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Dead pixels on my new Panny Viera 37"

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs' started by fredde, Jul 23, 2004.

  1. fredde

    fredde
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    I hooked up my new Viera for the first time for about 2 hours ago, the first thing I discovered was that it has 3 dead pixels on the right side. They dont seem to turn green so I have 3 red dots on my screen. Has anybody the same problem and what does Panasonic say to that? Is it something you can expect on a plasma?

    Earlier today :) I had the Philips 9945 it didnt have any dead pixels.

    Anybody who wants to comment on this?

    Brgds
    Fredde
     
  2. Dulux

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    Fred,
    No such problems with my 37". I'd have a word with the retailer!!!
     
  3. BuzzLightyear

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    Just got it ? Return it ? Shouldn't except it !!!
     
  4. Baz80

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    i have had my 37 pe30 about two months during wimbledon i noticed a dead pixel right in the centre of the screen almost broke my heart 48 hours later it miraculously fixed itself no problems since give it a day or two
     
  5. fredde

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    Ok, I will give it a few days to get heat up and se if it might disappear.

    But if not it is straight back to the dealer.
     
  6. AngryofMayfair

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    Just about every manufacturer (including Panasonic) has a printed disclaimer in the manual that says this can happen and is not a malfunction - that it's an inevitable part of the manufacturing process blah blah...

    Most of them will replace a panel with clumps of *hot* pixels that are within a centre rectangle but one or two small hot pixels around the edges may not be seen as a problem (to them)

    How the retailer deals with it is up to them - that's probably what will differentiate a good retailer from a bad one

    Good luck - there's nothing worse than finding this problem on a brand new set... :-(
     
  7. andrewmellor

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    Hi,
    I too believe that many manufacturers state that 99.9% of pixels working is within tolerance which as good as it might look can be pretty bad considering that 1 in 1000 can be out when all screens will have at least hundreds of thousands!!
     
  8. MAW

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    It's a serious problem for us 'good' retailers. You guys expect us to sell to you at £30 profit on a £2500 item, then expect us to take it back used, with no possibility of manufacturer backup, when it's inside tolerance by a factor of 10. Just a thought, this place being my opportunity to speak my thoughts. I do understand how you must feel having spent so much on a display, but as pointed out, the terms are clearly laid out, they guarantee only that 99.9% of pixels are live, and as also pointed out, they are not necessarily stuck for good. In my experience, 'stuck' ones do recover, stick again, recover and so on. If they are black they are dead, again, in my experience never to recover.
     
  9. pjclark1

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    another good reason for only buying online
    you can return any item purchased online within 7 working days
    starting from the day after delivery....without giving any reason.

    It's outrageous that you can sell faulty items that cost £2500 and
    say it's not a fault, when it clearly is. Why not try selling movies
    on DVD with a disclaimer......1% of this movie will not play...see
    how far that gets you.

    Not enough profit in an item........DON't SELL THEM.........
     
  10. MAW

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    Thank you for your kind words, I will clearly avoid selling to you. I do not sell DVD's. What the manufacturers point out is that perfection is impossible. The reason for the high price of plasma displays is that 80% of glass is rejected at the manufacturing stage. This is where the dead pixel check is done. Rough handling can cause further loss. Internet purchase, anyone? The 80% figure is given by Panasonic and Pioneer, other manufacturers may have other figures. At this stage all glass is perfect, but as I said, further losses can happen. It's in the nature of the technology. If I don't like the margin I don't have to sell it. If you don't like the technology, don't buy it. You know where the lines are drawn. If you must buy it, buy it on the internet, and keep sending them back, boys. The cheap suppliers will go bust.
     
  11. Unlight

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    Very true words from MAW there.

    While of course its nasty to get a couple of dead pixels on your lovely new screen, it really isnt the end of the world. Dont concentrate on the dead pixels, it will only make it worse.

    At the moment there are too many people on internet forums with a holier than thou attitude... they simply buy something they have a fleeting interest in, only to return it for no (real) good reason. If the shoe was on the other foot, and realised that smaller firms (no offence meant to these companies, I simply mean in relation to the big ones!) like AV Sales and MAW's company lose a good bit of money on silly returns such as these.

    At the end of the day, the same rule applies to plasmas as it does to PC TFT's etc, its a technology thats not without its very small niggles... sometimes you get dead pixels, but its a feature of the technology - I absolutely hate it when people come out with stuff like the poster above MAW... comparing it to selling a film with 1% cut out etc... come on, start wising up and getting into the real world. Some people think they are invincible through the internet, knowing every single consumer right etc, when sometimes they are just plain wrong.

    The moral of the story? THINK before you purchase. If you dont want to get it from a local dealer which you can often get a better deal in terms of warranty, then take the plunge and order it online, just dont be silly about it...
     
  12. Ekko Star

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    Or by it from John Lewis, and you should have 28 days to make your mind up.

    It's a difficult one really because technically the tolerance of failed pixels seems miniscule. However, end result on screen combined with the fact how much these things now cost, is never going to be a pill people want to swallow.

    Dead pixels are a failing of this technology and the erradictaion of the problem is one of the main reasons which keeps the prices of Plasma's still quite prohibitively high. Therefore as a consumer if you have paid the high price then you should expect the manufacturer to deliver 100% IMHO.
     
  13. GalacticaActual

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    Yes . absolutly right!
    I am thinking of buying a plasma soon. I know there is no such thing as perfection but when you spend out this sort of money and get faullty goods your heart can quite literaly sink. The manufacters of these products state that there is a certain tolereance for dead pixels. Ok I acept that and take this in to consideration when looking to purchase an item such as this. Dead pixels around the edge of the picture ecpecially on a larger screen may not even be all that noticable, but what if they are in the center of the screen in the middle of a close up of some ones face? Not the sort of thing you want when spending large sums of money!

    As to people knowing there rights when purchaseing these things, well these rights are in place for a reason.They are to give back up when dealing with dodgey traders . Now there are good guys out there as well who have to deal with the returns from customers who generally feel there is a problem with there purchase.How it is dealt with between the retailer and the customer is what determins the good from the bad.
    MAW--I simperthise with your predicament when dealing with some customer returns. I would hope though that if some one bought a plasma from you and it had a dark spot right in the middle of the screen that you would do every thing you could to help out :) surley the company that makes these things would have a hard time arguing that dead pixels in the middle of the screen are with in tolerance? :)
     
  14. pjclark1

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    funny how the Plasma Screens on display in shops never seem to have any dead pixels.
    Maybe if retailers weren't so quick to sell faulty goods there wouldn't be so may returns, Richer Sounds at least call their Plasmas with dead pixels "Graded Stock" so you know there is a problem.
    Still I suppose putting 240v into the aerial socket of a Plasma with faulty pixels
    will always result in an easier return process.

    As for selling a £2000 product and taking a £30 profit......who would do that?
    It's really foolish to sell anything without at least a 25% markup.
    I would never sell any item that would have a return of 50%.
     
  15. MAW

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    Graded stock is 'outside tolerance'. We check our screens in general, very much so if asked to.
     
  16. Ekko Star

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    To be fair though, most panels have improved considerably with regards to dead pixels. Having affiliations in the industry I am assured it is becoming a rarer and rarer occurrence.

    It's simply not nice when it had to be you and it happens to your particular plasma !
     
  17. AngryofMayfair

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    I have never yet seen any palsma with a dead or hot pixel that I know of. OTOH the pixel elements are getting so small these days that even if one or two were dead it's probable that they would not be noticed...

    A clump of 'hot' pixels in the centre of the screen, well that's another story.
     
  18. MAW

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    I have had probably around 2000 plasma screens pass through my hands, either install only or supply and install. Of those, excluding b grades, I have seen probably 3 or 4 which had 1 or more dead pixels. I have never had one 'out of tolerance'. The only customer I have ever 'fallen out with' purchased a screen with the specific instruction 'no dead pixels'. It was carefully inspected, shipped, and lo and behold, he called to say it had 4. Once shipped back, at my expense, it was perfect. I could find no fault, I put up solid colour screens inc. black and white from my laptop to check it, there were none. That's why I get a little hot under the collar with the dead pixel problem. I can't help wondering if the guy got a cheap hire deal out of me for some event. Or maybe the jolts of being shipped back made them come alive again. One of life's mysteries.
     
  19. whiteswan

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    When I order something from the internet or from a showroom for that matter, how do I know what the manufacturer states as acceptable before I part with my money?

    These tolerance levels are in the instruction bumpf that comes with the screen I take it?

    So i would not get to see these until I had paid my money and took delivery?

    How can that be fair?

    Maw I understand what you are saying, I really do...........but you say that "you all know the tolerance levels - if u don't like it then don't buy it" But I don't know the tolerance levels and I suspect the average guy in the street would not know either.

    Also do u really make just £30 profit on each screen? That's not much of a margin pal - you must have to sell loads to make a living!

    Your contribution to this forum is appreciated and I will be looking to order a Plasma as soon as my house is sold as the new place is not big enough for my projector!

    Dave, Oldham.
     
  20. MAW

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    Don't worry the comments I made were intended to be flippant, devil's advocate to the rather agressive nature of the guy I fired off at. We check screens and make it plain to customers that the odd dead pixel could occur in the future. The £30 margin is real enough if we price match against the lowest internet price. I don't think the internet guys pay significantly less for Panasonic than I do. Imake a living by ripping folk's houses to bits to install it cleverly, selling speakers, electronics, remote controls, programming, multi room IR control etc. Even video over cat 5 into the garden for several clients. I don't sell that many box only screens.
     
  21. pjclark1

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    Well the dead pixels discussion stopped me buying a Samsung 42" plasma this weekend. Ever been to one of those auctions where the guy at the front shows you a fantastic item at an incredable price, then you get handed a box you are not allowed to open in the Auction room........ is this any different...seems a little bit too much like FRAUD to me.

    MAW "Imake a living by ripping folk" what an admission to make on the forum!
    (OK so it's a quote out of context, but I thought it was funny when I read it)
     
  22. MAW

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    My customers frequently see their screens turned on for themselves before parting with the cash. You all seem to have blown this issue completery out of proportion. It's 1 in 50 or less screens, and the problem is surprisingly minor when you are actually confonted with it, assuming here it's just 1. Obviously with more than 2 or 3 or a group together, any decent human being of a retailer it going to get it sorted out.
     
  23. YahooSerious

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    The main problem is that people dont do their research. Dead pixel is perhaps one of the biggest myths for LCD and Plasma screens, along with burn in(for plasma) so people stating they have never heard of this can blame themselves. Anyone who bothers to read 5 minutes on a forum like this, understands they have two choices. Either buy at a retailer with guranteed return option, and pay the premium, or pay the least you possibly can, and take your chances.

    If street retail is 2500, and you pay 2000 at an internet dealer, you cant use the "but I payed 2000!!!!" argument, cause you actually saved 500, and your cheapass attitude cost you a dead pixel or two.

    Sony Trinitron tubes are a pretty funny object to think of in this regard, as the damper wires are very visible when light materiel is watched, so you cant miss it. The reason people dont return these are that they learn to live with it, cause the technology has so many other good things. Maybe if people learned to stop looking for dead pixels the moment they got the screens in their possession, or if they just relaxed and focused on the good things, they'd actually end up happy with their purchase.

    -Yahoo
     
  24. MAW

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    BTW PJclark, we've done you a favour, Samsungs are awful.
     
  25. hornydragon

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    Hey thats good margin on a plasma Mate. We sell plasmas and have had very very few dead pixels, perhaps some retailers are selling graded stock to compete cause at their level of margin you cant afford to offer much back service, one bad screen that causes a return or too and a replacement can cost you a months profit+
    One service callout can wipe out any profit on a deal so beware of buying the cheapest unit from the cheapest supplier...:offtopic:
    Just to make you aware you can contact retailer and panny about this but if it goes for "repair" dont hold your breath!
     
  26. YahooSerious

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    The new 4th gen arent too bad in my opinion. The third gen had some major issues though.

    -Yahoo
     
  27. MAW

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    Is a Panasonic only 10% better? Cos that's the price difference.
     
  28. pjclark1

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    the latest samsung can be purchased for £1789 inc delivery
    and incude twin tuners and 2 SCART sockets

    If you can find a Panny for 10% more, I would buy it.......
    (including delivery, twin tuners, SCART inputs)
     
  29. MAW

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    You have zero need for twin analogue tuners, nor 2 scart sockets. This is simply not the way to connect a panasonic. Do you not have sky, cable or freeview? The whole point of scart is it's ability to daisy chain, or have a multi way adapter. You can have 2 scarts on a panasonic. In any case, I am not allowed by forum rules to make you an offer, 10% more makes it £1967. Go figure, or PM me if you can't.
     
  30. Kenny Glasgow

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