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Question Denon AVR-X4500H Shuts down Reboots

tomcoleman

Active Member
Hi guys

I have recently purchased a Denon AVR-X4500H

This is linked to a OLED77C8LLA

I have 5.1 Kef KEF HTC-1001.2 for 3 speakers at front, and 2 side/rear and 1 sub.

Speaker cable for all speakers is QED Silver Anniversary XT cable.

4 x ceiling Speakers which are Dolby Atmos KEF Ci160QR

I have the TV connected into HDMI1 i dont use CEC/ARC or anything like that so its all disabled.

HDMI 2 - SkyQ
HMDI 4 - Nvidia Sheild

When watching skyQ or a movie and turn the volume up to around 60db+ it runs for anywhere between 30seconds to few mins then AMP switches off with flashing red light. After resetting the amp i have a screen telling me there is a speaker protection mode enabled.

I spent around 3-4hrs yesterday re-crimping and re-twisting all cables took all speakers off walls and ceiling and made sure all connections looked good.

I'm struggling to figure out why this is happerning. Its only when the speakers are cranked up by the looks of it.

On a seperate issue i have 4 ceiling speakers also connected for ATMOS these are the KEF Ci160QR

When doing the tone test the sound is very low, also seems tone test comes out of 2 speakers at a time, but this might be because they are paired? ???




















 
Last edited:

mushii

Distinguished Member
I am guessing from your photos that you have your amp in a rack. These Amps need very good airflow around them, otherwise they are prone to overheating, unless you have forced air cooling, such as an AC Infinity cooler. You should ideally have 4” to 6” clearance on both sides of the AVR and similar above it. If you haven’t this is likely the source of your problems. Removing the back from your rack / cabinet alone will not be sufficient.
 

tomcoleman

Active Member
I am guessing from your photos that you have your amp in a rack. These Amps need very good airflow around them, otherwise they are prone to overheating, unless you have forced air cooling, such as an AC Infinity cooler. You should ideally have 4” to 6” clearance on both sides of the AVR and similar above it. If you haven’t this is likely the source of your problems. Removing the back from your rack / cabinet alone will not be sufficient.
Thanks for the pointer - I have since regigged the rack, its quite cool under the stairs.

I did think heat issue but even from powering on first thing in morning and its cool/cold within 1-5mins issue happens when going over the 60db volume which made me think not heat related.

I can move the amp and test it in another location, my onkyo also in the rack doesnt have any heat issues and has been running fine way before the denon got installed.

I'll still keep heat on my list as "possibles" but doesnt feel like a heat releated issue, due to it being cold under the stairs (open area), with plently of venalation around the cab, however not ruling this out.
 

gibbsy

Moderator
It's how quick that heat will build up. How much room do you have above the unit, a lot of the heat rises through the vents and if there is no room to shift it then a safety shut down becomes inevitable. Denon receivers run very toasty indeed. I have a 6200 running R Series speakers which is in a cabinet but with adequate ventilation, especially above. No heating issues even running for over eight hours a day.

There is only one way to check and that is too test the unit out in the open.
 

tomcoleman

Active Member
It's how quick that heat will build up. How much room do you have above the unit, a lot of the heat rises through the vents and if there is no room to shift it then a safety shut down becomes inevitable. Denon receivers run very toasty indeed. I have a 6200 running R Series speakers which is in a cabinet but with adequate ventilation, especially above. No heating issues even running for over eight hours a day.

There is only one way to check and that is too test the unit out in the open.
Agreed, since the re-shuffle around in the rack its got around 5-6" above it, there's nothing tightly packed and its not like a server rack where its warm around it.

However noted and will do the test, i did at the time have everything else off yesterday when i was testing for 3-4hrs. Also this morning everything was off stone/cold and within 1min of playing bumblee it did the same.

I used the amp last night to watch a TV show for around 4hrs, was at 50-55db and no issues, its once i push over 60-65db (using more power) it does the protection mode.
 

gibbsy

Moderator
Can you change your volume scale from the absolute to the dB scale. The reason I ask is that nearly all use the dB scale as this gives a reading that we can all relate to. As an example I usually have the volume at between -20dB and -15dB for film from blu ray. The more volume you give then the closer to -0dB it gets, the 4500 will go past the 0dB to +18dB.

You could also try with the Eco setting set to on. This will reduce the heat but will not give the full power to the used amps. With the Eggs this should not prove a detrimental problem.
 

tomcoleman

Active Member
Can you change your volume scale from the absolute to the dB scale. The reason I ask is that nearly all use the dB scale as this gives a reading that we can all relate to. As an example I usually have the volume at between -20dB and -15dB for film from blu ray. The more volume you give then the closer to -0dB it gets, the 4500 will go past the 0dB to +18dB.

You could also try with the Eco setting set to on. This will reduce the heat but will not give the full power to the used amps. With the Eggs this should not prove a detrimental problem.
I'll try that - presume in the settings somewhere?

Currently ECO mode is on - default setting.

I did a factory reset on the AMP yesterday and still same issue.

Im running the latest firmware from the online updater also.
 

Mister_Tad

Active Member
On a seperate issue i have 4 ceiling speakers also connected for ATMOS these are the KEF Ci160QR

When doing the tone test the sound is very low, also seems tone test comes out of 2 speakers at a time, but this might be because they are paired? ???
This is a red flag to me... what do you mean you have them "paired"?

When you play test tones, they should come out of one speaker and one speaker only.
If you have these wired incorrectly (like the +- between them swapped) that could explain them playing together, the low volume and the amp protection shutdown.
 

gibbsy

Moderator
In settings under volume, simple change between the two.

I still think your racking position is the problem. They are so sensitive.
 

tomcoleman

Active Member
This is a red flag to me... what do you mean you have them "paired"?

When you play test tones, they should come out of one speaker and one speaker only.
If you have these wired incorrectly (like the +- between them swapped) that could explain them playing together, the low volume and the amp protection shutdown.
I’m not a guru of amps but I’m not a newbie I did the wire runs myself nothing complex here just straight runs in the ceiling to the amp

When going through the GUI doing the setup it asks about ceiling speakers I have always chosen and I quote “4 speakers (2 pairs)”

I didn’t know if the amp was thinking they are paired together some how - that’s what through me

Also in the manual it mentioned about changing inputs for Dolby atmos ceiling speakers this is where it’s getting very confusing

Agree one speaker should play at a time but it doesn’t it’s doing 2 at a time 2 front and 2 rear for example as if their paired like the description on the GUI
 

Mister_Tad

Active Member
Two pairs, as in a front L/R pair and a back L/R pair, is how I would read that (as opposed to... I dunno, three front heights and a VOG).

There's no configuration in which a test tone meant for one channel would be playing out of more than one speaker - if there is, crossed wires could be the culprit, and explain the shutdown as well.

So when you play tones through each of the height channels, which speakers do they play out of?

If you disconnect the wires from the heights, or disable the channels, does it still shut down?

Have you triple-checked that in addition to the wires being connected securely and not shorting, that the +- for each channel on the back of the amp is going to the correct speaker?
 

navarro67

Active Member
Agreed, since the re-shuffle around in the rack its got around 5-6" above it, there's nothing tightly packed and its not like a server rack where its warm around it.

However noted and will do the test, i did at the time have everything else off yesterday when i was testing for 3-4hrs. Also this morning everything was off stone/cold and within 1min of playing bumblee it did the same.

I used the amp last night to watch a TV show for around 4hrs, was at 50-55db and no issues, its once i push over 60-65db (using more power) it does the protection mode.
I had heat issues on my X4500H, not that long after purchase. Bought a pair of fans immediately and no issues since.

Simple test though - as soon as you get the issue go to the unit and stick your hand on top of the casing. If it's not hot you don't have a heat issue.
 

tomcoleman

Active Member
Two pairs, as in a front L/R pair and a back L/R pair, is how I would read that (as opposed to... I dunno, three front heights and a VOG).

There's no configuration in which a test tone meant for one channel would be playing out of more than one speaker - if there is, crossed wires could be the culprit, and explain the shutdown as well.

So when you play tones through each of the height channels, which speakers do they play out of?

If you disconnect the wires from the heights, or disable the channels, does it still shut down?

i understand, i dont take this the wrong way.

I think according to the manual i have to choose Height SP & Dolby SP preset when setting up the ATMOS ceiling speakers??? its not very clear.

As you can see from my photos, everything is neatly cut and crimped/connected.

I have re-seated everything no crosses wires or pairs.

from the attached diagram when i test tone ceiling speakers i get sound from 2 at a time, i think that maybe because of the mode i have chosen in the setup process it bonds them together, i have screenshotted the manual too for reference.



 

tomcoleman

Active Member
I had heat issues on my X4500H, not that long after purchase. Bought a pair of fans immediately and no issues since.

Simple test though - as soon as you get the issue go to the unit and stick your hand on top of the casing. If it's not hot you don't have a heat issue.
what fans did you buy?

I'll check the heat.......
 

navarro67

Active Member
what fans did you buy?

I'll check the heat.......
I bought the 'AC Infinity Multifan S5' pair through amazon (link below but currently out of stock and appear to have jumped up in price...).

https://www.amazon.co.uk/AC-Infinity-MULTIFAN-Receiver-Playstation/dp/B00IJ2J2K0

For reference mine is in an open TV rack. The front and rear are open, slightly limited space to one side (lots on the other), very limited space above (circa 10mm!!). The fans would be most efficient on top of the unit, but due to space limitations I have one either side against the vents, one pushing air in and the other pulling out the opposite side to keep a singular air path.

It used to get seriously hot, I never felt it above room temp since. But first check is whether heat is your issue, or something else
 

Mister_Tad

Active Member
i understand, i dont take this the wrong way.

I think according to the manual i have to choose Height SP & Dolby SP preset when setting up the ATMOS ceiling speakers??? its not very clear.

As you can see from my photos, everything is neatly cut and crimped/connected.

I have re-seated everything no crosses wires or pairs.

from the attached diagram when i test tone ceiling speakers i get sound from 2 at a time, i think that maybe because of the mode i have chosen in the setup process it bonds them together, i have screenshotted the manual too for reference.



"Dolby Speakers" are referring to upward firing ones I think... if my memory of setting up my X8500 serves me well.

You want 4 ceiling speakers, no dolby speakers, front height, rear height (or top front and top rear, but the former will let you play Auro content as well)

I think the heat's a red herring. You could cook a steak on top of my X8500 in spite of it being well ventilated with room to breathe, and the internal fans don't even switch on after playing it hard and loud for hours.
 

tomcoleman

Active Member
I bought the 'AC Infinity Multifan S5' pair through amazon (link below but currently out of stock and appear to have jumped up in price...).

https://www.amazon.co.uk/AC-Infinity-MULTIFAN-Receiver-Playstation/dp/B00IJ2J2K0

For reference mine is in an open TV rack. The front and rear are open, slightly limited space to one side (lots on the other), very limited space above (circa 10mm!!). The fans would be most efficient on top of the unit, but due to space limitations I have one either side against the vents, one pushing air in and the other pulling out the opposite side to keep a singular air path.

It used to get seriously hot, I never felt it above room temp since. But first check is whether heat is your issue, or something else
Thanks!

I think as a test before i buy i have a dyson desk fan, can stick that ontop at full power and see if still cuts off....
 

tomcoleman

Active Member
"Dolby Speakers" are referring to upward firing ones I think... if my memory of setting up my X8500 serves me well.

You want 4 ceiling speakers, no dolby speakers, front height, rear height (or top front and top rear, but the former will let you play Auro content as well)

I think the heat's a red herring. You could cook a steak on top of my X8500 in spite of it being well ventilated with room to breathe, and the internal fans don't even switch on after playing it hard and loud for hours.
thanks, so i dont need to play with the input assigns, as the manual says if they are dolby then need to change the config? The ceiling speakers are 4 x KEF Ci160QR which are dolby atmos
 

Mister_Tad

Active Member
thanks, so i dont need to play with the input assigns, as the manual says if they are dolby then need to change the config? The ceiling speakers are 4 x KEF Ci160QR which are dolby atmos
Speaker installation AVR-X4500H

Your configuration is towards the bottom.

Denon refers to the upward firing speakers that you place on top of your ear-level speakers as "Atmos enabled speakers" - you don't have any of those.

You're using ceiling speakers - which can be used to play back Atmos (and DTS-X and so on), however are not "Atmos speakers" as referred to in the amp.
 

tomcoleman

Active Member
Speaker installation AVR-X4500H

Your configuration is towards the bottom.

Denon refers to the upward firing speakers that you place on top of your ear-level speakers as "Atmos enabled speakers" - you don't have any of those.

You're using ceiling speakers - which can be used to play back Atmos (and DTS-X and so on), however are not "Atmos speakers" as referred to in the amp.
ok cool - clears that up!
 

navarro67

Active Member
"Dolby Speakers" are referring to upward firing ones I think... if my memory of setting up my X8500 serves me well.

You want 4 ceiling speakers, no dolby speakers, front height, rear height (or top front and top rear, but the former will let you play Auro content as well)

I think the heat's a red herring. You could cook a steak on top of my X8500 in spite of it being well ventilated with room to breathe, and the internal fans don't even switch on after playing it hard and loud for hours.
On the X4500, with restricted vent, you'd get a wet uncooked steak... and no sound :rotfl:

I do agree with @Mister_Tad though, doesn't sound like heat is the issue here
 

JH4

Well-known Member
I'm guessing you have one speaker that's low impedance. Suggest you disconnect all and then connect each in turn to find the faulty one. Don't believe heat is the issue. ( Or check them with a multimeter.) Try just connecting the front 2 first, and go from there.
I'm sure you will find the faulty one that way. If it cuts out with NO speakers connected, you have a faulty Amp.
 

tomcoleman

Active Member
ok small update last night i did some more testing.

Turned off all ECO modes, and everything i didnt need that may add extra processing (upscale etc)

Now i still get the same reboot but i dont get any warning messages on the screen like before.

After testing for 2-3hrs i can place my hand ontop of the AMP and its not even hot its warm like a mobile phone warm on exessive use.

I also after that watched 2 hrs of TV under 60% no issues.

I have also managed to capture the process on video


 

Mister_Tad

Active Member
Try just connecting the front 2 first, and go from there.
I'm sure you will find the faulty one that way. If it cuts out with NO speakers connected, you have a faulty Amp.
You can check protection history, see attached screenshot.
Have you done these things?
 

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