Disc pauses?

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by AAG, Jun 9, 2002.

  1. AAG

    AAG
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Hi

    I've got a Sony 735 DVD player. It's great (picture and sound are fab) but when I'm watching movies they pause once about half way through. The pause is only about a second long and it's usually between scenes. Is this a standard thing on players or is there something wrong with mine?

    Thanks in advance

    Al
     
  2. alanrob

    alanrob
    Active Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2001
    Messages:
    2,375
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Glasgow
    Ratings:
    +234
    It's called a layer change.
     
  3. pointon

    pointon
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2001
    Messages:
    1,381
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    Right behind you!!!
    Ratings:
    +3
    ... and it's nothing to do with the player. A typical DVD has two layers of information on one side (a few older discs are double sided, single layered), and the player changes layers somewhere through the feature, given away by a slight pause. It's annoying, but can be well hidden, and is better than having to turn over the flipper discs instead.
     
  4. AAG

    AAG
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    You learn something new every day. Thanks.
     
  5. LV426

    LV426
    Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2000
    Messages:
    13,575
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Somewhere in South Yorkshire
    Ratings:
    +6,095
    If you read the small print on the back of many DVD's packaging you will see something like....

    Dual Layer Format. Layer Transtition may trigger a slight pause.
     
  6. chic

    chic
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2001
    Messages:
    5,985
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    136
    Location:
    glasgow
    Ratings:
    +871
    what bugs me with the layer change is that my old chepo grundic player handled the layer change so well that i never noiced any layer change on any of my films, i upgraded to a tosh 510 which give a better picture and sound and is more reliable than the grundig pauses on every layer change for about a second which can be annoying so how can the chepo player mask the layer change but the mid range player cant.
     
  7. Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    i started a thread on this a while back cos I realy can't stand layer changes. It did seem to be the case that many of the cheaper players experienced little or no pause, while some of the mid-range players triggered significant pauses. I have to say that I haven't yet noticed a single layer change on my shiny new Pioneer 545.

    The only players immune to the pause are the Denon machines which incorporate a 4Mb memory buffer, shame other manufacturers can't follow suite.
     
  8. the badger

    the badger
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    It is strange that cheaper players can mask it. I never noticed it on my Proline yet I often see it on my Sony. This is odd because the Sony can load up a disc or start playing a lot quicker than the Proline. It does not annoy me that much but you can sometimes worry for a second that the picture is going to freeze up
     
  9. Squirrel God

    Squirrel God
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    I watched True Romance (Director's Cut) R2 the other night. There was no layer change at all (or if there was, it was incredibly well hidden). There are a few other disks like that. I presume they put the movie on one layer and the extras on the other layer. I wish more would do that :rolleyes:
     
  10. Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    it's more likely that the layer change is "hidden" in a scene change, this is far less noticable than when the layer changes occur halfway through a scene, freezing the action.

    wonder why sudios don't use DVD-10 (single layer) much? my shawshank redemption has 4:3 and 16:9 (one on each side) and limited extras. Plus being single layered there is no layer change.
     
  11. Squirrel God

    Squirrel God
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Could be ... but I've never NOT noticed a layer change before, even when it's between scenes. There is a physical indication of a layer change on my player in that the pause symbol lights up on the display for the briefest of moments - but again, I never saw it. [​IMG]
     
  12. Grubert

    Grubert
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2001
    Messages:
    601
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Ratings:
    +72
    Because then you only have one layer to fit a 140-minute-long movie and the low bitrate causes compression artifacts galore. This is made all the more obvious by comparing the picture quality of the UK edition and the Australian edition.

    If the only way to avoid a one-second annoyance is to ruin the whole movie, I say no thanks.

    BTW, True Romance is a single-layer disc. That's why you can't notice a layer change.

    Regards.
     
  13. Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    picture on the 4:3 is pin sharp and didn't notice any major artifacts on the 16:9 although the picture isn't as good and there are some minor problems with dark scenes at the start (watched on a 4:3 telly).
     
  14. Grubert

    Grubert
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2001
    Messages:
    601
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Ratings:
    +72
    DVDfever.co.uk:
    DVDnews.co.uk:
    Another example: Blade Runner, also mastered on a single layer. It is full of MPEG compression artifacts.
     
  15. Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    I would love for someone to actually point these artifacts out to me. There were NO major artifacts on Shawshank Redemption apart from some VERY minor dark scene pixellation.
    And again Blade Runner looks great on my player NO artifacts here either.
    The bit rate wasn't any lower than the majority of discs I have used either according to the read out.

    The only time I have seen noticable major artifacts was on one of those horrible Sony DAV systems demo-ing a Rio Carnival demo disc in Comet and I think that must have been faulty cos I've since seen a DAV with much better picture.

    I also never trust reviews, magazines or so called audiophiles anymore. Remember these people have to keep themselves in work.
     
  16. Grubert

    Grubert
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2001
    Messages:
    601
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Ratings:
    +72
    Well if you thought it looked great no wonder you don't see any artifacts anywhere. :rolleyes:

    Bitrate matters (as well as having good elements to transfer from). A low bitrate on a dark scene can have disastrous effects. I don't know what's your setup, but compression artifacts are readily visible on my 28-inch telly.


    And as the credibility of reviews is concerned, it's like the rest of the press. ;) You gradually find sites and people whose opinion you eventually respect by comparison to known facts.
     
  17. Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    did you ever read the Emperor's New Clothes as a child?:p I think a lot of AV enthusiasts could benefit from the message of that story.

    Are artifacts even an issue anymore with modern players? I don't think so. I'm sure you could probably point out 101 instances of artifacts in Blade Runner on my setup though. Or maybe your player is on its way out.

    When I first started looking into buying a player (I can research things like that for months) the thought of artifacts ruining a picture made me very wary about buying a player and I even thought about sticking with VHS for a while, but since I've had my player, been demo-ing players and been watching friends' low end players I've have yet to notice any major artifact type like the sort that initially concerned me. Maybe a couple of instances of minor pixellation in dark scenes and the odd bit of motion blur but nothing more.

    What type of artifacts are you seeing? Maybe you need to clean your glasses!:D
     
  18. Grubert

    Grubert
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2001
    Messages:
    601
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Ratings:
    +72
    I'm afraid we are drifting off the topic of layer change into the fascinating arena of video artifacts. If the moderators or any other forum members have any objection, please tell me so.

    You know, the point about the Emperor's new clothes cuts both ways. There are many people who are so in awe of the crispness of DVD that they can't see where it is far from perfect. So who's the cheering crowd and who's the small boy shouting out the truth?

    Modern players can only do so much to clean up an artifact-ridden picture and most digital filters introduce their own brand of nasties. This is well known. The picture will only be as good as the weakest link of the software-gear chain. There's no way you can turn a digitized VHS into a high-definition master.

    I honestly don't think my player is on the way out. It's a Pioneer DV-545. IIRC the same as you said you've got. It's hooked to the TV via a Profigold SCART and with RGB enabled. So it's not bad at all.

    And regarding layer changes, my wife didn't know anything about them but she noticed them anyway.

    Finally, my glasses are pretty clean - at least I clean them every time I'm going to watch a film.

    Regards.
     
  19. Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    same player connected the same way.

    As for the layer changes, I honestly cannot notice them on the 545, if there's a disc that springs to mind with a particularly bad change let me know, maybe the films I have aren't the best examples of bad changes. In my last house we shared a Sony DVD (can't remember the model) and the layer change was horribly long and totally spoilt the experience.

    And yes we were drifting from the subject with artifacts but as I researched this pretty throughly I know what to look for and haven't seen any particularly bad examples as yet... and believe me I'm the first to complain if something isn't perfect. These two examples are cheapy discs but they look fine IMHO. I certainly don't think I could get a much better picture unless I remortaged the house and bought a silly high-end system of the sort that costs more than a sports car.
     
  20. Squirrel God

    Squirrel God
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Thanks! You're right. It doesn't say anything on the packaging but it does say DVD-5 on the centre ring of the disk itself :) I should've checked :rolleyes:

    Not bad picture quality for a single layer either :)

    But I have to say that I noticed some artifacts on The Shawshank Redemption. You can see it clear as day if you look at the bricks or shadows in the background. Only paid £6 for it though and it's still better than my VHS copy so not fussed :D
     
  21. Grubert

    Grubert
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2001
    Messages:
    601
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Ratings:
    +72
    Either that or spend a grand total of 8.58 quid on the Australian double-layer DVD. ;)

    Regards.
     

Share This Page

Loading...
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice