Demo Feedback - Naim Uniti Atom/Lyngdorf TDAI 1120/Hegel H120

Rob Sinden

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
I believe the new PuriFi power amps have the potential for 131db s/n ratio which will be as good as it gets…… and so should add no discernible noise to a system.

There are lots of power amps with s/n ratio around 100db and you definitely hear these in a quiet room.

Don’t forget it’s the s/n ratio of the total system that’s important and preamps compromise sound quality. Most amps sound mediocre at low volume, great at high volume and then run in to distortion if turned up.

Products like the TDA2200, 2170 and 3400 don’t have this problems as the don’t have a preamp as they adjust volume by voltage. This means the total pre / power amp adds far less noise to a system than a stack of the fanciest electronics.
 

EightSixEight

Standard Member
At this point we hit a strange problem which was never resolved through the whole demo which was a lack of volume/power which manifested itself as having the volume control at 95%+ to get what I would consider a good listening level.

Any feedback on the above and volume issue with the Lyngdorf would be greatly appreciated and apologies for the paperback novel here.
Perhaps a bit too late for the OP, but what I suspect is that the source volume (sensitivity) was way too low for that source. The default is -12dB I believe.

I have the 1170 + the LS50 Meta II (plus a SVS sub) and can unequivocally attest that the baby Lyngdorf has more than sufficient power to make one ears bleed.

Also, the HDMI-CEC works great to have this set-up work as a 2.1 TV stereo set-up. I can control the volume and the on/off via my AppleTV -> LG OLED TV -> TDAI-1170.
 

harkpabst

Active Member
Perhaps a bit too late for the OP, but what I suspect is that the source volume (sensitivity) was way too low for that source. The default is -12dB I believe.

I have the 1170 + the LS50 Meta II (plus a SVS sub) and can unequivocally attest that the baby Lyngdorf has more than sufficient power to make one ears bleed.

Also, the HDMI-CEC works great to have this set-up work as a 2.1 TV stereo set-up. I can control the volume and the on/off via my AppleTV -> LG OLED TV -> TDAI-1170.
That would have been a possible but rather unlikely reason. As far as I remember there has actually been a real - but minor - volume control issue with the TDAI-1120 and Roon (at least on Apple devices). However, this has been fixed with the first or second firmware update.

As strange luck want's it my first demo at the dealer's has also been using KEF R3s and a Naim Unity Atom for comparison using Roon as the only source for convenience. Mostly the dealer's convenience, for sure. Exactly the same volume control issue came up. It wasn't really a max volume issue, though. You just had to be brave enough and crank the amp up to levels above 0dB and it would well go loud enough. Increasing the input sensitivity also would have helped but all this should no longer be needed with Roon, as long as the 1120 is on a rather current firmware.

To be honest it was more than just luck to have the R3s wired up for that demo. At that time I had a pair of R7s (plus a pair of LS50s as backup). Since the R7 wasn't available for demo I had explicitly asked for the R3, assuming it would be similar enough to the R7.

Sidetrack R7 vs. R3:
From what I've heard and experienced since, I am very much convinced that R7 (despite being very capable speakers) are not worth the extra cost over R3. I would even go so far as to say that R3 is the better speaker overall. They are every inch as good as most reviews state they are. Or better. I have sold my R7 in the meantime and gone back to LS50.

It's important to note that the demo was done without RoomPerfect and no, this is not the best way to compare amps. It was purely due to time constraints. The very first TDAI-1120 demo unit had just arrived the other day. Under those specific conditions and using my choice of music the Naim did not sound harsh to me but rather (nicely but overly) sweet, the Lyngdorf being just 100% neutral.

I spend almost two hours listening to music but actually was sold like 15 minutes into the session. Bad news: This demo unit was the only 1120 available at that time, no chance of grabbing one off the shelf. We negotiated a home demo as soon as new deliveries would come in.

Three weeks later it turned out that I had been forgotten. :p So the dealer sent me a unit along with an invoice that I simply might want to pay in case I wanted to keep the amp. He also included the Lyngdorf remote free of charge. Smart move. But I would have bought the amp anyway. ;)

I always missed something that's so special about the LS50 when listening to my R7s. To my taste they do have some almost absolute qualities in midrange reproduction that I personally find only bettered by rare exotic stuff like the original Quad ESL. The difference became a little less pronounced with the TDAI-1120, but I was still set to sell the R7. Passive LS50 are a great match for the Lyngdorf if you listen mostly at moderate level.

Sidetrack R3 vs. LS50:
Yes, compared to R3s LS50s are obviously limited when it comes to bass extension and maximum SPL. Also R3 is closer to LS50 than R7. Just add the 1120 and you end up with a complete audio system putting the competition to shame. Still I think that a pair of LS50 plus a pair of good subs wired to the 1120 are even better.

So, this is the route I finally choose, adding one and later a second subwoofer. If I didn't already had my LS50 (and my R7) before I would have probably bought the 1120 wit a pair of R3s.
 

EightSixEight

Standard Member
That would have been a possible but rather unlikely reason. As far as I remember there has actually been a real - but minor - volume control issue with the TDAI-1120 and Roon (at least on Apple devices). However, this has been fixed with the first or second firmware update.

As strange luck want's it my first demo at the dealer's has also been using KEF R3s and a Naim Unity Atom for comparison using Roon as the only source for convenience. Mostly the dealer's convenience, for sure. Exactly the same volume control issue came up. It wasn't really a max volume issue, though. You just had to be brave enough and crank the amp up to levels above 0dB and it would well go loud enough. Increasing the input sensitivity also would have helped but all this should no longer be needed with Roon, as long as the 1120 is on a rather current firmware.

To be honest it was more than just luck to have the R3s wired up for that demo. At that time I had a pair of R7s (plus a pair of LS50s as backup). Since the R7 wasn't available for demo I had explicitly asked for the R3, assuming it would be similar enough to the R7.

Sidetrack R7 vs. R3:
From what I've heard and experienced since, I am very much convinced that R7 (despite being very capable speakers) are not worth the extra cost over R3. I would even go so far as to say that R3 is the better speaker overall. They are every inch as good as most reviews state they are. Or better. I have sold my R7 in the meantime and gone back to LS50.

It's important to note that the demo was done without RoomPerfect and no, this is not the best way to compare amps. It was purely due to time constraints. The very first TDAI-1120 demo unit had just arrived the other day. Under those specific conditions and using my choice of music the Naim did not sound harsh to me but rather (nicely but overly) sweet, the Lyngdorf being just 100% neutral.

I spend almost two hours listening to music but actually was sold like 15 minutes into the session. Bad news: This demo unit was the only 1120 available at that time, no chance of grabbing one off the shelf. We negotiated a home demo as soon as new deliveries would come in.

Three weeks later it turned out that I had been forgotten. :p So the dealer sent me a unit along with an invoice that I simply might want to pay in case I wanted to keep the amp. He also included the Lyngdorf remote free of charge. Smart move. But I would have bought the amp anyway. ;)

I always missed something that's so special about the LS50 when listening to my R7s. To my taste they do have some almost absolute qualities in midrange reproduction that I personally find only bettered by rare exotic stuff like the original Quad ESL. The difference became a little less pronounced with the TDAI-1120, but I was still set to sell the R7. Passive LS50 are a great match for the Lyngdorf if you listen mostly at moderate level.

Sidetrack R3 vs. LS50:
Yes, compared to R3s LS50s are obviously limited when it comes to bass extension and maximum SPL. Also R3 is closer to LS50 than R7. Just add the 1120 and you end up with a complete audio system putting the competition to shame. Still I think that a pair of LS50 plus a pair of good subs wired to the 1120 are even better.

So, this is the route I finally choose, adding one and later a second subwoofer. If I didn't already had my LS50 (and my R7) before I would have probably bought the 1120 wit a pair of R3s.
I also got the remote for free from my dealer, but it was on backorder so I received it a couple of months afterwards. By then I realized that I didn't really need it:
  • when playing TV, I control the volume and the on/off via the Apple TV remote (via HDMI).
  • when playing vinyl, I use either my phone or computer to connect the TDAI. Plus since I have to get my butt off the couch to change the discs, I can just physically control the volume.
 

Rob Sinden

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
I’m really pleased you chose the Lyngdorf.

Until you have heard what RoomPerfect can do with your speakers in your room, I don’t think people will appreciate how transformational it is.

What other upgrade will make such a big difference that you’ll can hear it recorded on a phone and played back on your pc speakers?

 

harkpabst

Active Member
By then I realized that I didn't really need it:
  • when playing TV, I control the volume and the on/off via the Apple TV remote (via HDMI).
  • when playing vinyl, I use either my phone or computer to connect the TDAI. Plus since I have to get my butt off the couch to change the discs, I can just physically control the volume.
My TV doesn't play nicely withe the 1120 via ARC, so I went back to coaxial connection and still prefer the hardware remote for volume control. Sometimes it would work for two or three days, then again not.
At least this was the status prior to firmware 1.40/1.28. Didn't give it another go since. I also didn't try more than two different HDMI cables. It would need an angled connector (to the right direction, of course) since the TV is on a wall mount and I just got tired of fiddling.

I totally agree on the records thing and find myself pressing the mute button and turning the volume knob quite often. What I like most about the physical remote is one-click-access to all 10 vTuner presets.

Until you have heard what RoomPerfect can do with your speakers in your room, I don’t think people will appreciate how transformational it is.
I do understand where those people come from, searching for the "pure natural sound" from any device before applying "tweaks" to adapt it to anything. Problem is, this approach is ignoring the facts and exaggerating high-end myths. We've seen it here on this thread. Room influence is played down or ignored. Speaker positioning is done following unfounded historic rules of of thumb, not acoustical engineering principles. Amplifier "sound" is tagged "magic" (while analog active crossover are said to be acoustically transparent). It's a joke.

In the end each music loving hifi buyer has amount X to spend at a given point in time. Even if you don't use all features of the 1120 (but RoomPerfect) it's a bargain at its price point. In my case where I use it as a phono pre, control amp, DAC for CD transport and TV, internet radio tuner, Spotify endpoint, UPnP streamer, digital crossover, power amp for the main speakers and room correction it's absolutely beyond compare.
 
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