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DVD-R - Why fine in one player but not in another?

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by jesmat2003, Feb 13, 2005.

  1. jesmat2003

    jesmat2003
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    Sorry if this has been discussed before.

    System:
    PC Burner: Sony DVD-RW (DW-D18A)
    Burning Software: Pinnacle Instant Copy 8 SE
    DVD-Rs: Verbatim Pastel (x8)
    DVD Player: Panasonic A360 (just over five years old)
    DVD Recorder: Panasonic E85 (10 months old)

    I recently bought some Verbatim Pastel DVD-R (x8) which I haven't used before and so tested one by burning a film in my PC's DVD-RW drive. The resulting DVD-R played fine in my PC drive but I noticed on my stand-alone Panasonic DVD Player that at one point the film suffered slight picture break up and momentary loss of sound. I burnt a second copy of the film on my PC, this time turning the write speed down to minimum. Again, the film seemed to play perfectly on my PC but this time suffered a few more instances of picture / sound break up when played in my Panasonic DVD Player, although not in the same place as the first DVD-R. I then tried playing both DVD-Rs in my Panasonic DVD Recorder and both recordings appeared to play perfectly.

    Is this a common phenomenon? And what is the most likely cause of the discs displaying occasional picture break-up in my Panasonic DVD Player? Is it the PC Burner, the discs, the software I'm using or my Panasonic A360?
     
  2. JayCee

    JayCee
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    It's probably down to a failing laser in the A360.
    The lasers used only output about 1mw of power and this decreases as they age, also the reflectivity of the discs have a bearing on this too.
    When these players were manufactured home burning of Dvd's was in it's infancy, hence why your more modern Dvd recorder can play them okay.
     
  3. slowen

    slowen
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    I hate the Pinnacle instant copy software I found it to be cr@p and quickly changed to Nero as I found I was getting better results and it was writing a lot quicker than the pinnacle software.
     
  4. MartinImber

    MartinImber
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    Oldish player - sounds like the laser is on its way out.

    Next you will get macroblocking on seemingly good DVDs - within another couple of hundred hours of use

    Need to start contemplating new players - ie get you distress purchase descision ready - mine changed 4 times in the last few years with mine!
     
  5. jesmat2003

    jesmat2003
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    What sort of better results? I'm quite new to PC DVD burning and Instant Copy came bundled with the PC. Apart from this problem (which may have nothing to do with the software) I've found Instant Copy to work very well.
     
  6. jesmat2003

    jesmat2003
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    Thanks for the advice. At least players cost about a tenth of what they did when I bought mine in January 2000. One thing I've noticed though is that Panasonic branded DVD-Rs (x4) burned using the same PC burner and software appear to all work fine on the A360. So perhaps my A360 just doesn't like Verbatims (x8)?
     
  7. slowen

    slowen
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    It took over an hour to burn 4.7gb onto a DVD with Pinnacle and it only takes 14 minutes with Nero

    You cannot beat Nero, the best burning software I have used and Roxio easy DVD comes a close second
     
  8. redsox_mark

    redsox_mark
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    Different discs have different compatibilities (as do different players and recorders). Some players/recorders seem to handle most any media; others (especially if it is an older player) tend to be more fussy. I don’t think it is just Verbatim 8X (which is a quality disc) that is the problem, but it is possible for some discs (e.g. Panasonic) to work while others don’t.

    If you look at the A360 on videohelp.com, you see a mixed record of discs it will play and will not…

    http://www.videohelp.com/dvdplayers.php?DVDnameid=226&Search=Search&nextcomments=0#comments

    Mark
     
  9. pjclark1

    pjclark1
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    you should always write a dvdr at its rated speed (or higher)
    writing at a slower speed nearly always produces inferior results.
    A dvd writer is designed to produce the best results at its design speed.
    A dvdr is designed to produce the best results at its design speed.
    Somewhere at, or between the 2 will work fine, slower than both will be a disaster.
     
  10. jesmat2003

    jesmat2003
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    Thanks for that. I followed the link and can see from the comments that the A360 generally accepts Verbatim discs, although there are no comments yet concerning X8 discs. I bought the Verbatims because I've never had any problems with their X4 discs and prefer to spend a bit extra for quality discs. I think it may just be the case that the A360 is quite an old machine now and perhaps it just doesn't like 8 speed DVD-Rs. I've now ordered a couple of boxes of Panasonic x4 DVD-Rs, which I've also found to be very good quality discs and seem to work on the A360 without any problems. With the few X4 Verbatims I've got left these should tide me over until the A360 finally needs replacing.

    Many thanks for everyone's replies.
     
  11. brownrog

    brownrog
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    The comments in this thread relating to the probable reason for your older player exhibiting this problem are entirely valid.

    But I can tell you reliably that there are known problems with Verbatim 8x DVD-R media. I deal with two well-known and respected trade media suppliers and both now acknowledge these problems. They occur when recording discs that are fairly full, generally >4GB of content, they occur just before the end of a recording and are caused by dye inconsistency in the outer part of the discs. I have experienced the problem myself - 10 - 20% of discs with >4MB content exhibit serious playback problems in my trials.

    The problems have not been noted AFAIK on 2x or 4x Verbatim DVD-Rs; I have never had any problem with those but they are now virtually unobtainable. This may be relevant to the problem you have identified, especially if >4GB content discs are involved, but possibly even if not.

    I have now switched to Ritek 8x DVD-R media with no problems so far (in about 150 discs). Hope this may help you.
     
  12. MartinImber

    MartinImber
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    Slower speed Verbatims are supposed to be among the best discs

    With my 715 it tended to play discs under 4GB better than over 4GB
     
  13. redsox_mark

    redsox_mark
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    Which Verbatim 8X discs? I use the pastel coloured ones, which are TY02 dye... I believe the other ones are MCC dye. I haven't had a problem with the TY02 ones yet.

    Mark
     
  14. jesmat2003

    jesmat2003
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    Thanks brownrog. The problem I had was with Verbatim Pastels (X8) which use the TY02 dye (according to SVP). However, I'd only recorded about 3.75GB worth of material on the discs that suffered with occasional picture break-up on my A360. I'm not sure if it could be a problem with the dye as these discs appear to play perfectly on my PC drive and Panasonic Recorder. The disc speed isn't something I'm concerned about and so would have preferred to buy more of the 4-speed Verbatims had they still been available. After these problems (which may purely be caused by the A360) and what you've said my current preferred DVD-R is now the Panny four speed. No doubt these will soon vanish from sale as well before too long.
     
  15. HeweyBoy101

    HeweyBoy101
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    I buy discs in 25's. Have found most DVD-R's to be reliable. Usually, if you do get a problem, it will affect a whole batch. I recently tried some PC Line discs from PC World (25 units). Worked fine. Then purchased some more (same make / speed). Virtually every other disc in the second batch had problems. Would play fine for 1 hour or more, and then start to break up / freeze. My Denon 3910 player is also more fussy at what it will / will not play, compared to my previous Sony. Purchased some Imation 8 speed discs from PC World last week - no problems - have used abot 6 so far.
     
  16. brownrog

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    Very good point, Mark.

    I have been using Verbatim DVD-Rs with printable surfaces. Not sure what dye these use, but may well be different from TY02, maybe MCC. I need printable surfaces for DVDs I produce commercially (i.e. for money!) and so I use them for personal recordings as well. My comments (including those evidenced by my suppliers) apply entirely to those discs. So this may not apply to the pastel coloured ones with TY02 dye.

    More generally, comments from several colleagues of mine suggest problems vary with media and burner-type. They certainly vary with how full the disc is (more full = more problems), with the codec used in authoring the discs (if you are burning on a PC, you will have a choice here), with the settings used (bit-rate, VBR/CBR, GOP size) when you have a choice, and even with the material used. For example the combination of still titles with a rich soundtrack, but with no motion video, will present difficulties to some codecs using Variable Bit Rate (VBR), with some media, on some burners etc....!!! I know this is a bit off-thread, as the OP's problem is probably the age of the player, but it may be of interest to people to know what a lottery DVD burning can be.

    With a DVD recorder you cannot choose a different codec, you can't change the burner and you don't have much choice of settings (only the copy modes); also if you're recording off-air you're unlikely to encounter difficult material mixes though you may if you're recording from a firewire-connected camcorder. The move to 8x speed may have helped waste less time burning but it's certainly not lessened compatibility issues, and seems to have made them worse.
     

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