Do all amplifiers sound the same?

keffer

Novice Member
Power amps less difference, Preamp’s definitely sound different.

I have compared an old nad preamp, rotel rsp av process as a preamp and a passive preamp and they all sound very different.

On subject of AV, I sold my Yamaha RV579 7.2 for 150 and bought an older Denon AVR 4308 for same money and difference is night and day! The japanese denon has so much punch and brings my kef r500's alive
 

xxGBHxx

Well-known Member
For completeness can I ask @xxGBHxx to provide links to some peer reviewed paper that support his arguement (quoted many times) so that we can all understand the issues being discussed here. This is an honest request as I am willing to read, digest and learn (and even then experiment myself) and not an attemp to credit/discredit any one view or another.

Actually the peer reviewed scientific papers I was mentioning referred to the subjectivists proving that any of their psychobable laden manufacturer claims had any basis in reality.

Appreciate it's a bit of a cop out but there are (quite literally) 1000's of papers, books, studies and presentations written in many fields of study (electrical engineering, neuroscience, medicine, cognitive science) that cover relevant areas. Huge numbers of them are behind paywalls or are only available from a library on microfiche (that was a fun Saturday in the British Library...) but theres enough for a good read online. I don't claim to have read more than a few dozen but I read enough to convince me. Here's a few to start you off.

"The Great Debate: Is Anyone Winning?" - Nousaine, Tom
""High-Resolution Subjective Testing Using a Double-Blind Comparator", Clark, David, Journal of the Audio Engineering Society, Vol30, no 5, May82, pg 330-338.
"Can you Trust Your Ears?", Nousaine, Tom, Presented at the 91st AES Convention, Oct 91, Print #3167
"The Great Ego Crunchers: Equalized, Double Blind Testing", Shanefield, Daniel, Hi-Fidelity, Mar 80, pg 57-61.

You can then go into placebo and congnitive bias which is heavily studied in medicine but clearly doesn't explicitly refer to its affect on audio listening more than the effect is real conceptually.

G
 
Last edited:

xxGBHxx

Well-known Member
Interesting thread. I was certainly in the camp of amps not making a difference until I wanted to purchase a new high end stereo amp (£1k-ish) for my system. I auditioned two side by side in a demo room and found the sound produced completely different. Was really night and day different, one was certainly above the other. This wasn't me trying to convince myself to get the 'better one' as I was auditioning 2 amps that were decent brands, same price points etc - I had no bias going in of which one I'd prefer.

Now to xxGBHxx's list above, I did all the things in the top list but not the second, however I believed (and still do) that the amp sounded different, and one made a much more pleasurable listening experience.

But the retailer might have. He might have, unknown to you, nudged you towards one or the other because he got a higher commission. He might have put the volume 2% higher one one than the other which is enough for you so hear a difference but not enough for you to think it's louder. Regardless of how convinced you might have been there is absolutely no way to be sure without blind testing with level matched systems that the retailer didn't do something, even accidentally, to make them sound different.

The fact you did all of list 1 and none of list 2 is absolutely typical and what I would expect most people do so no shame in that. As long as you're happy with your system that's all that matters just suggesting you might have got the same results spending half that amount.

G
 

Dans1210

Well-known Member
This is far too open to interpretation this thread, gbh i am in your camp. Its like beating your head against the wall...im out mate.
For all the rest, theres many tests out there and one great resource quoted here, Ethan Winer!
Im not sure the majority of people in here are even grasping the actual argument put forward.
 

xxGBHxx

Well-known Member
I've only ever sat and listened to one truly high end amp and speaker combination and that was a Rega Osiris mated to those big B&W speakers that look like an oil barrel. Even though it was in a dealers showroom it sounded awesome. Playing vinyl I've heard nothing like it before or since.

If all amps sound the same then why did I, against my pre audition thoughts, plump for the amp that I thought would be there just to make up the numbers. A complete difference between the two, a Naim XS2 and a Rega Elicit-R. It was the huge smile that the Rega put on my face that swung it. It has cost me more in the long run even though it was £400 cheaper than the Naim as I've had to buy a stand alone headphone amp. If both amps had sounded the same I would still be in the audition room trying to make up my mind.

I've two CD players that have identical DACs but there's a significant difference in sound quality even when playing through the same amp, the three times more expensive one winning out. That's not down to the DAC it must be down to how the analogue side of the machine is made, components used and signal pathway, the more expensive having the best.

If I won the lottery (I've a sure fire way of increasing my changes by 100%. Buy a ticket) I'd just have to give a truly high end set up a go. The audition would be much the same, the winner would be the one that put the biggest smile on my face.

I've listened to a fair few decent setups over the years (I'm getting on a bit now) and the cost of the system had very little correlation to the quality of sound. I've heard great sounding "cheap" systems and terrible sounding "boutique" systems. The point it drilled into my head is that a great sounding system doesn't have to mean expensive.

The rest of your post I've covered previously so I'm not going to repeat :)

Thanks

G
 

Ugg10

Distinguished Member
Thanks for the list of references @xxGBHxx, will do a search and have a read.
 

Lord Essex

Active Member
I’m sorry but all you are doing is peddling conspiracies theories, because what you are saying is that the business model of 99% of hi fi companies is just to con their customers and 10,000’s if not 100,000’s of intelligent people turn into idiots the moment they walk into a hi-fi shop and hand over large sums of money because they are unable to make an informed decision because of all the smoke and mirrors.

Can you please explain to me (without saying you can’t trust your ears) why a company would spend serious amounts of money on R&D for a new product just to produce an amp that sounds exactly the same as the one they made 10 years ago?
 
Last edited:

xxGBHxx

Well-known Member
This is far too open to interpretation this thread, gbh i am in your camp. Its like beating your head against the wall...im out mate.
For all the rest, theres many tests out there and one great resource quoted here, Ethan Winer!
Im not sure the majority of people in here are even grasping the actual argument put forward.

I appreciate the support.

I agree we are starting to get to the point (as is often the case in these discussions) where new people joining the discussion are not reading the preceding posts so repeating "BUT I HEARD A DIFFERENCE" not realising what that actually means. So not going to reply to too many more threads myself. Pretty much answered all that's worth answering at this point.

In the end m8 it's not that people can't grasp or couldn't grasp I just believe some people don't want to because it doesn't support their belief. And you know what? Thats fine. If I'd put down the best part of £10k on a piece of equipment I could have replicated for £500 I'd be defending it to the hills too. It just makes me sad that this part of the high end industry exists to lie and cheat these people out of their hard earned money instead of just giving good value for money with a quality built product at a sensible price.

Then again perhaps I'm the mug and I should look at selling £1000 USB cables. I just can't believe it's legal to sell them.

G
 

dan1979

Member
There was a clear difference between a £300 Onkyo amp I had and a £900 Cyrus I had. I had both at the same time and could switch between them. The Cyrus was rated 5w per channel lower and neither were pushed hard.

Compared to the Onkyo the Cyrus was in a different league in terms of clarity. I was honestly shocked when I first tried it as there was so much more detail. I also found with 'heavy' music I could pick up detail rather than it being a muddle like the Onkyo.Similarly, I've used the £80 Cambridge Audio Topaz amp and it instantly sounded muffled rather than clear.

I feel like there's a point where you hit that quality/clarity - beyond that I'm on the fence more on the side of the skeptics. I heard a seven grand pre/power once and don't feel like it did anything different.

As an aside, I couldn't hear any difference between a £60 DVD player and a £300 Arcam CD player.

All the blind tests I've read about concluded that turntable/cartridges and speakers were the only components where people could reliably pick out differences.
 

Dans1210

Well-known Member
I appreciate the support.

I agree we are starting to get to the point (as is often the case in these discussions) where new people joining the discussion are not reading the preceding posts so repeating "BUT I HEARD A DIFFERENCE" not realising what that actually means. So not going to reply to too many more threads myself. Pretty much answered all that's worth answering at this point.

In the end m8 it's not that people can't grasp or couldn't grasp I just believe some people don't want to because it doesn't support their belief. And you know what? Thats fine. If I'd put down the best part of £10k on a piece of equipment I could have replicated for £500 I'd be defending it to the hills too. It just makes me sad that this part of the high end industry exists to lie and cheat these people out of their hard earned money instead of just giving good value for money with a quality built product at a sensible price.

Then again perhaps I'm the mug and I should look at selling £1000 USB cables. I just can't believe it's legal to sell them.

G
Sorry, to clarify. When i say people aren’t seeming to grasp the argument they must first understand that all things being equal is the jumping off point.
Not a receiver vs power amp not stereo amp vs receiver, not 100wpc amp vs 90wpc etc.
 

andy1249

Distinguished Member
No one, not a single one, can tell two amps apart or two cables apart in any test once you remove confirmation bias and other such outside influences.

Here...
Blind Listening Page 6

If you are willing to pay for access to aes there are plenty more, that is the nature of statistical evaluations, over the group the overall result may be null , but there are always individuals that get a high positive result.

You have to be careful what kind of statements you make with regard to statistical results.

A thought experiment for you , lets say we take the same statistical rules from these tests but apply it to the question “ can you play a musical instrument competently”

Ability to play an instrument is low , less than 10% worldwide , but just because 90% of people cannot play, we dont say that on average no one can play an instrument and that any music you “ thought” you may have heard is a figment of your imagination, do we?
 
Last edited:

dannnielll

Well-known Member
Aren't mic pre-amps different to the pre-amp sections in hifi and home cinema equipment? I thought they act more as a power amp (voltage boosting)?

I can definitely hear a difference between hifi / AVR pre-amps in my room. A while ago, I set up some blind testing with a Denon AVR, and compared it to a Musical Fidelity integrated amp for music. The sound was very different. Same experience when comparing DACs.

So, although I agree with you that all power amps sound the same, unless they are faulty or clipping. I disagree that all pre-amplifiers and DACs sound the same.

However, much respect for taking on such a controversial subject and sticking to your guns ;):):smashin:
The usual function of a preamp has been to condition the input signal by increasing its voltage and power levels, and in many cases to provide tonal correction . In the days of vinyl and magnetic tape it was also expected to modify the frequency response to match RIAA or NAB curves.
Now if modifying the tone does not change the sound its rather pointless. Those Bass and Treble knobs are not ornaments.
 

Abacus

Banned
So first of all, show me a single double blind loudness balanced test that has ever been conducted that shows that there is a detectable difference between any two or more of those items. I've looked and I can't find them. So far in all my research, in all the testing ever conducted where the results have been published or discussed there has never been a single result I have found that corroborates your assertion. I am very keen to see one though.

What is the "correct parameter"? Audio is complex but it has been extensively studied and is very well understood. While minute differences can often be detected not only between amps of different manufacturers but also the same manufacturers no one has proven that the differences can be heard. On the contrary there are endless tests showing that these minute differences CAN'T be heard.

Why do you think manufacturers resorted to those kinds of tricks and cons? As you rightly say without resorting to cheating there actually was no difference so it contradicts your point 1 (or are you going to suggest that "some" cables make a difference, just not those ones over there)

Personal preference is king but it's not that easy. Your personal preferences are swayed by your beliefs. I "believe" this £5000 amp is better than that £300 amp ergo it is. Isn't it a lot healthier to understand that "Both these amps sound exactly the same so I'm going to buy this £300 one". You get exactly the same sound and save yourself £4700.

G

Didn’t mention anything about level matching or optimising things, (Which is beyond the general user) just changing things as a normal punter would. (Also didn’t mention double blind testing)

You are treating it as a technical problem, and yes you are correct, but nobody listens to a home system in a lab or has the equipment to set it up optimally, (The Real World isn’t like that) and I am approaching it from the real world just as 99% of users do.

In the final analysis people are not technical machines, they are biological beings that have evolved over time, which means from an engineering stand point there C***, but if you make allowances for this everybody can be happy. (Hence the reasons I say ignore measurements and subjective reviews and just get something that makes you happy)

Bill
 

dannnielll

Well-known Member
Wow I wish I knew everything sounds the same. I could have purchased a pa amp for £500 to power my linn 242 speakers instead of the £7500 spent on my linn klimax twin. But the truth is they don’t and anyone who says they do obviously haven’t listened to a high end well put together and balanced set up or maybe their hearing is just not very good.

But seriously think about what you’re saying. If it all sounds the same then anyone who spends more than £500 on a power amp is a mug/stupid/fool etc. The problem with this is I don’t know any mugs, fools, idiots etc who can afford the best of Naim/Linn/Chord etc. The people who can are generally successful professional people and believe me when I say that anyone who is in the lucky position to be able to buy the best don’t make ill advised rushed decision, they do their research, take their time and most importantly listen to what is available and only then make the decision that is best for them and if the £500 amp sounded the same that’s what they would buy but they don’t.

Also do you really think that long established well regarded companies like Linn, Naim, Chord could survive if all they are doing is selling stuff that sounds the same as everyone else but is just in a nice fancy case. I don’t think so

That is a circular argument. At a certain price point, very busy professional people basically go into a shop and say, .that looks nice, will it sound good,? Can you install it?. Is it easy to use. ? So they come away with B&O or Naim etc and are very satisfied.
Why do people buy expensive wrist watches?. They don't tell any more time than the average Timex or Swatch and are certainly no more accurate than a Radio linked Citizen solar powered watch wich tops out at 300 quid. I could say that anyone who spent more than 20 quid on a digital watch is a mug.. but we both know they are not.
 

xxGBHxx

Well-known Member
I’m sorry but all you are doing is peddling conspiracies theories, because what you are saying is that the business model of 99% of hi fi companies is just to con their customers and 10,000’s if not 100,000’s of intelligent people turn into idiots the moment they walk into a hi-fi shop and hand over large sums of money because they are unable to make an informed decision because of all the smoke and mirrors.

Can you please explain to me (without saying you can’t trust your ears) why a company would spend serious amounts of money on R&D for a new product just to produce an amp that sounds exactly the same as the one they made 10 years ago?

Mr Essex, the tone of your response and your constant referral of buyers of these products as "idiots" makes me question the purpose of your responses. As I have now said a few times they are not idiots or stupid or whatever other evocative derogatory term you're trying to attribute to me. They are, if anything, victims of a con and nothing more. It has *NOTHING* to do with intelligence being high or low.

Secondly, for someone who claims to be so intelligent you are very quick to throw out logic, evidence and scientific rigor for hyperbole and rhetoric. I would expect someone as learned as yourself to be a little more measured and less emotive in your responses.

For example, where do you get the 99% from? Thats a very arbitrary number for what I would suggest is a very small (by volume) part of the audio industry. Please substantiate this claim as I do not believe it is anywhere NEAR that number. By sales unit volume I would be surprised if it's higher than 1% and probably a much smaller proportion than that. Furthermore, where have I said these units were bad? I don't anywhere. They are undoubtedly well engineered and more importantly perfectly good (even great) at what they do. They may even be works of art. If you buy a piece of equipment because it sounds great and looks exactly how you want it to look then good on you.

Where you (or rather the industry) oversteps the line for me is when claims are made that this amp or that cable SOUNDS better due some intrinsic, nebulous (read magic) reason. There are hundreds of meaningless terms that are used in marketing material for audio at the high end and reviews designed to confuse or convince the uninformed or the susceptible of some magic property. “Warmth”, “openness”, “air”, “punch”, “creaminess”, “sheen”, “silkiness” and other such terms are just completely meaningless and unmeasurable yet used extensively. They use these terms, which many claim to mean something, but when you get down to it can't actually be explained.

It is not conspiracy theory to state then that companies such as Pear Audio or Chord are conning their buyers or are you going to try and seriously claim "cables make a difference"?

As for your last point show me proof of the "serious amounts of R&D" you talk of. I will absolutely agree that companies spend (even lots of) money and time designing the enclosures for their devices. These days depending on the device they spend time and effort designing the software which drives them. They spend time and money working out how to tool the boards and the chassis. Where they're going to source the materials from. How to make it cheaply. What I doubt, these days, with any suitably experienced audio engineer, is that they spend any significant money or time on the actual amp designs.

Now I am not an electrical engineer so I am in no way an expert on amplifier design but I'm pretty sure that these days there isn't a whole lot of innovation happening in amp circuitry design. It's a field of study and development that's been going on for 50-60 years so I'd be pretty surprised to find out there was much going on that hadn't already been done before. I'm sure there is some work done but I doubt it forms a significant part of the cost of development. Again I'm more than happy for someone to show me otherwise but I'm really not convinced that any serious money goes into amplifier circuitry design these days.

G
 

Abacus

Banned
Even intelligent and otherwise rational people make bad decisions (voting Brexit, voting Trump, watching Big Brother the list goes on). I don't know why you have to take it personally as it's nothing personal. I never called any end user a mug, stupid or a fool, you did. I am saying that they are misguided and are lied to through an industry propaganda machine geared up and structured to convince people to part with ridiculous amounts of money for palcebo.

I appreciate your belief doesn't allow you to consider this to be the case but the truth is that they do technically sound exactly the same. It's not really open for debate any more and has been proven in multiple double blind loudness matched tests. Tests conducted with industry "golden ears", veterans, sound engineers, musicians, journalists and enthusiasts. No one, not a single one, can tell two amps apart or two cables apart in any test once you remove confirmation bias and other such outside influences. Hundreds of tests that do not exclude confirmation bias or tester influence have shown there is a difference but years of cognitive study and neuroscience tells us that it's effectively all in your head.

I appreciate you are 100% sure you do hear a difference and I can be confident that in your head, you can. But that's the reality here, it's in your head and is not due to your amps or cables. What you are hearing is confirmation bias and placebo. It is incredibly powerful and will absolutely cause you to hear this wonderful sound. I even have no doubts your system IS wonderful but it's a sound you could replicate exactly by replacing your amp and cables with any number of alternatives that would be a LOT cheaper.

So allow me to hazard a guess (and please correct me) what your research consisted of:
  • Having demo amps at home to listen to
  • Going to trade shows and open days
  • Listening to amps in shop listening rooms
  • Reading reviews in the press and online
  • Reading forums and listening to other "audiophiles" who already have the amps in question, already demo'd them or want to buy them
  • Talking to retailers and shop owners
  • Reading the specs on manufacturer websites
Now let me guess what your research didn't consist of

  • Double blind matched loudness testing against any other amp
  • Reading and understanding other double blind loudness matches testing of cables and amps
  • Researching and looking for any peer reviewed scientific studies that add any credence to any manufacturers claims
  • Testing any low end PA amp in your system which had enough power to drive the system
  • Testing and comparing any low end cables without going in with the attitude "these will be rubbish"
Naturally you will have almost definitely done every single one of the items in the first list but likewise I'd suggest you didn't do many if any from the second list. Now that doesn't make you stupid or a fool, it just makes you the same as most people. You justify spending £7500 by convincing yourself it is VFM or worth it by focusing on and immersing yourself in everything that confirms that. We all do that (me included) but sometimes we need to ask ourselves "Hang on, do these raving lunatics telling me I could have saved £7000 and got the same sound have a point".

I liken this bit of the audio industry to that of a cult or a religion because like a cult or religion it is based on faith and not science. Now there are billions of believers in religion, many I call friends and many who are very intelligent. But being intelligent doesn't necessarily mean that there is some intangible being in the sky, that the world was made 6000 years ago or that theres some magic etherial "stuff" that magically ignores science and causes amps and cables to sound different.

G

You have just shot yourself in the foot by mentioning Brexit and Trump, as you are saying your opinion is correct, and everybody that disagrees with it is wrong, which has nothing to do with verifiable facts which you keep banging on about. (Nobody disagrees with the facts, but facts and reality do not always gel, as I mentioned in my previous post)

Bill
 

xxGBHxx

Well-known Member
All the blind tests I've read about concluded that turntable/cartridges and speakers were the only components where people could reliably pick out differences.

Absolutely agree 100%

Rest of it, not so much ;)

G
 

xxGBHxx

Well-known Member
You have just shot yourself in the foot by mentioning Brexit and Trump, as you are saying your opinion is correct, and everybody that disagrees with it is wrong, which has nothing to do with verifiable facts which you keep banging on about. (Nobody disagrees with the facts, but facts and reality do not always gel, as I mentioned in my previous post)

Bill

It was (obviously) a tongue in cheek joke and I apologise for not making that clearer.

Facts are facts and are de-facto reality, how can they be anything but? If not, then reality (or facts) would be something else. Perhaps I'm missing something here.

G
 

xxGBHxx

Well-known Member
Didn’t mention anything about level matching or optimising things, (Which is beyond the general user) just changing things as a normal punter would. (Also didn’t mention double blind testing)

You are treating it as a technical problem, and yes you are correct, but nobody listens to a home system in a lab or has the equipment to set it up optimally, (The Real World isn’t like that) and I am approaching it from the real world just as 99% of users do.

In the final analysis people are not technical machines, they are biological beings that have evolved over time, which means from an engineering stand point there C***, but if you make allowances for this everybody can be happy. (Hence the reasons I say ignore measurements and subjective reviews and just get something that makes you happy)

Bill

But don't you see that this is exactly the point?

Lets try it a different way. If sound quality is your buying criteria and sound of A = sound of B then buying either gives you the exact same result. In other words you can buy A or B and get the result you wanted with your buying criteria.

Now if A is £1 and B is £1000 then the logical choice is to buy A. You've achieved your buying criteria and you've saved £999 in the process.

What some are saying is that they are ignoring the fact that A=B because they BELIEVE B must be better than A because it's more expensive. So despite A = B based on your purchasing criteria they buy B because they believe it has to be better because it costs more.

So that is the reality here. The difference is that those that buy option B believe they are doing so because B sound better because they are told just that by the press and by the manufacturers that B is better (oh and here's a huge price tag to justify it.)

So you are absolutely right, people are not technical machines and that is EXACTLY how these companies pray on people. They KNOW they're not going to go to the levels that sad idiots like me go to so they hoodwink and fool these people into spending vast amounts of money they don't need to. I'm not in any way disputing what you're saying or arguing that it's not human nature and natural I'm saying it's wrong and we should all be cognisant of whats being done to us.

G
 

Abacus

Banned
It was (obviously) a tongue in cheek joke and I apologise for not making that clearer.

Facts are facts and are de-facto reality, how can they be anything but? If not, then reality (or facts) would be something else. Perhaps I'm missing something here.

G

The only thing you are missing is you are treating everyone as a machine that follows fixed rules, whereas people don’t, and no matter how many facts you bring forward the biological life form (People) don’t follow fixed rules. (As Mr Spock would say, they are totally illogical)

Bill
 

Abacus

Banned
But don't you see that this is exactly the point?

Lets try it a different way. If sound quality is your buying criteria and sound of A = sound of B then buying either gives you the exact same result. In other words you can buy A or B and get the result you wanted with your buying criteria.

Now if A is £1 and B is £1000 then the logical choice is to buy A. You've achieved your buying criteria and you've saved £999 in the process.

What some are saying is that they are ignoring the fact that A=B because they BELIEVE B must be better than A because it's more expensive. So despite A = B based on your purchasing criteria they buy B because they believe it has to be better because it costs more.

So that is the reality here. The difference is that those that buy option B believe they are doing so because B sound better because they are told just that by the press and by the manufacturers that B is better (oh and here's a huge price tag to justify it.)

So you are absolutely right, people are not technical machines and that is EXACTLY how these companies pray on people. They KNOW they're not going to go to the levels that sad idiots like me go to so they hoodwink and fool these people into spending vast amounts of money they don't need to. I'm not in any way disputing what you're saying or arguing that it's not human nature and natural I'm saying it's wrong and we should all be cognisant of whats being done to us.

G

Life is one big con and while I agree that everyone should be held to account, it is never going to happen, the only thing you can do is arm people with information that allows them to sort out the wheat from the chaff, but in the end it will always be there decision.

Not sure where price comes into it with audio, as a lot of expensive amps get slated for poor sound quality and sound worse than a cheaper model.

Bill
 

Paddyfin

Active Member
Well this escalated quickly.............
Do amps sound the same..... do cars drive the same.....both answers are the same yes, and no
I think some people forget the difference between lo-fi and hi-fi....SATISFY.
I have heard cheap systems and super high end systems, so high that the original recording sounded crap (thanks Meridian)
Somewhere in the middle is probably the best
 

andy1249

Distinguished Member
Now I am not an electrical engineer so I am in no way an expert on amplifier design but I'm pretty sure that these days there isn't a whole lot of innovation happening in amp circuitry design. It's a field of study and development that's been going on for 50-60 years so I'd be pretty surprised to find out there was much going on that hadn't already been done before. I'm sure there is some work done but I doubt it forms a significant part of the cost of development. Again I'm more than happy for someone to show me otherwise but I'm really not convinced that any serious money goes into amplifier circuitry design these days.

That would be wrong.
Custom ASICs ( application specific Integrated Circuits ) FPGAs ( Field programmable gate arrays ) , Custom DSP ( Digital signal Processing ) to name just a few modern introductions, are common these days.

Open up a modern amp vs a 50 year old amp and they would be hardly recognisable as having the same function.
 

dan1979

Member
Absolutely agree 100%

Rest of it, not so much ;)

G

Well I feel that what I heard could easily be explained by things like the quality of the power supply. We're talking low end compared to mid-range so the money will have gone somewhere. Maybe the cheaper amps just didn't have the grunt to match the speakers requirments.

I've only heard two types of amplifier - those that sounded very clear and those that sounded comparatively a little muffled. I liken it to the sound difference to what I hear when switching between wired and bluetooth earphones.

I'm firmly in the same camp as you on this though - my current amplifier is based on having satisfactory specs/features and I've put most of my time, effort and money into acoustic treatment.
 

The latest video from AVForums

Podcast: Q Acoustics Q3030i, Humax Aura, Roku Streambar & WandaVision Reviews and more...

Latest News

Sky announces huge original TV show and movie lineup for 2021
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
Cambridge Audio launches DacMagic 200M headphone amplifier
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
What's new on Disney+ UK for February 2021
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
Focal releases 1000 Series integrated speakers
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
Klipsch announces ProMedia 2.1 BT speaker set
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
Top Bottom