Denon launch AVR-X6200W AV Receiver

Discussion in 'AV Receivers & Amplifiers' started by hodg100, Sep 28, 2015.

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    1. hodg100

      hodg100
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    2. geogan

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      They should have made it 11 channel design while they were at it and then it would have been perfect.
       
    3. dante01

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      I assume you mean the inclusion of 11 channels of amplification onboard the receiver? The receiver can process 11 channels, but you have to add an additional two channels of amplification externally. The AVRX7200WA has the same arrangement so why would the model below it benefit from having more onboard amplification stages? Only Onkyo make a receiver with more than 9 onboard channels of amplification. I'd question whether there's anything to gain by having more amps bundled together within such a small space. Surely this is going to limit the power and create more issues in terms of ventilation than it resolves in terms of convenience?


      The price for this is a little steep. It wasn't so long ago that you could buy the AVRX7200W plus the HDCP 2.2 upgrade for less than the suggested price of the AVRX6200. Those who managed to get hold of the AVRX7200W got themselves a bargain.
       
      Last edited: Sep 28, 2015
    4. mtenga

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      The new Anthem 1120 receiver has eleven onboard channels and is due this year. Atmos and DTSX amplifier.
       
    5. dante01

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      Most of those previously buying the Anthem receivers were using external power amps anyway and simply using the receiver as a way to get an Anthem processor with ARC on the cheap. I can't see the inclusion of 11 channels of onboard amplification increasing sales?

      There's also the fact that not everyone will want or need 11 channels of amplication so they'd be paying for something they wouldn't be using. Yeah, it is tidier to have everything bundled up in one box, but that convenience has limited appeal in the long run. THe only manufacturer I really expected an 11 channel receiver from was Yamaha. Yamaha have had experience of this in the past with their Z11, but this had to rely upon Yamaha's own proprietary DSP for presence speakers as opposed to being able to exploit formats that can actually utilise the extra speakers. I wonder whether Yamaha would even consider something along the lines of the Z11 again now that we've formats such as DTS:X and Atmos?
       
    6. mtenga

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      Speaking just for myself I would welcome an "11 channel" phenomenon amongst manufacturers, as long as overall quality was not compromised. It hurt having to buy another cheap amp just to run two back Atmos speakers. But I'm probably a minority.
       
    7. geogan

      geogan
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      Yes 11 built in amps. So we don't have do go trying to add another stereo amp externally. I forgot about the X7200 model being higher up. I just mean actually build a proper 11 channel receiver. Stick it in a bigger box if space and heat is an issue! Call it the X8200 if needed. Don't charge more for it :smashin: Also do all 11 amps have to be the same size/power? Could the 4 atmos or the rears could be slightly smaller or less powerful and use less space, i mean they hardly go continuously like the centre or LR channels do.
       
    8. KelvinS1965

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      I think that's a fair assumption, though there is bound to be a disc in the future that disproves this theory by pushing the boundaries with the Atmos speakers (a bit like Edge of Tomorrow did with subs). I'm planning on using the 'little' amps built into an AVR to power the Atmos channels anyway and a beefier external power amp for the main 7 channels, so I'm more interested in an AVR that allows this flexibility (and 11 channel processing of course).

      What I'm not sure about yet is what this AVR would give me over the Marantz 7010 that is also on my list of potential AVRs? I don't want or need any streaming/phone app/Auddyssey type 'features' (though the later I can at least switch off), so perhaps I'm not a typical target buyer: Just down to straight sound quality (especially in stereo) and the above mentioned flexibility with the power amp assignments.
       
    9. Blu-rayx

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      Denon AVR-X6200 v Denon AVR-X7200, I'm not sure which one to go for, To replace my Denon AVR X4000 :)

      Can't wait for the review. I have a sneaky suspicion the AVR-X6200 will be better value for money over the AVR-X7200.
       
      Last edited: Sep 29, 2015
    10. kbfern

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      Nice avr but it's quite a premium over the next model down X4200w with only really 2 channels less. I am looking at the 4200 @ £1099 as being my next avr and using in conjunction with a 5 channel power amp for a 5.2.4 setup. It would be nice to go 7.2.4 but that is a big premium and in my smallish room 5.2.4 should be ok (I hope:))

      The Marantz 7010 is priced mid way between the two and does 9 channel amps so that may be an option for me as don't see much difference between the Denon/Marantz to justify the extra £400.
       
    11. indus

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      The power output doesn't bother me as I'll be using ext amps for at least 7 channels. So then In terms of 6200 vs 7200 the only difference seems to be

      1) AL24 processing vs AL32. I have no idea whether this would make any difference of any kind

      2) L and R amps separated. The audiofool in me likes the idea of this but again I'm not sure whether this would make any difference given I'll be using ext amps for 7 channels
       
    12. Diagnosticz

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      I have to agree with Dante regarding not having 11 channels of on board amplification, these av receivers already have trouble powering 9 channels so adding two more would not make sense both power wise and space. You have the option of adding extra channels if you wish and like myself i have always run a separate power amp to run the mains, which not only improves the front stage but takes the load of the receiver.
       
    13. geogan

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      If I had the money I would get the Marantz 7010 and the extra Marantz stereo amp matched (design and audio wise) to it for the extra channels for now. Obviously a big seperate power amp which just does nothing but power 11 channels is better but cost too much.
      Surprised you dismiss Audyssey equalisation. If you understand what it does and how it works it is very impressive and essential in my book - way more advanced than any old slider equalisation and impossible to replicate using manual tuning by user (i hear people saying they do level and distance adjustments themselves with meters - this is NOT what Audyssey equalisation does)
       
    14. KelvinS1965

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      I plan to use an Arcam P7 for the main channels, so I don't need to worry about the extra Marantz stereo amp (I'll use the AVR's built in channels to run the last 2 Atmos channels).

      I dismiss Audyssey because I've used it in a previous AVR (Onkyo 818), so I fully understand what it does but I didn't like what it did to the sound of the main speakers (sub was better to be fair). However, I now own a miniDSP Dirac room eq (DDRC-88A) which I find is far superior to Audyssey and is very flexible in terms of target curves and getting the sound just how I want it. Therefore the main channels have to use the AVR pre outs so that they can go through the '88A, so only the last two Atmos channels will have no eq (not such an issue IMHO) and it saves buying a more expensive processor/extra stereo amp.
       
    15. wl1

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      I noticed "The AVR-X6200W is also certified by the Imaging Science Foundation for video quality, and is equipped with the full suite of ISFccc advanced video calibration controls." - From the X7200WA review and discussion - Denon confirmed no users were able to access these controls. I understand, no calibrators use them either - is this just another label and tick on the box?

      It would be good if you could confirm the exact "full suite". Thanks,
       
    16. geogan

      geogan
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      Oh right. Never heard of that processor. I have heard Dirac is superior but again most amps with it are way more expensive (or minimal features). Yes being able to modify target correction curves is a very good feature. Don't want to get off track of thread but are you not worried about introducing ancient unbalanced RCA analog inputs/outputs into your system? I'd prefer to keep everything either fully digital or at least balanced XLR if needed... I can't imagine the signal coming through RCA is great as a source for the DSP chip (and then there's all the extra conversion back and forth from amp to speakers:
      D->A (RCA) A->D (process) D->A (amplify)...)
       
    17. KelvinS1965

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      Any minuscule impact of the extra ADA stage is completely counteracted by the improvement brought about by Dirac IMHO (which has impulse and frequency response correction, rather than just the later with Audyssey). Since I can't afford a £10(20?)K processor with it built in then it's a moot point and why I'm looking at AVRs like this 6200 or perhaps the Marantz 7010.
       
    18. bodhi

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      Any idea when we might see a review of this and/or the 4200? I am desperate to make a purchase in the next 2-3 weeks for my new cinema installation and it's a toss-up between these two and the Marantz for me.
       
    19. indus

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      I'm trying to figure out what the significant differences are between the 6200 and the SR 7010. If you can negotiate a small discount on the former then they are about the same price.

      The 6200 has marginally more power but ticks just the same boxes as the 7010 in terms of spec.

      Am I missing something?

      I've never heard a Marantz AVR, do they have a different sonic signature to the Denon?
       
    20. Blues Rock

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      Rediculous most average homes, neighbours can't cope with the noise coming from 5 speakers let alone 11, I am happy 3.1 does me. Too many speakers clouds the dialogue, will end up going deaf
       
    21. KelvinS1965

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      I don't know about 'sonic signature' (though I still own a back up Denon 3805 that seems quite warm sounding, but I think newer models have changed more than once in this regard).

      I don't have an issue myself; 7 speakers and 2 subwoofers and no complaints from the neighbours (granted it's not a semi or a flat). Dialogue generally comes from the centre and sounds clear as a bell unless it's a very badly mastered disc. From the Atmos demo I had there is no reason to expect the extra speakers to cloud the dialogue either.

      Given that I already have tinnitus from drumming/guitar, I tend not to listen at reference levels anyway as I don't want to make it worse. Adding extra speakers won't raise the SPL either.

      If you're happy with 3.1 then fair enough...can't see the point in reading threads about new AVRs though as any HD codec capable AVR (including some good value end of line models) will be suitable for such a set up. Personally I like having a surround effect, so even my second room is 4.1 (no room for a centre).
       
    22. Dfour

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      Wonder how this would stack up against the new Yamaha amps? Never owned a Denon so have nothing against them.
       
    23. Dunk42

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      Is there an idiot's guide to what I should look at to compare this to, say, the Anthem 720 and the Marantz 7010?

      Or is comparing any of these "sub-2k" models to the Anthem like an apples-to-oranges comparison?

      A couple of dealers told me that the Anthem sound quality is leaps and bounds above things like a Marantz or an Onkyo. I know I need to trial different ones myself (and hoping to do so a week Saturday) but it'd be good to be slightly educated going into the demo room as to what kind of things I'm looking out for to compare and to make a price/features/performance comparison.
       
    24. indus

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      As you say the most important thing is how they sound to you and that's where the demo becomes very useful.

      But you've got to decide what's important to you in terms of a feature set. Are you interested in Atmos/Auro/DTS;X sound formats? If you aren't and just want to run a standard 5.1 system then a sub £2k Anthem may well be for you, if you want a more elaborate set up then it looks like the sub £2k Anthems won't be able to do it.

      There maybe other features that are important to you ie running sound/music in a second or even third zone. Some AVRs will be able to do this and some won't.

      Are you interested in streaming music, some will have all the bells and whistles to let you do this some won't.

      HDCP 2.2 will be used to copy protect the new upcoming ultra high def blu rays. Only the latest AVRs have this and if this interests you then you should tick this box as well.

      If you give a better idea of what you are trying to achieve then hopefully it will make it easier to offer you some useful ideas.

      Best
       
    25. Dunk42

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      Fair questions - I was more coming from a "like for like" comparison basis - i.e. Anthem are better than Onkyo are better than xyz assuming an equal feature set... that said, personally I'm looking for an AVR that will let me do Atmos 7.1.4 in the next 12 months, but starting @ 5.1 in the short term (I need to save longer for those extra speakers - and, presumably, an extra amplifier for more speakers as I think something like the 1120 will be out of my budget in the short term). I don't plan on replacing it in the next 5+ years, so things like HDCP2.2 and 4k support are pretty much mandatory.
       
    26. pressure

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      I am asking much the same questions as @Dunk42 and @indus.

      For £1700 rrp on the 6200 you get much the same spec as a 7200 which is now £2500 - but 24 bit processing and possibly slightly worse analogue amplification. I would really like a reviewer / user to check if this difference is material.

      I'd really prefer anthem arc over audyssey. But the 720 is £2300 - which is an interesting price point, less than the 7200 for same spec but arguably superior EQ. Canny. And much less than things like the big arcam. It's a shame anthem is not playing in the ~£1500 - ~£1700 Dts-x space, but you can see why. No doubt street price for the 7200 will drop to £2300 when the 720 launches in January. £2300 is probably beyond my budget and since I want a long term investment I'm left looking at the 6200 and its competitors.

      If you already have a mini dsp 88 - and concomitant pre-power set up - then I wonder again how important the difference between 24 bit and 32 bit processing would be. Would you want the lowest noise floor on your processing? Or is there another benefit from higher bit rates? (or none at all...)
       
    27. indus

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      All I can tell you is what I've heard with my own ears. I heard the predecessor of the 6200 ie the 5200 at Epic Home Cinema. The front three channels were powered by external amps and Dirac was used.

      The sound was absolutely incredible, better than most commercial cinemas dare I say.

      My conclusion from that experience was that the 5200 (and therefore the 6200) can produce the very highest levels of sound reproduction for cinema if the rest of your components are up to the right standard. Unless of course you have £50K+ to spend on something uber high end.
       
    28. pressure

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      Excellent feedback Indus, thank you.

      I wonder how much of the sound was due to Dirac though. Properly powerful EQ. I wonder how good the 5200 or 6200 sound with just Audyssey.

      Which is where I came in. Is there a way to get Dts x, 4k hdcp and great EQ at around £1500? I think the answer is no, you have to go up a class or two.
       
    29. Diagnosticz

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      Movie rooms will do the denon 7200wa spec for 1699.99. I will buy one soon. Denon set the prices for dealers at 2500 but its basically a 7200 with £150 HDCP board Its a bad play by denon to discontinue the 7200 and putting at bigger price tag on the wa.
       
    30. indus

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      Yes
      Yes, its difficult to know how much of the final result was down to the dirac. The way I see it is that anything from the 6200 and above is capable of great things. You might be lucky and get that result using the intrinsic x32 audyssey or you might have to spend extra on something like the dirac.

      If you shopped around I reckon you could get the 6200 for £1400. If you had to buy the dirac then another £800, but you may not need it depending on your room etc.

      So best case scenario £1400 or worst case scenario £2200. But that would give you a very high end sound if the rest of your components were up to the job
       

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