Question Cyrus and Roon confusion

colrog

Novice Member
New to this forum Hi.
I have a Cyrus Stream X2 connected to a Cyrus amplifier (don't recall exact model but it has a dac). Am now using Roon. Initially started using this due to endless frustrations with the woeful Cyrus Cadence App. The Cryus X isn't Roon aware so I have a Google Chromecast Audio dongle attached. The question is, does this actually make the Stream X redundant.? The Chromecast plugs into the Stream, but it could I think, connect directly to the amp.

Clarification on what is currently happening welcome, plus advice on any way to improve this while keeping Roon (obviously spend £1k+ on a different streamer is one soluton) something cheaper preferred.
 

Hianholland

Active Member
Depending on the inputs to your amp, one of the cheapest ways to make a roon end point is buy a digi HAT such as:

Connect to a Raspi 4 board such as:

add a case, power supply and 16gb sd card loaded with Ropieee and you're away Total cost about £110.
 

colrog

Novice Member
Thanks. Will get a look. Can anyone enlighten me regarding the redundancy or otherwise of the Stream X as things are?
 

larkone

Distinguished Member
If your Cyrus amp has a optical input and DAC you can use the optical output from the Chromecast (the 3.5mm output is a dual analogue/optical connection) so you are not using the DAC in the Chromecast, it is just a streaming device. At that point you would not need the Stream X.

You need on of these to make it work
Amazon product
The Cyrus Cadence app should be reported to Amnesty International as an extreme form of mental torture
 

colrog

Novice Member
Thanks Larkone. I will have time over the next few days to carry out some listening tests. The Chromecast audio is connected by a digital connector to the Stream X presently so I can easily do the swapping round.


There are two differences between the Roon>Chromecast > stream> dac/amp vs Roon>Chromecast>amp/dac vs stream > amp/dac that I understand.

1) Content can be taken to the Stream via an ethernet cable, (I have one installed) whereas the Chromecast is WIFI only. As I live in a largish house with thick internal stone walls, reliable WIFI can sometimes be an issue (it isn't right now). 2) The Stream X cost me £1000+ the Chromecast £30.

If there is no difference between the two, in theory or in practice, why does anyone spend large sums of money? Why did I?

Only I can answer the question about perceived sound. (I am a qualified academic psychologist btw and understand the importance of blind testing to get to the bottom of perceived sound). But can anyone else tell me what the Stream x is, in theory, supposed to be adding to the Roon – Chromecast – Stream X - amp/dac combo?


I have already reported Cadence to Amnesty. They said there are some crimes against humanity that are simply too big for them to take on.
 

phil t

Well-known Member
If there is no difference between the two, in theory or in practice, why does anyone spend large sums of money? Why did I?
Welcome to the grand opening of Pandora's box.

The short answer is listen to the two and choose the one that sounds best.

If you hear no difference, then buy the cheapest one that has all the functionality that you require.

Also remember that one may be better, but if overall system can't resolve it, you won't hear that difference.
 

larkone

Distinguished Member
The question of sound quality with streamers before the data stream hits a DAC is one that I have also always thought was a strange one. It is the DAC onwards that has the influence on the sound, not how a data stream is transported. If there were any 'changes' in the stream then this would be heard as glitches in the sound. However expectation bias will mean that anyone who has spent a large amount of money on a streamer will nearly always hear a difference. Never managed to myself. This will be where the snake oil purchasers will pop up and say that their £500 Ethernet cable transforms their listening experience :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

Re the Cadence app - I have a Cyrus Lyric and the app was so awful I ended up putting a Teufel Connector as the front end and connected it optically to the Lyric so the Lyric is only an amp - a very good one at that - that drives the garden speakers now.

By the way you can get an power supply for the Chromecast that has an Ethernet connection built in so you can either wire it direct to your router or through Homeplugs. I have found though that once you establish a working wireless connection to a CCA it is pretty good at maintaining the connection as I use mine very close to the edge of the wireless range at home and move it around.
 

colrog

Novice Member
Welcome to the grand opening of Pandora's box.

The short answer is listen to the two and choose the one that sounds best.

If you hear no difference, then buy the cheapest one that has all the functionality that you require.

Also remember that one may be better, but if overall system can't resolve it, you won't hear that difference.
I already have the stuff. I will do the careful listening. Am trying to find out why there might be a difference. As I have 2 chromecast units I could do some blind testing
 

DIBSTER

Well-known Member
Re the Cadence app - I have a Cyrus Lyric and the app was so awful I ended up putting a Teufel Connector as the front end and connected it optically to the Lyric so the Lyric is only an amp - a very good one at that - that drives the garden speakers now.

.
I must confess that sonically a Cyrus Lyric 09 really interests me, as I am looking towards a one box system. However I read nothing but horror stories regarding the Cadence app and the whole streaming experience with the Lyric 09. Could you possibly tell me what problems you have experienced with it?

For a number of years I have been using a trusty old Squeezebox Touch for my streaming needs and it is a great performer whether it be playing internet radio, Spotify, or files from my NAS. It's greatest strength, besides sounding great, is the sheer simplicity of it all. I can if I wish perform every function I need with the remote alone, and don't need any app if I don't wish to use one. It's the thought of losing this ease of use that puts me off a lot of these new streamers.
 

larkone

Distinguished Member
TBH I have now retired my Lyric to the garage to run the garden system. I have connected a Teufel Connector by optical to the lyric and my wireless remote just switches the Lyric on a as simple amp, all streaming is managed by the Connector. Sonically the Lyric is a really good amp completely let down by tortuous software and I am not talking about the Cadence app because you can use BubbleUPNP to control it. The software in the device is horrible, so bad my wife refused to use it because she could get so easily lost. What makes it worse is that you cannot simplify the use with a Harmony remote because the menus toggle to the next input so you cannot set the Harmony to select 'Optical 1', you can only select a range of inputs and then cycle around the list so you have to be able to see the Lyric screen to know where you are - Victorian software design if there ever was. Great hardware, unusable software

Now I just use this as a very dumb device, just glad I paid nowhere near the full new price for one because I would be seriously disappointed shelling out that much for such a defective device.

If you want a really excellent streaming amp then a Lyngdorf tdai1120 is the way to go and it comes with RoomPerfect which is a revelation. The streaming is superb and I control it completely from any tablet/phone in the house. It is what I replaced the Lyric with in my kitchen and is the best £2k I have ever spent of hifi - they have got everything right that Cyrus got wrong. You don't get a CD player but I ripped my CDs 10 years ago so haven't owned a CD player for that time.
 

DIBSTER

Well-known Member
Thanks for that, and just as I suspected. I shall strike the Lyric 09 off my list then. I had been tempted by a secondhand one from a dealer but I'm not paying that sort of money for something not fit for purpose and that would have ended up being used solely as an expensive amp.

One other thing is that I've checked the used prices on Ebay and they appear to be way low (circa £700/750) compared to the price the dealer wants. Probably a reflection of the machines shortcomings when you consider their RRP when new. I only like to buy 2nd hand if I'm pretty confident that I can recoup my money if it doesn't work out.

I had a Quad Artera Solus Play the other week at home for a few days and I found the streaming to be a nightmare with that too, I gave up on it and sent it back. Such a shame because it sounded superb and looked 100% better than the Cyrus.

If I had the cash for that Lyngdorf I would definitely have a look but unfortunately it's out of my price range at present.
 

larkone

Distinguished Member
@DIBSTER I know the Lyngdorfs are expensive, though there is a s/hand one at Nintronics for £1700 and they will get cheaper. I recently recommended one to a friend who was wanting to get back into hifi and he baulked at the price. After lots of pressure from he finally agreed - a month later and he has thanked me for the best recommendation ever. Easy to setup, easy to run RoomPerfect and simple to use as a streamer - and in his words 'phenomenal sound'.
 

DIBSTER

Well-known Member
I find it astonishing that a £2K piece of equipment doesn't have a headphone output. Due to my wife working lots of strange shifts and sleeping at odd times of the day I have been listening a lot lately through my headphones. I wouldn't want to shell out for an extra headphone amp as well.
 

gibbsy

Moderator
I find it astonishing that a £2K piece of equipment doesn't have a headphone output. Due to my wife working lots of strange shifts and sleeping at odd times of the day I have been listening a lot lately through my headphones. I wouldn't want to shell out for an extra headphone amp as well.
I thought that when I bought a Rega Elicit amp, no headphone jack which was to me pretty essential. Best thing that happened really as I had to buy a pretty good HP amp and really enjoy it now and is the best my headphones have ever been driven. As long as the Lyngdorf has a record loop it's easy to set up. Because the Lyngdorf is really rather good doesn't mean that would translate to the headphone section.

Go on. 1120 and a Lehmann Linear headphone amp. Audio heaven.
 

DIBSTER

Well-known Member
It's on my horizon, believe me, as retirement within the next 12 months beckons 👍

Just a few more jobs to do (and pay for) around the house first then some lazy days listening to my crap music ( according to my wife ) beckons.
 

DIBSTER

Well-known Member
I've just missed out on a mint 2nd hand one that went up for sale yesterday at Audio Emotion. Less than 12 months old, mint condition (even had the plastic film still intact over the screen) going for £1390 with full warranty etc. Only went on yesterday and had gone by this morning. Gutted, I'm not paying £2K for a new one but at that price 2nd hand from a reputable dealer I nearly pulled the trigger last night but decided to sleep on it and think it through.
 

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