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DVD+R, to PC

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by stevomacca, May 6, 2005.

  1. stevomacca

    stevomacca
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    Hi, i'm looking to buy a dvd+r (probably the yamada), to create backups of certain tv shows.
    I'm wanting to be able to record from tv to dvd+rw, then put it onto my pc to edit (get ride of adverts etc), then burn back onto dvd (pref -r).
    how would i go about this?
     
  2. musukebba

    musukebba
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    I suggest ripping the individual titles to a single MPEG2 file with DVD Decrypter (freeware), editing the adverts out of this file in Womble MPEG2VCR (month's free trial), and burning to DVD -R with DVD Movie Factory 4 (month's free trial).

    For details see Loobster's guide here, although it refers to DVDMF3.
     
  3. Rasczak

    Rasczak
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    If your planning to archive onto DVDR you'd be much better off spending a little bit more and buying a decent brand DVD recorder. Have a look at the 'Which DVD Recorder?' link in my signature for an introduction on the topic. The Yamada as well as other imported 'Supermarket Cheapies' tend to be cheap, poor performers.

    In addition if you opt for a decent machine you will have edit facilities on the machine and thus won't need to bother with an MPEG2 editor such as Womble (or the significantly better TMPG Enc MPEG Editor) and can just import into a VR authoring programme such as TMPG Encoder Author, Nero Vision or Ulead Moviefactory.
     
  4. stevomacca

    stevomacca
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    in buying a better dvdrw to get rid of the need for pc software, i'd need to use dvdrw all the time if i want to record to them then edit, or am i missing something?
     
  5. musukebba

    musukebba
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    It means you have to do the editing in the living room rather than the computer room. Depends on how tolerant your family/friends/tenants/flatmates/co-viewers are.

    MPEG2VCR is cheaper than the extra you pay for a HDD machine.

    I'm getting tired of this, actually - it's just horses for courses at the end of the day.
     
  6. Rasczak

    Rasczak
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    The route musukebba was suggesting was a four part process:
    1) Record on your set-top DVD recorder using DVDR re-writeable media
    2) Import and edit in MPEG2VCR
    3) Import and author in (e.g.) TMPG Enc Author or Moviefactory
    4) Burn onto DVD-R for maximum compatibility

    Nothing particularly wrong with that. But there are better options - the DVD recorder your looking at - the Yamada - is a weak performer. If you considered a -VR recorder instead (a cheap Panasonic, Sony, Pioneer, Toshiba, new JVC, LG etc) then you could do the following:
    1) Record on your set-top DVD recorder using DVDR re-writeable media
    2) Edit on your set-top DVD recorder
    3) Import and author in (e.g.) TMPG Encoder Author (see here for a guide) or Moviefactory
    4) Burn onto DVD-R for maximum compatibility

    Effectively this gives the same solution as above with a few added benefits:
    - Only one set of software needed (TMPG Encoder Author, Moviefactory, Nero etc)
    - Most decent makes of DVD recorder have Flexible Record or equivalent - the ability to set the recording mode to the exact running time of the programme thus maximising recording picture quality.
    - Ability to pause live time/timeslip etc

    ...i.e. you have a significantly better setup - and your recordings will be significantly better - for only a fraction more cash.
     
  7. SuperBob

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    I've just bought a Yamada 8400X (excellent machine, earlier models didn't get good reviews but this new model seems excellent).
    Has RGB in, firewire & USB. Plays back DivX & Xvid.
    The quality is identical to the source (not used the tuner as I record from SKY+). All for £125 delivered.

    I am also using it to record (from SKY+) on DVD+RW.

    I record, then wipe the chapters, put new one's in around ad breaks, then hide these chapters (removing adverts from playback).

    Now put the disc in your PC and use DVD Decrypter(free).

    You can use the ISO Read for your +RW,then change it to ISO Write after loading your DVD-R.

    The edited disc is now archived to DVD-R.
     
  8. Rasczak

    Rasczak
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    The Yamada is reviewed here. First few lines say it all really:

    There are much better + recorders, let alone going for a decent -VR recorder. You get what you pay for.
     
  9. gavan

    gavan
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    Surely if all you want to do it take out adverts then a consumer HD/DVD deck is the best option? Who wants to faff around with importing stuff onto the PC, extracting an MPEG2 bitstream, editing that and then remastering and burning a second disk when a consumer deck quickly and easily allows you to cut out adverts and then make a single burn?

    It's not like you are producing films from camcorder footage or something where you might have to do a lot of editing and creative stuff.

    Of course, if you already have all the stuff you need on the PC and are experienced using it and don't mind all the extra time and effort needed then why not. But in the general sense I don't think it's a good option.


    Gav
     
  10. Rasczak

    Rasczak
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    HDD/DVDRs are certainly the best all-round option - but not everyone has approx. £300 available for one! And in addition for people who want custom menus and chapter menus a PC is the only option as well.
     
  11. SuperBob

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    But that is not the model I have, I have the newer 8400X.
    This thread is quickly turning into something saying unless you spend £300 you can't do what it is asked.
    I do exactly what the original poster requested and it works great.
     
  12. musukebba

    musukebba
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    The original poster does, and I was replying to a specific question.

    Perhaps you aren't the horse for this particular course.
     
  13. Rasczak

    Rasczak
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    ...you mean the new Yamada model that is effectively the same model with a new case? I'm sorry SuperBob but the Yamada range are bargain basement recorders that aren't upto much. There are several other Yamada reviews in a similar vein for those bothered enough to look. You'll notice the core points tend to be the same on all of them - for example the editing you consider good enough for your needs (cutdown +VR editing) on the Yamada is what most of us here have dismissed as woefully inadequate Superbob - which is why very few people use the process you suggest for their archiving. In addition your comments that the recording is the 'same as source' again raises eyebrows in itself - the machine isn't even capable of recording at the maximum DVD-Video bitrate. Certainly when I trialled the Yamada I could easily tell the difference even when testing on a low end CRT.

    Threads like these are always a balancing act between providing advice to avoid someone making a mistake and 'upsetting' those who have brought said product and think it is 'great'.

    All I'm saying is if is bothered enough to want to archive on a PC then you might as well go for the better quality option. I mean have a look at the break down of costs (approx.):

    Option 1) £130 for the Yamada, £35 for MPEG2VCR, £35 for TMPG = £200
    Option 2) £170 for the Pioneer 220, £35 for TMPG = £205

    ...so for £5 more you get better picture quality (recording and playback), more features (timeslip, editing) and a decent brand player.
     
  14. SuperBob

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    Where do you get that from?

    That model review says:
    No SVIDEO, mine has in and out.
    No firewire, mine has this (also USB for flash drives).
    The editing quoted is wrong too, I can split titles etc..
    The 8400X also has MPEG4 playback.

    I still stand by my comparison statement that the original and recording are indistinguishable, and that is using SP (2 hour mode) not 1 hour HQ, so the bit rate is lower.
     
  15. Rasczak

    Rasczak
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    Which are all just tweaks and modifications. The core MPEG2 processing - which is what matters - is the same. If you seriously believe the Yamada is anywhere near a decent DVD recorder then I strongly urge you to go forth and trial other models... If you get a naff model now, and archive from it, all you'll end up doing is throwing yourr discs in the bin when you upgrade your TV and finally see how dire your recordings are.

    I don't like to be blunt Superbob but even on average screens and the best DVD recorders you can see a reduction in quality when dropping from 1hr to 2hr modes. If you can't see that it means you either have a low end TV, are recording in composite or both.
     
  16. SuperBob

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    I've got a decent JVC LCD TV thanks.
     
  17. Rasczak

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    ...in which case I suggest you tweak your screen and check that you are actually recording in RGB. The chaps over at the LCD Forum will help you on that score. You never going to get the detail that you find on a CRT but you should easily be able to tell 1hr and 2hr recording modes apart on the screen when recording from an RGB Digital TV source!
     
  18. stevomacca

    stevomacca
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    Hi, i'm not that bothered about using pc, mainly i want to get rid of ads from movies and compile favourite parts from shows, like say a 20min part of socceram etc.
    Ideally i'd like to put my sky + on and dvdrw on record and leave it, then go back and remove ads or cut a specific part of a show and just put that onto dvd, since somebody mentioned a dvdrw with hdd, i might look into this also, are there any about with these dvd/hdd players with divx/mpeg playback etc?
     
  19. gavan

    gavan
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    Just offering an opinion in general - sorry it seems to have rattled your cage.


    Gav
     
  20. gavan

    gavan
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    If only Sky+ offered some sort of decent editing. Do you know if any of the Freeview based HD recorders allow you to edit before playing .. then a HD-less DVD recorder would be a nice way of saving some dosh.

    I've found editing video and mastering Video DVDs on the PC to be a complete pain in the a**e. Hence my preference for doing it on a consumer deck if the task is simple enough. Plus of course not everyone might have a well equipped PC.

    Gav
     
  21. Rasczak

    Rasczak
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    Some do - (I believe) the new Panasonic does and so does the Thompson. But if you then copy onto direct onto DVDR it isn't going to be as slick as a HDD/DVDR authored disc where, depending on model, you can set menu backgrounds, specify thumbnails etc. The solution (hopefully) is going to be DVB/HDD/DVDRs such as those coming from Panasonic and Sony later this year - this will bring all digital recording as well.
     
  22. musukebba

    musukebba
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    My additions, for clarity...

    Unfortunately the Thomson doesn't really, at least to the extent of being useful. You can set 'scene' markers to delineate sections of video, but can only delete these scenes at the beginning and end of the recording. Stuff in the middle won't delete.

    It doesn't have digital out so any copying to HDD-less DVDR is via RGB and thus theoretically subject to degradation by going D->A and A->D at M2. Very surprisingly, in practice there seems to be hardly any noticeable change in the secondary recording quality, and the biggest influence on the end result is the variation in Freeview broadcast bitrate from programme to programme. On my display (Toshiba 32" CRT) this can be checked directly and pretty easily as the Philips 880 has a TV/DVD button and a true recording monitor function.

    This is just making the best of what I've got. A HDD DVDR would copy in 15 minutes, whereas the above is in real-time. Nevertheless I usually do it overnight, time the archive when at work, or whilst watching the recording. A true PVR handles MHEG and DOGs better, and the integrated TV Guide makes scheduling a no-brain exercise. Whether the Panasonic and Sony Freeview DVDRs include these latter features is something we can only wait and see for.
     
  23. stevomacca

    stevomacca
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    OK, i'm almost set on a hdd dvdrw, which one would you recommend?
    I like the idea of being able to edit the hdd image and then write to dvd-r.
    Thanks
     
  24. Rasczak

    Rasczak
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    Around the £300 mark (which I assume is your budget) the best available are (links are for info only):

    - Panasonic EH50
    - Toshiba RDXS34
    - Sony RDR-XS510

    ...Pioneer DVDR720 is also worth a look although it is bettered in most areas by the above. Precisely which DVD recorder is the one for you depends though:
    - Do you want iLink (for Digital Camcorders)? Toshiba has this
    - Do you want to customise menus? Then pick the Toshiba
    - Do you want ease of use? Panasonic is the easiest
    - Do you want the best possible recording quality? Panasonic beats the others by miles
    - Do you want the best DVD playback? Sony is best at this.

    ....have a quick scroll though the 'Which DVD Recorder?' link in my signature to further refine what model is for you!
     

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