DAC + Bluetooth - Separates (eg Topping E30 & Zen Blue) or Single unit (eg Bluesound Node) ?

Nichop

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Hi, I'm after some advice please. Have a new 'den' in our garden into which I've added a projector setup and for sound, an old Denon amp and Dali Zensor Pico speakers, both of which I expect I will upgrade shortly. Meantime though I need to connect our XBox via optical to get sound and also a Bluetooth receiver. I could go for a cheap £30 DAC but general prefer to get something decent that will satisfy for longer. With this in mind I've been looking for a good single unit that is both a good DAC and Bluetooth receiver, ideally supporting APTx HD. I've come down to either separate units in the form of the Topping E30 and ifi Zen Blue, or I splash out quite a bit more money and get something like the Cambridge Audio DAC Magic 200M or Bluesound Node. In regard to the last of these, I use Tidal quite a bit so would make use of the streaming capabilities of the Node but this isn't a real need - I could just as easily stream to my phone and then on via bluetooth.

Any recommendations of other devices that I may have missed? Is it worth shelling out the extra for the Node ?

thanks

Nick
 
Hi,
I have no experience of the others that you mention, but as a do-it-all stand alone the Node is excellent, imho. The HDMI works as advertised and the streaming & DACs punch well above the price point. I have not tried Tidal, but Qobuz hi res and Amazon hd sound very good. I mainly listen to Radio Paradise MQA streams which are truly excellent to my ears which bodes well for tidal MQA. I don’t use roon, AirPlay or Bluetooth. However, I would suggest that the SQ of tidal MQA will easily beat Bluetooth from a phone. The app is excellent
 
Hi,
I have no experience of the others that you mention, but as a do-it-all stand alone the Node is excellent, imho. The HDMI works as advertised and the streaming & DACs punch well above the price point. I have not tried Tidal, but Qobuz hi res and Amazon hd sound very good. I mainly listen to Radio Paradise MQA streams which are truly excellent to my ears which bodes well for tidal MQA. I don’t use roon, AirPlay or Bluetooth. However, I would suggest that the SQ of tidal MQA will easily beat Bluetooth from a phone. The app is excellent
I was about to hit 'buy' on the Node and then read that with the optical in there is quite a bit of latency which if true, is a deal breaker for gaming on the xbox. I've also found this SMSL SU9 which seems to get strong reviews and does DAC and Bluetooth well (SU-9).
 
I was about to hit 'buy' on the Node and then read that with the optical in there is quite a bit of latency which if true, is a deal breaker for gaming on the xbox.
Yes, unfortunately Bluesound products have an inbuilt 50ms delay on their digital inputs which make them totally unsuited for use with your XBOX. A stand-alone DAC such as the SMSL you mention shouldn't have any such latency issues.
 
To widen your DAC options, I have found a simple Bluetooth receiver to have no negative impact on sound quality as long it has a digital output and you use that into your DAC (i.e. ensuring that the better DAC still does the all important conversion rather than the cheaper one in the receiver).

Something like this should see you right, then you can focus on a decent DAC and don't need to worry if it has bluetooth or not:


This type of receiver uses an spdif output though, so you wouldn't be able to connect it at the same time as the games console unless the DAC had two optical inputs.

Just a thought on a different route.
 
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Read rumors that Bluos can fix latency issues by requesting support ticket.
 
Hi!

The iFi ZEN Stream, iFi ZEN DAC v2 and iFi ZEN Blue make a great stack (we have one in our showroom, connected also to a ZEN CAN headphone amp).

However - you're getting into Bluesound Node territory with the above [in terms of cost].
The latest (Gen3) node has a much improved DAC, HDMI eARC support as well as one of the most stable apps* in the streaming world for bringing your many streaming services together.

It does have a poor algorithm for spelling issues when searching for tracks/artists (only an issue when one has a glass of red in the hand!) which is where TIDAL Connect then comes into play.

There are some other solutions out there too: the Pro-Ject Audio Stream Box S2 is a great little unit (Airplay, TIDAL (non MQA), Spotify, TuneIn etc) and is one of the cheapest out there.

*in my opinion
 
Hi!

The iFi ZEN Stream, iFi ZEN DAC v2 and iFi ZEN Blue make a great stack (we have one in our showroom, connected also to a ZEN CAN headphone amp).

However - you're getting into Bluesound Node territory with the above [in terms of cost].
The latest (Gen3) node has a much improved DAC, HDMI eARC support as well as one of the most stable apps* in the streaming world for bringing your many streaming services together.

It does have a poor algorithm for spelling issues when searching for tracks/artists (only an issue when one has a glass of red in the hand!) which is where TIDAL Connect then comes into play.

There are some other solutions out there too: the Pro-Ject Audio Stream Box S2 is a great little unit (Airplay, TIDAL (non MQA), Spotify, TuneIn etc) and is one of the cheapest out there.

*in my opinion
I have a Bluesound Node as well, with a Musical fidelity m6si amp and key ls50 meta speakers. Do u think it d be an improvement in terms of DAC to get an external iFi Zen DAC V2 or the Pro-Ject Audio Stream? I don't know if the investment is worthy.
 
I have a Bluesound Node as well, with a Musical fidelity m6si amp and key ls50 meta speakers. Do u think it d be an improvement in terms of DAC to get an external iFi Zen DAC V2 or the Pro-Ject Audio Stream? I don't know if the investment is worthy.
Only if you don't really like the sound of the DAC in the Node, I run my Node through my Cambridge CXU DAC (wolfson) and can tell you it does sound better (to me) than the internal DAC of the Node. Something like the older Cambridge DACmagic 100 DAC uses the same chipset so I expect that to also sound very good and possibly better than the Node DAC (no MQA tho)
I'm pretty sure the iFi zen uses a similar Burr Brown DAC chip to the Node so no idea if it would sound better or different. In any case many people find it hard to notice the difference between a £100 DAC and a £3000 DAC but no harm in experimenting as long as you don't spend too much.
 
The only massive night and day difference I’ve heard is DAC with Texas DAC chip.

Other like Node in the similar price class not so much.

I tend to understand DAC which has Texas chip is the warmest sounding ones.

Which is the sound I prefer.
 
Only if you don't really like the sound of the DAC in the Node, I run my Node through my Cambridge CXU DAC (wolfson) and can tell you it does sound better (to me) than the internal DAC of the Node. Something like the older Cambridge DACmagic 100 DAC uses the same chipset so I expect that to also sound very good and possibly better than the Node DAC (no MQA tho)
I'm pretty sure the iFi zen uses a similar Burr Brown DAC chip to the Node so no idea if it would sound better or different. In any case many people find it hard to notice the difference between a £100 DAC and a £3000 DAC but no harm in experimenting as long as you don't spend too much.
Very good point of view! Ill see what I can find in a medium affordable price range, like maybe topping d90, smsl m400 or similar. As u said no harm to experiment.
 
d90 is lot of money for maybe better sound…

I don’t know what speakers you have, but I would rather spend money on speakers.

That’s where the real difference is-yes there can be sound difference but depending on your system it might not be worth it.

Still I understand you want a better sound.

You don’t consider small tweaks. Like granite blocks underneath the speakers.

Or Sonic Design isolation pads underneath the speakers.

I have very cheap sorbothane isolation pads underneath the Node streamer. Believe or not it works.

Been thinking of putting 4 underneath my speakers also, but bit worry if the speakers well be too wobbly/unsteady.
 
d90 is lot of money for maybe better sound…

I don’t know what speakers you have, but I would rather spend money on speakers.

That’s where the real difference is-yes there can be sound difference but depending on your system it might not be worth it.

Still I understand you want a better sound.

You don’t consider small tweaks. Like granite blocks underneath the speakers.

Or Sonic Design isolation pads underneath the speakers.

I have very cheap sorbothane isolation pads underneath the Node streamer. Believe or not it works.

Been thinking of putting 4 underneath my speakers also, but bit worry if the speakers well be too wobbly/unsteady.
Hi! Thank you for your response. I have Kef ls50 meta speakers, Musical Fidelity M6si integrantes amp, svs sb2000pro, chord cables and the bluesound node. I think to begin its not a bad combo, right? Oh I ha e also some acoustic panels of mineral wood for bass reflectores, ceiling, first reflectores and back. So I was expecting to get more Juice from it all adding a superior DAC than the one inside the node, but dont know if the change will be worthy. I also bought a dbx driverack pa2 for equalization and room correction according to the room response, Im not using it yet since Im expecting to recieve the propper cables (QED) not generic ones, because i felt less sound quality using generic ones. What do you think? I feel like a Kids trying to construct something i imagined in my mind.
 
The system might be revealing enough to let you hear a difference then. You could try Zen DAC Signature, Zen DAC V2.

I can hear difference compared to the chip in the Node streamer, still I am done chasing audio nirvana.
 
The system might be revealing enough to let you hear a difference then. You could try Zen DAC Signature, Zen DAC V2.

I can hear difference compared to the chip in the Node streamer, still I am done chasing audio nirvana.
Thanks for the suggestion! I will try that way then. Maybe topping d30 pro or a30 pro? Dont know about which one has more audio quality between Zen dac or topping
 
Very good point of view! Ill see what I can find in a medium affordable price range, like maybe topping d90, smsl m400 or similar. As u said no harm to experiment.
Topping E50 is meant to be the sweet spot, spending much more than that leads to the law of diminishing returns.
There are a few favorable reviews on YT.
 

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