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Difference between 100x5r & 250x3R

QRIO

Established Member
I have been comparing these two amps from what I can see there isn't much of a difference.

All I see is the bass has a little more weight and it sounds a little open. Compared to a 100x5r, I don't understand what the fuss is all about regarding 250x3R compared to 100x5R.

The only thing I haven't tested is at high volume levels. As the power supply caps / transformer in 250x3r are larger. Would we see the 100x5r straining, at what volume level?

Conclusion so far is, if you've got easy to drive speakers and listen at normal levels. Stick with a 100x5r!
 

Kevinc

Established Member
Key is, as you say in your post "if you've got easy to drive speakers"...

My B&W802s are anything but an easy drive. The impedance curve is brutal in the bass area (it's even worse on the B&W800s). Many long time TAG owners use the same speakers or ones with similar curves. If your amp is going to be able to control the bass driver fast which is essential for good tight bass then the amp needs a lot of power. This has nothing to do with volume, it has everything to with tight control to give that highly accurate and lifelike sound we all crave. 100wpc will not do it with a speaker like that. I use Bryston 4BSST which have similar characteristics to the TAG 250wpc amps and do a pretty good job on the bass. The 800s need a bigger amp. One of these days I'll upgrade to a bigger Bryston because it would control my speakers better. Again, this has nothing to do with volume, only with control which equals better sound. But if you have "easy to drive speakers" relative to your amp output you may be able to get away with 100wpc - for many years I ran a second system with Musical Fidelity 1000wpc amp and Ruark Talisman speakers and it sounded great (still does - I gave it to a family member and it's still going strong...).

Best of luck.
 

msrhedges

Standard Member
I agree with "Kevinc" some loudspeaker impedeance curves drop very low and you need a lot of power to maintain control. I have both the 100x5r and the 250x3r and with my Monitor Audio PL300's the 250x3r has far better control.

However in my scenario I have found the 250x3r to have significantly better sound quality as well. I must admit to have been surprised when I discovered this as the 100x5r was my main amplifier for quite some time. I only noticed the difference when I started using the Audiolab 8200CD which is based on the ESS Sabre DAC. So I upgraded a source component only to discover a weakness later.
 

QRIO

Established Member
Hi msrhedges,

How do you control your Amps, I mean turn channels - on/ off? As I ask in my other thread named 100x5r and 250x3r?

Cheers.
 

QRIO

Established Member
Been using this amp with 804s, 805s, HTM3s speakers. Not much difference with these speakers. Will try with 800D speakers, I'm sure there will be a difference there.
 

ti33er

Prominent Member
Hi QRIO

I had both of those amps with 804S and the Source makes a big difference as described above - if you are using a coaxial connection to the 8000AP for music there won't be much gain as the DACs in the AP sound relatively flat compared to higher end Source Players (junk in, junk out) ...the gaps become more apparent the higher up the audio fidelity chain one goes.

>> I noticed more weight and slam in the bass with the 250 modules and better separation of instruments when coupled with Kevin's CD Player (that he lent to me for a while)...the 100X5R runs out of steam at higher volume levels too - the CAPs make a big difference and Kevin has an enhancement for both 100 and 250 modules...quite a few preamp bits he changes which make them sound smoother and more transparent, and with the large Capacitors significantly more 4ohm/2ohm power

Besides, I think your 250 is only just starting to drive in...couldn't have had very many hours on the clock yet!? :)
 

msrhedges

Standard Member
Hi msrhedges,

How do you control your Amps, I mean turn channels - on/ off? As I ask in my other thread named 100x5r and 250x3r?

Cheers.

Hi QRIO I have forgone TagBus amp power switching since switching away from the Tag Mclaren AV32 to the Audiolab 82000AP. My system runs in 7.1 most of the time. I do however use radio controlled mains switches and if I am listening to music or say any stereo source I can turn on just the parts of the system I need. No need to run a 100x5r or blueray player etc for stereo. So functionality is grouped if that makes sense. I also don't suffer from the Audiolab IR codes issue anymore as I have used the alternate codes which I programmed into my Sony Tablet S.
 

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