DVD's that show off Progressive Scan

Discussion in 'Projectors, Screens & Video Processors' started by Kevin Harris, Feb 9, 2002.

  1. Kevin Harris

    Kevin Harris
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    Hi,

    Are there any DVD's that really show off a Progressive Scan DVD like the Denon 2800.

    After reading an article that states that most dvd's are encoded in interlaced format with the progressive information there also. Are there any DVD's encoded in Progressive format to begin with that will make you stand back and go WOW!!!!


    Kevin.
     
  2. Stuart Wright

    Stuart Wright
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    All DVDs are encoded for interlaced playback so your question doesn't really make sense. That article you read was rubbish.
    What you really want is a DVD with a good picture. Unfortunately most DVDs have horrid edge enhancement and too many reviewers don't notice. Or know it exists. E.g. the Total DVD reviews of Phantom Menace. Which got a 5 star review despite having a very poor picture.
    R1 Braveheart has a good picture.
     
  3. Kevin Harris

    Kevin Harris
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    Thanks Spectre,

    I am still trying to see any difference between PS and Interlace settings on the denon 2800.

    The one main issue I have is that I still have the comb effect on left or right movement on all the DVD's I have tried. Maybe you can confirm that I will never get this artefact to vanish completely and am expecting to much from PS.


    Kev.
     
  4. Stuart Wright

    Stuart Wright
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    How good the picture looks depends on your entire video system.
    I don't get any combing effect and I do get perfectly smooth pans - but then I use a home cinema PC into a CRT projector.
    I don't know what is or isn't possible from a progressive scan DVD player. Apparently there should be a difference and progressive scan should look (much?) better. So when you say you can't see a difference, I'm thinking that something isn't working right.
     
  5. GearHead

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    Kevin,

    I think an excellent one to try would be 2001:A Space Oddyssey. If you go to chapter 4 there are a number of "fly-bys" of white space-craft against a black background. This will generate terrible jaggies around the edges of the space-craft on an interlaced display. If I view the same scenes on my PC - totally smooth.

    The difference is so pronounced you would not believe you are playing the same disk.

    Allan
     
  6. Kevin Harris

    Kevin Harris
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    Thanks Spectre, Gearhead,

    I will try the 2001 chapter 4 test but I am sure the comb effect will still be visible.

    I really think from what you are saying Spectre that something is not right with my setup, I can only look at the DENON 2800 or the Sony Cineza projector as being the culprits.

    All I have to go on at the moment is that the Denon DVD has the Blue Light to indicate that Progressive mode is on and my projector when I go to the menu will show the mode as 480/60p or 575/50p for NTSC or PAL respectively.

    I think a good step would be to try the DVD in a known working system and help to rule out if it is the player or the projector that is the problem. Not going to be easy to find this setup though unless I can find a shop locally willing to help.

    Took me 8 weeks through 1 thing or another to get my setup towards Progressive so a real disappointment if something is not wrong :/

    Cheers guys

    Kev.
     
  7. Stuart Wright

    Stuart Wright
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    Progressive scan itself is a way to display video. If you watch it on a system which is lacking in some way, it will look bad. If you watch it on a good system, it will look good. So it's not 'progressive scan' which is a disappointment - it would be the equipment you are using.
    I've had a look at the specs for the projector. 480p is a native resolution - but it's not enough lines for a large image - say 6 foot plus. Try reducing the image size down to 4 feet wide. Does it look better? At larger sizes you will see the lines - and this might be the problem. You really need 720p or more. Which, of course, your DVD player can't do.
    Try playing a DVD using Power DVD on your PC (you'll need a £50 radeon VE card or Nvidia card) and setting the resolution to 1280x720 @ 60Hz. Hopefully the projector can cope. If not try [email protected] The picture should look significantly better. Try 72Hz, and if the projector can cope you're on to a winner.
     
  8. Kevin Harris

    Kevin Harris
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    Thanks Spectre,

    I am going to have to buy the VGA cable now to try out your suggestion, another £85 to Sony :/

    I have been looking into HTPC but always thought it to be a lot of trouble and wanted the easy plug and play approach to Home Cinema, Good DVD and great sound with a cheapish Projector.

    But as always it is never as simple as it sounds, well unless you have deep pockets.

    To be honest I am very happy with my setup and thought adding PS would just make things that bit better on a projector that could handle the PS signal but my expectations were built up on reading too many articles by people who have systems that will show PS to its true heights

    Thanks again for your help.


    Kev.
     
  9. Gordon @ Convergent AV

    Gordon @ Convergent AV
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    Kevin,

    There is some confusion here. Your fixed pixel projector already shows you a progressive image when it is fed an interlaced signal from any source. The benefit of using the progressive output of your DVD2800 is that it should do the de-interlacing to create the progressive image to a higher standard than the chipset in the projector.

    To demonstrate the difference, very obviously, just play the opening scene of Star Trek Insurrection. Look at the bridge over the river, the canoes on stilts on the river bank and the roofs of all the houses. With interlace going to your projector there will be jaggy edges all over the place. With progressive signal you should see hardly any. Those you do see will be down the pixel structure of your projector. The reason there's such a big difference is because the DVD2800 has 2:3 and 2:2 sequence recognition and it can re-constitute the picture back iin to the original film frames whereas the projector cannot.

    Hope this is of use,

    Gordon
     
  10. Kevin Harris

    Kevin Harris
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    Gordon,

    Luckily I have Insurrection PAL and have given it a try, both Interlaced and non-interlaced look the same to my eyes but I will put the sequence on A-B loop and give it a closer look. In saying that I must say the picture is slightly better on the non-interlaced setting but very slight smother curves but the comb effect is the same.

    The one observation I have made is when in the Denon setup menu and I change from interlaced to progressive the slight flicker is gone and the picture is rock solid on progressive.

    I guess it is possible that the internal circuitry on the Projector is close to the quality of the Silicon Image of the Denon!

    Cheers

    Kev.
     
  11. Gordon @ Convergent AV

    Gordon @ Convergent AV
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    Kevin,

    I've never done this with region2 discs. Should be obvious difference though.

    So, what connections are you using between DVD and projector?
    Do you have DVD player set to 16:9 MODE?
    If so I presume you have projector set to 16:9 mode as well?

    Gordon
     
  12. Kevin Harris

    Kevin Harris
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    Gordon,

    The connection between the DVD and the projector is what looks like a good quality sony 5m cable that cost me a damn £85 cause of the custom connector on the back of the projector (PJ_Multi).

    It not to say i could not make a better cable with the Van Damme 75ohm video Coax I have lying around.

    Yes the projector and the DVD are in 16:9 mode.

    I have now played a few R1 dvds and the same result the comb effect is still very evident.

    Cheers

    Kev.
     
  13. Gordon @ Convergent AV

    Gordon @ Convergent AV
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  14. Kevin Harris

    Kevin Harris
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    Gordon,

    Nothing would give me more pleasure than to get you expert eye and expertise to look at my setup.

    I will e-mail you my address and we can sort a time that best suits us both for a visit.


    Cheers

    Kev.
     
  15. Dan5

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    I believe the Denon only does progressive scan with NTSC disks and not PAL disks. At least that is what they say on their web site at www.denon.co.uk

    Dan
     

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