Denon vs Yamaha vs Sony

Discussion in 'AV Receivers & Amplifiers' started by Crono, Feb 7, 2009.

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  1. Crono

    Crono
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    Am in the market for a budget amp/AV receiver, and these are the three I'm looking at.

    Models - Denon AVR-1909 for £299.95 / Sony STR-DG820 for £229.99 / Yamaha DSP-AX763 for £289.99 (all off Richersounds).

    The Yamaha only has two HDMI inputs, but I wonder if I'd have any further requirements to be honest. I've read the Sony is slightly lacking in the delivery of 'explosive' sounds, while the Denon apparently has a very difficult to use interface and calibration. My gut feeling is that the Denon would sound the best and it has all the features I'd ever need, but this is based entirely on impressions/reviews from the internet. I'd still really appreciate this forum's input as to what would be the best deal.. :D
     
  2. snig300

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    i found the auto setup on the denon very easy! so dont let the setup put you off.
     
  3. Don Dadda

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    All good amps but depends on how much of a hurry you are in. All very sort after amps and probably only the sony left available. No Yamahas and not a lot of Denons around. You must also include the Onkyo 606. Not my choice but it is on par with those mentioned and are available.

    I chose the yammy because the most i will have connected via hdmi is a PS3 and may be sky hd. If in the future in need an xtra hdmi port (which i doubt very much) i will buy an hdmi expansion box. but if you think you will add more than 2 hdmi devices at some point then look at the other 3

    The sound of the yammy is a joy to behold when watching films. :thumbsup: Not the best with music but palatable, IMO. I hear the denon is much the same and the xtra hdmi is always handy.

    Personally i would wait for a Yamaha or Denon.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2009
  4. Crono

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    Thanks for the input. When you say there's not a lot of Denon or Yamaha's left, do you mean in-store? Because the RS website claims they're available in stores but not for online shipping. The reason I left out the Onkyo is because it might only be on par with those mentioned, but is a tad more expensive - and I've heard about some unpleasant buzzing/humming when connected with the PS3. I'm hoping someone who's heard the Sony can comment on it's apparent shortcomings.
     
  5. MI55ION

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    In terms of future proofing I don't think you could go wrong with the Yamaha, even if it cost a little more. ;)
     
  6. mohsin_uk

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    I think the extra HDMI slot could be handy on the denon and sony. I almost bought the yamaha and would still give it serious consideration if I was buying again. I ended up with the denon 1909 which has 3 hdmi's. At first I only used 1 for my blu-ray player and then started to use the second for my hd-dvd player and a few days ago I found out I can plug my pc through it which im going to try tomorrow.

    So even though I thought I had more then enough sockets I have already run out! Unless your looking to upgrade again soon I would go for the most future proof device you can which is probably the onkyo 606 or the more expensive sony 2400 but having heard of many heating/buzz issues with the onkyo and that the sony can sound quite bright I would recommend the denon.
     
  7. SteveG

    SteveG
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    The auto set-up on the Denon works very well. You plug in the microphone and it almost sorts itself out. What is more confusing is setting the inputs and making tweaks, mainly because the manual is no help whatsoever. But after reading this, I now understand how it all works.

    I'd go for the extra HDMI too. I was initially going to get the Yamaha - mainly because my last 2 amps have been Yamaha's - but couldn't find it in stock. So I went for the Denon and just days later I have plans for that 3rd HDMI port :D
     
  8. Don Dadda

    Don Dadda
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    Morining :hiya:

    I mean 'Anywhere'. A lot websites say they have them in stock but in reality they don't. With RS, They have none to ship and most, if not all of their stores have sold out so at least they are being honest. If you see a website which claims they have them i suggest you call them to clarify that they do by physically looking.
    There are a lot of disappointed people on this and other forums that are experiencing a lot problems getting hold of either Yamaha or Denon. A few, after seeing on the websites they in stock, paid, then being told that the system was wrong and it at least a 6 week wait.:mad: To be fair tho, most websites that I've look at say they have none in stock or call before ordering. Quite a few are now on a long waiting list.

    http://www.avforums.com/forums/inte...rs/917090-yamaha-dsp-ax763-who-has-stock.html

    http://www.avforums.com/forums/inte...rs/923505-yamaha-dsp-863-stupid-question.html

    I was more than blessed to get my Yamaha when i did.

    I've read the same comments about the Onkyo. What i also don't like about them is that, IMO, it's an eyesore and they run hot. Too hot in some cases and worst of the bunch with music. :thumbsdow.
    I would suggest the sony 2400es as its better than the 820 and not far off the price of the Onkyo, but if you think the onkyo is a tad expensive then the sony 2400 most definitely is.

    PS: In my 1st reply i said that the 'Yamaha is palatable with music'. :oops: It's actually very good but i prefer my music provided by a Integrated amp as it is driven much better. AV amps can't touch Integrated amps for music unless you are willing to pay stupid money - IMO of course.:smashin:
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2009
  9. gromero

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    That's disappointing to hear DonDadda.
    I currently have a very old and expensive Pioneer seperates stereo system, that sounds amazing, but is just too big and 80's looking:rotfl:
    I was really hoping to bin this system and just use the Yam 763 (when I eventually get one). But I am quite fussy when I listen to music, I'm a huge music fan and I want to listen to it properly!!
    Should I be considering something else for music listening? Do you have your 763 connected to a good set of speakers?
     
  10. MI55ION

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    Think I should clarify my view on the Yamaha...

    Although it's missing the extra HDMI slot, the key advantage it has over the Denon is that it has Pre-outs, essential if the owner ever decides in the future that he is not satisfied with the sound and want to upgrade the amplification. So in the short term whilst the Denon might be the attractive prospect with the extra HDMI slot, it would be a complete waste should the upgrade bug ever hit the OP. Besides most TVs these days have more than two HDMI slots and if necessary the OP can add a HDMI switch for not a lot of money.
     
  11. Don Dadda

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    Agreed.:thumbsup:

    This is what won me over to the Yamaha. The Preouts was an essential feature for me. I have mine connected up to a Marantz PM7001 Ki stereo amp using those preouts. All my music sources are connected directly to the Marantz and DVD/SKY to the Yamaha. I couldn't be happier.:D



    I have a pair of Acoustic Energy Neo3 as fronts connected to the Marantz,
    Acoustic Energy Neo 1 as rears and Neo Center connected to the Yamaha. No sub as yet.

    I have tried with the Neo3 (for testing sake) and whilst it sounds good, it can't compete with the Marantz. Not even in the same arena. But to be fair the marantz cost more and is in totally different league.
    Before i was using Cambridge Audio 540Rv3 for music and films and it just wasn't up to the job. Good but not good enough with music. Then to learn to get the quality i want i will need to spend £1-1.5k+ on an AV to achieve it when a £300-400 or 2nd hand stereo amp will do the job as good or better. With great aplomb i might add.
    Like you, i wanted to hear my music properly, so i separated the music from the film sounds.

    Don't let the fact that i don't think it's great with music sway you away. That is my own opinion. Let your own ears decide. What sounds good to me, may not to you and visa versa. All AV's primary job are is to bring the film sound stage into the home with the best effect possible and it does that very well indeed. Music is not forgotten but secondary. This is a Top Dollar AV amp and whatever it is lacking in, it more than make its up in something else :smashin:

    Before you ditch the pioneer and if the Yamaha is not up to your musical standards, you might want to try hooking up the Yamaha to it - presuming you are going for the Yamaha of course - and see how that sounds. The music should still sound great with addition of films. If you still want to ditch the pioneer you can or get a decent 2nd stereo amp. ;)

    Another tick in the box was what MI55ION previously stated:
    .:clap:

    Sorry for the long post
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2009
  12. PulsarPilot

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    I would be carefull presuming that you will never need more than 2 HDMI's.
    I have a yammy 3800, which has 4 HDMI's, when I first got it six months ago, I needed two of these, for my V+ box, and my DVD recorder. At the time, I thought that four was overkill, and I'd never use them all. Now though, I have connected my laptop to my amp, to let me watch HD films, and other stuff. If I bought a ps3, or changed my xbox to one with HDMI, that would be 4. I'm also interested in buying a standalone media player, probably doing away with my laptop.
    My point is that most new video devices use HDMI, in the same way as scart became standard a few years ago, it would be very annoying to not be able to use your new amp the way you want to, because of a lack of inputs.

    On the other hand, you could own the amp for 10 years and never need more than two, and you could always use a 'splitter', although I dont know how easy to live with they are?
    I dont want to influence your decision one way or the other, but it's something to bear in mind.

    Just my 2 p's:)
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2009
  13. Don Dadda

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    True that, but in my case , Preouts were an essential item which ruled out the Denon, Sony and Onkyugh....sorry Onkyo.

    Ok, if today, you have a tv with only 1 hdmi input then yes, having 3 or more hdmi inputs on the amp is a must, However a lot tv's sold in the last couple of years or so have 2 or 3 hdmi inputs which doesn't make it so essential to have that many on the amp, In failing that, as you, i and MI55ON have mentioned - a hdmi switch/splitter/expansion box.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2009
  14. gromero

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    Cheers DonDadda. I hadn't ever considered using the pre-outs. I guess this could work with my pioneer stereo amp, but it would require some long and clever cables as my stereo is hidden away in a seperate cabinet.
    From the reviews, the 763 is the best av amp for music playback that I can afford, so I'll still go with this as a good amp for movies and I'll see how thing's work out for the music.

    I ruled out the Denon 1909 because it doesn't have a powered zone 2. The Onkyo because they have issues, heat, reliability etc. and I just don't really like Sony equipment, they do a job but I want quality.

    Now I just have to wait for some stock, seriously frustrating waiting all this time, come on Yamaha!!
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2009
  15. Don Dadda

    Don Dadda
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    yeah, i feel for you on that one. i know you've been trying to get one for a while. No joy with RS freeing up their demo then?

    COME ON YAMAHA!!

    you could always move the cabinet closer - space permitting or an av cabinet and stick them all in there and the pioneer can still be hidden. LOL:D
     
  16. gromero

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    I tried two different RS in london with the 763 on display, neither was willing to sell them to me. Even at the full price.
    They then told me they had 12 delivered to their warehouse on Friday morning, but....they couldn't sell any of those either because they are for customers who MIGHT need to return a faulty unit under warranty and require a replacement. Arrrrgggghhhh
    Patience isn't one of my strong points.
     
  17. Don Dadda

    Don Dadda
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    BUMMER!!:confused:
     
  18. gromero

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    I finally got a 763, for £315 woohoo! A shop in the midlands put a brand new one up on ebay for £349.99, I just happened to have a 10% voucher code that expires tomorrow. So I thought I’d give up with Richer Sounds. I really am beginning to think they are lying about this “dollop” of stock that is expected.
    They had 12 arrive on Friday at their warehouse which was supposedly for returns only for people with faulty products. Their warehouse stock now says 0.
    Every other store I have spoken to says RS have a history of doing this with products that are out of stock to get the interest from a customer who invariably then can be convinced to buy a similar product that is in stock.
    Personally I have gone off RS.
    Is it true if you buy a product from RS you don’t get a manufacturers warranty, but you get a RS guarantee instead? Probably doesn’t make much difference, just something I find odd.

    So anyway, there is one left on ebay at £349.99, worth checking if you also have the 10% discount code. Also, Tottenhamcourtroaddirect.com have them for £329.
     
  19. Don Dadda

    Don Dadda
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    Wahey!! Splendid news:thumbsup:

    Perserverance does pay off. Absolutely made up for you. :D
     
  20. nickymarshall

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    I lost patience with RS at my first encounter, when I wanted to purchase a Samsung TV, Yammy 763 & Sony BDPS350 before Christmas.

    This was before the national shortages of Yamaha's, yet RS had none of the items I wanted in stock. When I enquired about a discount on the package if I bought them together when they were in stock, I was pretty much told to go elsewhere.
     
  21. papa_lazarou

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    £329 is obviously worse than the RS price but with the stock issues I'm thinking of going for this now over the Denon and the Onkyo.

    Is the Yammy recommended at this price?
     
  22. gromero

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    Obviously it's a risk that stock will start arriving in the next couple of weeks and you'll have wasted £40, but I think it is highly unlikely.
    Every company other than RS that I have spoken to have said 4-6 weeks, some even say April for delivery.
    It really depends if you are as impatient as me. You could place an order with exceptional-av for £283 in the hope that stock does arrive.
    Or wait a week and see if RS does get some, but then tottenhamcourtroad direct may run out of stock. They had 3 left as of Sunday morning.

    Depends if you are willing to risk wasting £40. I was lucky and was only risking wasting £25. I can lump that if RS do get some in.

    Would anyone be surprised if RS get some stock and put the price up to match other stores now that it is so popular after the whathifi awards?

    Good luck getting one anyway, the stock issue of all amps is appalling at the moment. I'm sure it has to have more to do with the currency situation at the moment and not manufacturers not being able to meet demands.
     
  23. MI55ION

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  24. Adrenochrome

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    I managed to order the last one they had in stock last night. So many thanks for your post telling us they had stock left:thumbsup:
     
  25. Adrenochrome

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    Spoke to them again this morning confirming my order had been received (will be delivered tomorrow) the chap on the phone said they had found another 2 units upstairs so if you want one be quick as most places are saying this unit is now discontinued with new models due out in April
     
  26. papa_lazarou

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    Finally decided to go for the Yammy and after placing an order with exceptional-av after seeing it was in stock on the website I found out by ringing them that they had no stock and they would refund me down to 10% and put me on the wait list!! Not quite sure when they were going to get round to telling me!!
    I told them they should keep their website up to date and cancelled!

    Anyway went through Tottenhamcourtroaddirect and they had in stock for £329 delivered, still a decent enough price I think.
     
  27. xmb

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    For me I would spend a bit more and get the Sony 2400ES at £379, especially if you want a degree of future proofing included.

    Get your gear while you can as I suspect we will see a big increase in prices over the coming months due to shortages and poor exchange rates!
     
  28. krull

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    Got a Yamaha 763 from PNR on Tottenham Court Road the other week, they have a stack, but you're looking at £380. I got mine in a deal with some new speakers which is where I saved the difference so didn't worry too much especially given that RS stock is scarce. Not much help but wanted to throw that out there.
     

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