DSLR + Apps - how long until we get this?

[tryingtimes]

Hi all
I'm annoyed - and am compelled to rant!

Why can't I have a DSLR that has the control and processing of my iPhone.

It can't be very difficult for Canon/Nikon/Sony/Etc to create an interface to the iPhone which would let it control it.

I'm frustrated because I'm having the most fun with my iPhone as a camera, but I can't zoom or go very wide, nor do I trust that I'm always going to enjoy the results when I open the image on my computer.

Conversely - on the DSLR, I can't easily do timelapse, motion-sensitive capture, post-processing, sharing, waking up to take a photo at a certain time, etc, etc, etc.
Other features are just pointlessly limited like self-timers of only 2 or 10 seconds.

So how long do I have to wait before the DSLR companies start putting development in the hands of 3rd parties/enthusiasts/etc?

(poor rant I know - no block caps, incorrect spellings, unbroken sentences, etc)

 

[twist]

I want Angry birds on my 5D.

 

[eduk]

I want Angry birds on my 5D.

Trying up-skirt shots will get you plenty. Don't ask how I know...

 

[Jammyb]

Beta of a cable operated android version just launched. won't be long before it's more commonplace I think
https://market.android.com/details?id=eu.chainfire.dslrcontroller&hl=en

 

[eduk]

Hi all
I'm annoyed - and am compelled to rant!

Why can't I have a DSLR that has the control and processing of my iPhone.

It can't be very difficult for Canon/Nikon/Sony/Etc to create an interface to the iPhone which would let it control it.

I'm frustrated because I'm having the most fun with my iPhone as a camera, but I can't zoom or go very wide, nor do I trust that I'm always going to enjoy the results when I open the image on my computer.

Conversely - on the DSLR, I can't easily do timelapse, motion-sensitive capture, post-processing, sharing, waking up to take a photo at a certain time, etc, etc, etc.
Other features are just pointlessly limited like self-timers of only 2 or 10 seconds.

So how long do I have to wait before the DSLR companies start putting development in the hands of 3rd parties/enthusiasts/etc?

(poor rant I know - no block caps, incorrect spellings, unbroken sentences, etc)

I can think of plenty of things that I would want, but they probably aren't worth the development time and effort.

 

[tryingtimes]

Beta of a cable operated android version just launched. won't be long before it's more commonplace I think
https://market.android.com/details?id=eu.chainfire.dslrcontroller&hl=en

That looks like a great start - so far it looks like they're focussing on getting the current camera features and adjustments on the mobile device, but I guess the step after that will get more creative.

Unfortunately, even though my camera is on the list, my wife's HTC Desire isn't

The other downside is that it will be one huge app with feature-requests up to it's neck. Totally unlike the iPhone situation where, where when you need a feature, you can usually find a super-cheap or free app that will do it.

 

[eduk]

That looks like a great start - so far it looks like they're focussing on getting the current camera features and adjustments on the mobile device, but I guess the step after that will get more creative.

Unfortunately, even though my camera is on the list, my wife's HTC Desire isn't

The other downside is that it will be one huge app with feature-requests up to it's neck. Totally unlike the iPhone situation where, where when you need a feature, you can usually find a super-cheap or free app that will do it.

I think you have just answered your own question.

 

[Jammyb]

I can think of plenty of things that I would want, but they probably aren't worth the development time and effort.

Don't see why?? There are lots of remote viewers, remote shutter devices, backup devices etc etc on the market that do the things being asked for. Being able to do them on a smartphone or tablet that faster and with a better screen would seem a no brainer.

 

[simonblue]

Trying up-skirt shots will get you plenty. Don't ask how I know...

Can i ask

 

[eduk]

Can i ask

You can ask.

 

[eduk]

Don't see why?? There are lots of remote viewers, remote shutter devices, backup devices etc etc on the market that do the things being asked for. Being able to do them on a smartphone or tablet that faster and with a better screen would seem a no brainer.

But is it worth it to the manufacturer of the dSLR? My guess is no.

 

[tryingtimes]

But is it worth it to the manufacturer of the dSLR? My guess is no.

But that's not how the model works.
The DSLR manufacturer gets the camera sales.
They have to open up the app development to amateurs/3rd parties/etc.

Then all you need is a hobbiest who wants to share their creation (like a couple of my iPhone apps), or an app developer that sees an opportunity to sell 5000 apps at £1.99, etc.

Or you get open source projects where many like-minded individuals contribute to one app.

 

[eduk]

But that's not how the model works.
The DSLR manufacturer gets the camera sales.
They have to open up the app development to amateurs/3rd parties/etc.

Then all you need is a hobbiest who wants to share their creation (like a couple of my iPhone apps), or an app developer that sees an opportunity to sell 5000 apps at £1.99, etc.

Or you get open source projects where many like-minded individuals contribute to one app.

I am not disagreeing with you, I would love my dSLR to have all sorts of funky apps. But what's in it for the manufacturer?

They are still selling cameras without these features, so why should they maintain a costly API in terms of firmware development/maintenance for relatively few users that want it?

 

[tryingtimes]

Well I guess we disagree about the amount of extra sales it would generate, and also the number of users who would make use of it.
Look how the hacked Lumix GH1 became the video DSLR to have, but only because of hacked firmware.

I also don't think the expense is much of a factor. I think it comes down to 2 things.

1) Confidence - I don't think Canon/Nikon have a grasp of this business model (unlike Sony/Panasonic).
2) Fear - they are scared that professionals will snear at it, and their reputation will suffer.

 

[mucca_D]

The boundaries will become closer as electronics become smaller and cheaper. You also have to factor in the acceptance level. Manufactures understand that if you put too much in one product and launch at the wrong time, it will flop! Forget your early adopters and your techno advocates. This is about mass market or at least the audience its targeted at.

You can see by the acceptance and drive on smaller cameras with interchangeable lenses are now bridging the gap. This IMHO is where we will see more app like functions, however the model that is working is the smart phone etc, so to install and open interface over wifi or Bluetooth would be the way to go. However to be open, this needs investment from each manufacture to create the standard.

At the other end of the market, the new 1Dx with Ethernet built in! You may ask why not 3G or wifi etc, well around the corner we have LTE and it picking up fast! I am aware of at least one manufacture of wireless bridges (Ethernet to 3G) that have recently attended a camera show, wonder why? Could we see an Ethernet to LTE bridge.

Will be very interesting to see what is tested at the Olympics. I think we will see the normal banks and banks of DSLR locked off at finish lines etc, however I think we will see a fair share of 1Dx plugged into a LAN, with editors sat in trucks, adding the IPTC crop and detail and on the wire within seconds.

The next step is direct from the camera or via an app on your smart phone / IPAD etc. It will happen as we will use it, but it will take time!

 

[shotokan101]

Well I guess we disagree about the amount of extra sales it would generate, and also the number of users who would make use of it.
Look how the hacked Lumix GH1 became the video DSLR to have, but only because of hacked firmware.

I also don't think the expense is much of a factor. I think it comes down to 2 things.

1) Confidence - I don't think Canon/Nikon have a grasp of this business model (unlike Sony/Panasonic).
2) Fear - they are scared that professionals will snear at it, and their reputation will suffer.

I personally think that you are overestimating the new sales side of things - I suspect that the vast majority of potential users of such an app would be existing owners as opposed to potential owners who are waiting for a DSLR with such a feature available... can't really see it as being a top unique selling point for potential DSLR purchasers...

Jim

 

[eduk]

Well I guess we disagree about the amount of extra sales it would generate, and also the number of users who would make use of it.
Look how the hacked Lumix GH1 became the video DSLR to have, but only because of hacked firmware.

I also don't think the expense is much of a factor. I think it comes down to 2 things.

1) Confidence - I don't think Canon/Nikon have a grasp of this business model (unlike Sony/Panasonic).
2) Fear - they are scared that professionals will snear at it, and their reputation will suffer.

The point I am attempting to make, badly it appears, is that if it increased sales significantly then manufacturers would already be offering it. Their cameras already fly off the shelf without this stuff.

It is all too easy to hang around forums thinking that "this" is how the majority of purchasers use their camera, like in your Lumix GH1 example. A tiny fraction of Lumix GH1 users will hack their camera, the vast majority will not have a clue about it.

I want tethering for the Sony A77. Will not having tethering kill sales of the A77? Nope! Will having tethering significantly increase sales? Nope!

 

[Jammyb]

At the same time though there's very little to seperate most DSLR's at a given pricepoint. How many threads do you see on here with people can't decide betwee a Canon xxxD or a Nikon xxxxD and in the end you could almost flip a coin. Any feature or marketing advantage is a plus.

e.g.
The new Canon 650D
-Communicates wirelessly with your iphone, ipad, android phone or tablet
-Control your camera wirelessly, no need for remote shutter devices
-Backup and Edit your images as you shoot them!
-See images on a large screen.
-Get in the picture! - Take great self portraits and see how they're going to look and press the shutter when you're ready*
etc etc

Sure it would take some work and support. But you could say the same thing about GPS say, which I have no interest in.

*This could be really good marketing idea if they could get it working. Set your camera on a tripod or surface. Get in front of the camera, check composition on your phone, then press the shutter.

 

[tryingtimes]

I like your thinking Jammyb

To be honest I think this approach is inevitable and I'm surprised to see naysayers. It's just a matter of when and who's going to lead.

Re: GH1. I've marketed consumer electronics a long time. I know how important early adopters and brand ambassadors are for trickle-down. It doesn't matter if 90% of GH1 owners don't hack their devices. It matters whether people see the GH1 being used on Vimeo and whether they want to achieve the same results. Or whether their knowledgeable mate has one, or which has the longest thread on AVforums, etc.
Panasonic have shown that they can make inroads into the Canon/Nikon dominated market by providing innovative features.
Last year when the GH2 launched I nearly sold all my Canon gear and jumped ship (I discovered I don't have the time needed to process video ). Many others have.

Their cameras already fly off the shelf without this stuff.

I don't get this comment at all - if any manufacturer starts thinking "we already sell enough of these", they're pretty doomed.

 

[twist]

I don't get this comment at all - if any manufacturer starts thinking "we already sell enough of these", they're pretty doomed.

Totally agree. Why go digital, we had film, why go HD we had black & white TV etc etc.

 

[simonblue]

Would I still be able to take photos

 

[eduk]

I like your thinking Jammyb

To be honest I think this approach is inevitable and I'm surprised to see naysayers. It's just a matter of when and who's going to lead.

Re: GH1. I've marketed consumer electronics a long time. I know how important early adopters and brand ambassadors are for trickle-down. It doesn't matter if 90% of GH1 owners don't hack their devices. It matters whether people see the GH1 being used on Vimeo and whether they want to achieve the same results. Or whether their knowledgeable mate has one, or which has the longest thread on AVforums, etc.
Panasonic have shown that they can make inroads into the Canon/Nikon dominated market by providing innovative features.
Last year when the GH2 launched I nearly sold all my Canon gear and jumped ship (I discovered I don't have the time needed to process video ). Many others have.


I don't get this comment at all - if any manufacturer starts thinking "we already sell enough of these", they're pretty doomed.

No, I said they are already flying off the shelf without this stuff.

This stuff clearly isn't limiting sales in any significant way or the manufacturer would do something about it.

I don't see how I can clarify this point any further for you tbh.

 

[eduk]

Totally agree. Why go digital, we had film, why go HD we had black & white TV etc etc.

You are agreeing with a misinterpretation then. It's obvious that your examples were step-changes in technology that the masses wanted and not comparable to an obscure function like connecting a dSLR to an iPhone.

 

[eduk]

Would I still be able to take photos

Only by tying yourself into the evil Apple empire.

 

[tryingtimes]

My opinion is that while it may appear to be an obscure function (not necessarily connecting a phone, the solution could be downloadable apps to your camera) to you now, it will seem indispensable the moment you become accustomed to it.

As someone who uses their phone for photography a lot, it seems incredibly limiting sometimes to use my Canon 40D. There must be a growing number of people who feel similarly.