I dont yet have :D ). If I use the PC as normal for gaming and in windows, i.e. not playing any HD material, will it make any difference if I use:
    • a DVI to HDMI adapter and connecting to the TV with HDMI cable?
    • a normal VGA connection?
    Perhaps my TV cant even accept HDMI from the PC?


    2. I want our PC to double as a TV in the bedroom. So I'm thinking of upgrading the PC to include a TV tuner and also go for a 22" screen.

    The default screen that comes with the PC is the Dell E207WFP, a normal 20" wide flat panel

    I can upgrade to the Dell E228WFP widescreen LCD flat panel for an extra 30 quid
    http://accessories.euro.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?c=uk&l=en&s=dhs&cs=ukdhs1&sku=88221#Overview
    I can also upgrade to the Dell SP2208WFP 22-inch widescreen flat panel for an extra 38 quid
    http://accessories.euro.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?c=uk&l=en&s=dhs&cs=ukdhs1&sku=130010#Overview

    Is there any reason at all why I shouldnt go for the latter one, which seems to be a much newer type of screen, including HDMI connectivity, integrated webcam, 2ms response time vs 5ms from the other 22 inch. Is this a no brainer? :suicide: btw. on the Dell website when you view these two 22" screens as normal products (not part of a desktop deal) the latter is way cheaper than the other one? Which screen would be better for gaming and internet browsing and which would be best to use as TV screen? Please help?!


    3. Is it worth it using the PC for a TV in the bedroom? Better picture than the normal old CRT? Also, would there be any difference in the type of connection from PC to Screen when I use different type of connections:
    • Normal VGA
    • DVI to DVI
    • DVI via adapter to HDMI

    I hope what I'm asking is clear enough... if I missed something important in my setup please inform me and please add any suggestions that I'm not even thinking of !
    :lease:
     
  29. Wo0zy

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    All makes sense mate. :)

    Have you posted your Vista problems anywhere else? I would imagine it'd be nice to get that one sorted.

    Cheers,

    Wo0zy.
     
  30. dave_bass5

    dave_bass5
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    I have posted about it and got a few responces but i still cant get it right.
    If i use MCE to open a film it will run full screen but to fit rather than the correct AR even though i have every thing i can find set to keep the correct AR. if i then click restore down on that window and then back to full screen again all is fine.
    I would be happy using MPC (i use this for 99% of my films in XP) but i cant get it to register as a handler and so have to go hunting for it each time rather than double clicking on the film.
    To be honest im not to worried at the mo as my soundcard (M-audio 2496) doesnt support DTS under Vista so i wouldnt use it much to watch films until the drivers are sorted out. I instale dit more to get used to it before i need to switch over.

    Alberto.
    Sorry, i cant help you much but i can tell you if you can use your Plasma for PC stuff it looks fantastic in 40"'s of glorious HD. I have a Samsung LE40R88 and i use HDMI rather than the D-Sub connector
    There is no difference quality wise between DVI-HDMI and HDMI-HDMI but on smaller screens i dont know if you would see a difference between VGA and DVI.
     

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