DVD Recorders?, help needed! Please

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by MrCoopz, Mar 9, 2003.

  1. MrCoopz

    MrCoopz
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    OK my Video is getting on a bit and i thought instead of a New decent Video Player for £150+, I could go down the DVD recorder road and ive seen them as cheap as £350

    I was looking for recommendations for the Best DVD recorders for minimal money.

    At the moment i know nothing about them, from the quality of recordings, to recording TV and if they do most of the stuff VHS videos do??.

    Any help will be great
     
  2. MrCoopz

    MrCoopz
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  3. Vection

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    I haven't come across those ones yet but i'd recomend doing a search on this forum. There is a wealth of info in past threads.

    if there's any thing you want to know after that then i'm sure that some one will know the answer!
     
  4. Costas

    Costas
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    DV-550 is a player not a recorder...!?
     
  5. MrCoopz

    MrCoopz
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    Oh i just clicked recorable and it came up with that.

    Is this Digitron Recordable???

    http://www.futuretronic-uk.com/page1.html

    How exactly do these work, are they just like VHS recorders but just write to DVD instaed??

    As i say i have no idea about these
     
  6. Rasczak

    Rasczak
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    No - its only a DVD player.

    If your after a DVD recorder there are three types to choose from. This is not as alarming as it might sound though - unlike the VHS v Betamax war of the 80s all three formats will survive concurrently as all three media types is used for PC solutions, all play normal DVD Videos etc

    Therefore you should choose your DVD recorder based on what you want it to do.

    DVD-RAM/DVD-R
    This format is supported by Panasonic, JVC, Toshiba, Hitachi and Samsung (DVD-R is also supported by Pioneer and Sony). This is an official format of the DVD Forum (and part of the DVD Multi brand). Recording to RAM means a non linear format which allows timeshifting, editting etc, i.e. it is like a VCR with the functionality of a TIVO (but no EPG obviously). This format also has the advantage of a Flexible Bitrate. Recording to a -R disk is akin to using a normal VCR. DVD-Rs will play in 90% of DVD Players but RAM disks will only play in a small number of players (although this is increasing now the DVD Multi concept has been introduced)

    DVD-RW/DVD-R
    This format is supported by Pioneer and Sony (with DVD-R also supported by those listed above). Again this is an official format of the DVD Forum (and part of the DVD Multi brand). I've never owned a DVD-RW machine so perhaps others can give better advice here. DVD-Rs will play in 90% of DVD Players but, like RAM disks, -RW will not play in that many players if you use the VR Mode (again this is increasing with DVD Multi).

    DVD+RW/+R
    This format is supported by Philips and Sony (the latter are also in the DVD-RW/-R camp). It is also supported by a number of smaller companies that use Philips supplied parts. This format is slightly cheaper than the others and recordings made on the rewriteable media (+RW) will play in around 50-60% of 'normal' DVD players but lacks the editting facilities of the other formats as it is a linear format. It should be noted that the current batch of DVD recorders from Philips have been beset with troubles - hopefully this will be resolved soon.

    Hope this gives you some idea. Have a look around the internet for more comprehensive advice. My first DVD Recorder was the Philips DVDR1000 which was OK. I then swapped to Panasonic's E20 as this offered the best way to archive my 100+ VHS recordings due to the variable bitrate.
     
  7. Aletank

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    If your looking for a "cheap" DVD Recorder there's only 2 or 3 to choose from really

    Philips DVDR880 about £340

    Philips DVDR890 about £440

    Panasonic DMR-E30 about £400

    Panasonic DMR-E50 about £400 (later model of above)

    Your main choice will be between the Phillips & Panasonic, Theres plenty of threads on this forum comparing the Philips DVDR880 and the Panasonic DMR-E30.
     
  8. ferris57

    ferris57
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    Nicely put Rasczak. The best summary of the formats Ive seen. Refreshing to see a non biased explanation!
     
  9. MrCoopz

    MrCoopz
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    Thanks for all the info guys

    ill look into buying a phillips one

    1 question that hasnt been answered can a DVD recorder do all a VHS player can do??

    like setting a timer to record, recording TV, the quality of recordings (how much better is it than VHS?), Fast forward, chapters? All these questions just popped into my head :)

    Thanks
     
  10. Fuel Crusher

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    Sod non-biased, don't buy a philips! Get the Panny.
     
  11. ferris57

    ferris57
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    "Sod non-biased, don't buy a philips! Get the Panny."

    lol. The man has a point!
     
  12. rcladin

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    Hi - If you've got a PC you could just get yourself a Pioneer A-05 for about £200 nicker, can use it as a dvd recorder.

    just like a computer dvd-rom that burns dvd's.

    You can get software on the web to make backup copies of your dual layer format dvd onto single layer discs, or single layer backup straight away without any messing.

    The pioneer can burn at upto 4 speed

    It is DVD-R and DVD-RW, compatible,

    I go with -R because it is the cheapest media, at around 80pence per dvd-r for a good quality disc but you can get them cheaper than this also. +R media tends to be more expensive.

    If you wanted to record programmes from TV onto DVD hopever, not as straightforward as a standalone machine, is possible but would need to purchase extra hardware most likely.

    -r
     
  13. malcom

    malcom
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    MrCoopz. To answer you question. DVD recorders can do everything that VHS does and much more. Picture quality using standard play setting blow VHS into oblivion. (The sooner the better) You won't see any loss of picture quality as you do with VHS.

    I have opted for the Panny format and am very strongly biased about that format for good reason!! They are fantastic in every respect. I considered the Philips format for many months and am now so so glad I was wise enough to buy the Panny instead.

    I do recommend you don't rush in!!! Do some research (As you are now). Good luck. Malcom.
     
  14. MrCoopz

    MrCoopz
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    Why is everyone disliking the Phillips models?

    And i have just seen these questions about the E30, these were asked about DVD-R

    and the answers

    Now this has me worried, what disks would i need to do the above and how much do they cost?

    Because im not interested in Archiving DVDs just yet, all i want is a few disks to record the footy and so on then erase them after.

    Thanks and sorry for asking so many questions :)
     
  15. DaveP

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    You need DVD-RAM disks to be able to delete and re-use. These can be used up to 100,000 time!

    Go for the Pannie! You can record the footie and start watching the game from the beginning while it's still recording! Great for when you get back late from the pub!

    DaveP
     
  16. ferris57

    ferris57
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    yeah, dvd-ram. They cost £2.99 each for mirror ones (meant to be excellent). or about £12 if you buy panasonic ones!
     
  17. bobbles

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    I would also recommend the Panny format

    two things that finally swung it were the VBR on the Panny and very worrying reliability of the Philips

    check out www.dvdplusrw.org forums

    If you read them I think you will opt for the Panny
     
  18. MrCoopz

    MrCoopz
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    Ok more questions for u

    Would u go for the E-30 or E-50??

    and if i recorded something on a DVD-RAM disk in EP mode could i keep that on there and record something else with XP mode?

    in other words does the disk just use one format like LP or SP on VHS or can u mix recording modes on the disk?

    A stupid question here, can u watch TV through it? (i have a Panny PTAE-100 PJ, so i watch TV through the VCR)

    and lastly the E-50 has progressive scan (i think i read) this would be ideal for my PJ, but how what leads do u need to use the Pro scan function?
     
  19. philipb

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    As an E30 owner, I'm not 100% sure of the E50 specs but as lomg as it does what you need then go for the more up to date machine. alternatively look for good deals on the E30.

    Yes you can mix recording modes on a disc.

    Yes you can watch TV through it. E30 has a very good tuner.

    Can't answer the last one.
     
  20. Costas

    Costas
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    Progressive scan is only available through "component" type of connection, not RGB scart or S-video or composite. You should check but I think the E30 / E50 machines do not have component output connections.
     
  21. bobbles

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    The E-30 Spec do say it features component output

    However this is not done through seperate component leads but through RGB scart aparently

    The E50 is almost identical to the E30. If memory serves correctly the only difference was the E50 features firewire? which makes recording from a camcorder easier.

    you may be able to pick up the E30 cheaper. RS had multiregion E30s for 399 not long ago

    There was talk of DVD-RAM now being available for £1.99
     
  22. MrCoopz

    MrCoopz
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    The E-50 has a Dolby Digital decoder in it and the E-30 dosn't.

    So i read
     
  23. ferris57

    ferris57
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    The e30 deff does have proper component out, at least mine does :) . So you would need a set of component cables if you wanted to make use of this (I believe triple phono's work!). All the other questions have been answered I think.

    If multiregion is important now, buy the e30. Other than that I think the e50 would have to be your choice, simply because it's the latest model more than anything else (it's also the same price if not cheeper than the e30 anyway).
     
  24. philipb

    philipb
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    ferris57

    Where did you get your E30? UK sourced ones definitely DO NOT have component out - at least mine does not. The outputs are AV1 SCART (RGB; s-video or composite); and AV4 s-video and composite round the back via 4 pin mini din and phono connectors.

    If bobbles has seen a spec for the E30 quoting component it must be non-UK.
     
  25. calscot

    calscot
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    I was confused about which to buy around November.

    Panny:

    For: Random access which means the programmes can be fragmented over the disc meaning you can recover all the space. A bit like minidisc.

    Against: RAM discs only compatible with a few of the latest (panny) players.

    For: Flexible recording mode which allows you to fill a disc with a programme at the best possible quality for the space available.

    Against: Rewritable media slightly more expensive.

    For: Chasing playback (pause and resume live tv) and you can watch a previous recording while recording another.

    Against: Expensive and difficult to multi-region.

    For: instant 30 second fast forward.

    Against: More expensive to buy than Phillips.

    For: 5 star reviews.

    Against: Only 1 year warranty.



    Philips:

    For: Cheaper than Panny.

    Against: Linear (vcr) type recording which means you need the right amount of space or you write over a previous recording.

    For: Stocked by Richer sounds who beat any internet price by 10 pounds and do a 5 year warranty for 60 quid. That meant the Philips was about the same price from a shop as the Panny was on-line BUT with a 5 year warranty.

    Against: Only 4 record modes.

    For: Multiregion out of the box.

    Against: No chasing playback or watch/record.

    For: +RW cheaper than RAM.

    For: +RW compatible with most existing players. You can record something and lend it to your friends, get it back and then record over it. Or you can use your old player (or friends player) to copy something you've recorded onto another +rw or +r after hiding all the adverts etc.

    For: Compatability means that, as neither has prog scan (the american panny does but not european) this means that in the near future I can buy a Philips 963SA and play films recorded on +RW as prog scan on a projector.

    For: statistics for video jitter, signal to noise ratio etc are much better than panny.

    For: 5 star reviews.

    For: Reasonable CD playback.

    Against: annoying to use fast forward rewind functions.

    For: faster finalization.


    The quality of recording for both models is reputed to be similar. Watching a recording in standard mode is almost indestinguishable from watching live. Sound is just as good too, with none of the VCR hiss. Philips has trusurround, not sure about the panny.

    The -r dics are cheaper than +r's but I've got about 15 +rw's at about 3 quid each and have a few I still haven't opened. I don't ever use +r's. Depends whether you watch things again and again in a short space of time. Films tend to come around again and again on the telly anyway.

    I'm not sure about reliability of both models. I bought the Philips and it started playing up a couple of months later. I took it back to Richer Sounds and they exchanged it for a boxed new one straight away. No waiting, no fuss. An advantage of buying from a local shop and having a decent warranty.

    If you want something that just acts as a fantastic vcr then go for the philips.

    If you want something with extra features but no compatability (a bit like having a betamax in some ways but not in others) then go for the Panny.

    If you want to save money, get the philips.

    If you want MR out of the box at no extra cost, get the philips.

    If you want to archive a lot, get the panny.

    Cheers,
    Cal
     
  26. ferris57

    ferris57
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    No, you quite right mate lol! I just dragged it out of the cabinet and it doesn't have component. I've bought a few players this past month and I had an image in my head of the back of the e30 and it turns out I must of been thinking of one of the others.
    My mistake. Thought I better clear this up before everyone starts asking why their recorder doesn't have it ;)
     
  27. wellsi

    wellsi
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    People have posted that the unreliability of the Philips machines means they cannot use it to replace the VCR; unlike the exceptionally reliable Panny.
    Both machines make discs that are compatible on most other dvd players so compatibilty is really a non-issue.

    - R media is much cheaper than + R.
    Several different manufactures are bringing out -R and RAM recorders, some with hard drives.
    Sony, (Philips only major ally on their format) is already hedging its bets by producing multi format machines to handle dvd-r discs as well.

    Whilst other manufacturers bring out higher spec models with buiilt in hard drives as well (to allow adverts to be removed before transferring to dvd-r), the mechanics making up +RW recording means this will not happen in teh near future.

    Given this, I think it's a little misleading to state that the Panny is akin to Betamax, and perhaps we need to remind ourselves of the old (Philips owned) V2000 format... (grin)

    Pretty well covered in this link...New Dvd Recorders

    Cheers
     
  28. malcom

    malcom
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    The Panny format bears no resemblance to a Betamax scenario at all. (Ex Betamax owner). All formats are capable of producing compatible to DVD player recorded discs. So whatever format you choose you will be ok with regard to compatibility with existing DVD players. Blue-ray if it ever gets off the ground in any serious form will throw a spanner in the work for all formats and probably the present DVD format itself. So don't wait for blu-ray!!!. It may never happen as other technoligies are also in the pipe line that will achieve the longer record times of blu-ray

    As I have indicated I am a biased Panny owner and certainly don't think the plus format is a suitable replacement for the VCR. Linear recording (Philips) just how backwards can that be in todays technology of Hard discs and RAM and all the flexibility they bring.

    I think I can say for certain is that you would not be dissapointed with the Panny machine. Reading the plus forum which I did for months anticipating I would plum for that format I would have no confidence in assuming you would not eventually feel let down. Not just from the reliability point of view but from the functional aspects of the design as well.
     
  29. Fuel Crusher

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    Malcom, I also spent many weeks last summer deciding which machine to opt for and visited the +RW forum alot. Fortunately I decided on the panny and got one on the day of release :clap: no regrets at all. I've recently re-visited the +RW forum and it appears that all the happy +RW owners must have stopped visiting as it seemed to be just a forum for gripes and complaints.
    Paul
     
  30. wellsi

    wellsi
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    How many gripes do you ever hear about the Panny?

    'Nuff said...
     

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