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Correct timing for dvi?

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs Forum' started by Barend, Nov 14, 2004.

  1. Barend

    Barend
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    Hi all,
    Still going for perfection here & trying to make PAL work to my Panny plasma's dvi board...
    Now I understand it would be helpful to adjust the signal timings to feed exactly the signal the TH42 wants.
    But on the other hand I don't want to spend a lot of money on a scaler either...any chance of an affordable way to accomplish what I want?
    Not that the PQ is that awful, but I hate it if something doesn't work!
    NTSC works fine as you all know, it's just PAL that gives me problems- and I don't think my 3910's ability to scale to ntsc is the best solution...
    Cheers
    Barend
     
  2. MAW

    MAW
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    720/60 is your only chance, and might well introduce serious judder. This is a 6 series I presume? The board is designed for PC connection, not really video.
     
  3. Barend

    Barend
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    Thanks MAW,
    Can't set my Denon 3910 to 720 @ 60 Hz...
    Board accepts usual ntsc freqs and for PAL only 575p @ 50Hz (whatever that may be since std is 576p).
    Can a PC make a 575p signal then?
    Fact is ntsc discs pic over dvi is excellent and I'd love the same in PAL...unconverted that is...
    Yes, it's a TH42PWD6EX.

    Barend
     
  4. MAW

    MAW
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    A PC can make any signal with the right software, but clearly if you connected a PC you would use 720/60 or 852x480 /as fast as it will let you! 575 is a silly mistake as far as we can all tell.
     
  5. Krance

    Krance
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    I have just read this thread and am a little worried. I also have the 3910 and have the pw7 with DVI board (on it's way anyway)

    I see that the Denon spec says 576 and the Plasma accepts 575... is this the same problem as above, I wont be able to accept use this setting for watching PAL discs?

    If this is true I assume this is because of the firmware of the player, if so, can't we just ask Denon for the firmware to handle this..
     
  6. Barend

    Barend
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    It's the Panny that's at fault, do a search in the forums and you'll find many postings.
    Panasonic's dvi board is oriented towards ntsc, not PAL.
    Seems to me 575p is a misprint, it's not a standard.
    The issue is one of the reasons why I ordered a scaler (arriving tomorrow) that hopefully allows me to accomodate PAL-thru-dvi; Gordon assures his scaler does produce a dvi PAL picture.
    Some doubt remains in my mind as to dig will be much better than yuv as the 3910 already outputs a magnificent yuv pic.
     
  7. Krance

    Krance
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    I am wondering if I should get the YUV board then... only thing is I have just ordered a 4m DVI cable and I'm not sure they will cancel that one :-( and the hassle of changing the DVI board for the component one

    and 4m cables in component form seem to cost well over 100 quid!
     
  8. Barend

    Barend
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    A good yuv cable does not have to cost more to 6 quid.
    Well screened cable, well fitting plugs, that's all ya need.
    The rest is utter nonsense.

    Wonder what plugin board your display has, if the Panny you ordered has no yuv nor dvi what then?
    Only composite? Man what a shame to feed a plasma with something so mediocre...
     
  9. Krance

    Krance
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    There is no board on the plasma but you can always use the VGA port that is installed by default ;-)

    finding a YUV cable for 6 quid? where is this then... normal OFC coax cable would cost more than 6 quid on a 4 meter run wouldn't it
     
  10. Barend

    Barend
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    Try these
    www.nedis.com
    (my Dutch supplier, Dutch site www.nedis.nl is in Euro's, has a UK branch, HQ Silver is a good range)
    www.cpc.co.uk

    Both sport ofc (no idea why you want ofc, all parroted humbug, ask any technician, next year the highend guru's will want you to get it lavender scented). Dunno if the above supply to end users, but you'll get my drift as to reasonable pricing.

    Tip:
    Make your own: Get a reel of 100M RG59C/U from Electrovalue or any of the above plus a stash of good solid metal cinch plugs (gold if you love the color, good fit much more important). There are also good non-solder ones around. And you'll have more than enough to last your life.
     
  11. Krance

    Krance
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    Well, it's a good thing i'm an englishman in holland!... looked at your site, thanks for the tip

    PS. I changhed to the component board for the time being and it has the bonus of coming with s-video connection too (videocamera etc.)

    Shame about DVI though, I can't believe Panny made a mistake like that
     
  12. Jasonjo

    Jasonjo
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    Barend,

    I am in a very similar position and I am in the process of borrowing a DVI board to see for me own eyes what can an can't be achieved and the qualities involved. I am keen to see how RGBHV and DVI compare from my Iscan HD sclaer and then make up my mind whether to stick to the already amazing picture via analogue.

    I think that the likely way for me to go is to go in terms of my best test is to go for native res and frame convert 50Hz to 60Hz. Hoping the HD will FRC well enough.

    I am looking at SDI modding my Denon DVD player and then getting the iScan HD SDI module - therefore it would be nice to keep the enite path to the screen digitial. However I am reasonably sure that the frame rate conversaion issue will bother me as I am kinda fussy like that ;)

    SDI into the Iscan HD should be better as removing some of the A/D but it would be nice to DVI out from the HD...however I may end up using SDI to the HD and then RGBHV to the screen...not ideal, but probs the likliest soltuion...

    Will report back on my findings...

    JJ

    P.S. I think we have both discussed this with a mutual forum member :)
     
  13. Barend

    Barend
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    Being in Holland, did you eat your Oliebollen @ New Year's eve as you should?

    My Panny has the yuv + s video board like yours, it's an excellent display.
    I have been in contact with Panny techs in NL ("Huh? Never heard of this..."), UK (Will come back to you) and Germany (there is an in-house mod for the Viera, just bring it in if you own one), it's just that Matsu****a did not care very much providing for PAL, so they dropped 57X in just for kicks it seems../maybe the 7's are better but I doubt it...

    Anyroad, will report on the scaler, but it's not cheap- 1499 $.
    Dollar is low though...

    Did you note the forum starred out a part of Matsu****a? Had a good laugh!
    Here's another one: Pang**** Goreng (fried banana).
     
  14. Krance

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    yep, did the oliebollen, appel thingy's...

    The site you recommended seems to be only for retailers? is that right..

    And to the both of you, I think you are both one step ahead of me (SDI for jasonjo, and scaling DVI for barend)... both seem like expensive options (especially modding the denon 3910 for SDI, geeze that's expensive)

    I think I will stick with the component for now (when I can get a nice 4m cable)... then when I have some money go for a nice Lumagen or something... even though I think that kind of money is only justified when spent on a High Res screen

    Will let you know what I think, for tonight I will have to use the S-video connection to test the screen (I bet that's gonna be crappy!)
     
  15. Barend

    Barend
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    No!!! Oliebollien are the greasy round things!!! No apple!!! You did it wrong!!!
    Hope this did not influence your new year's fortune {grin}.

    As to modding the 3910- the Swiss guy is offering a diy kit this month.
    But I agree, it's a lot of hassle but what else can you do if you insist on dvi and the screen does not support hdcp...which the Panny board DOES, that's not the problem.
     
  16. Krance

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    Well, i'm going the component route.... seems like a beautiful picture already. I'm so impressed with the Plasma I can't even remember why I didn't do this before. Anyone who is thinking of getting one really should.

    The only thing is I have a Supra 4m DVI cable left over but that will probably come into use in the future..
     
  17. MAW

    MAW
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    The DVI board will work at 576, I seem not to have had notifications from this thread. The issue is that 576 is the only res that works at 50Hz, and it works a damn sight more easily on a 7 series than a 6 series. 576 is still an advantage with a decent scaler, or DVD player over analogue at 576, it's just a question of whether it's better than native or 720p at 50Hz on analogue. Personally I find not, and as I have no complaints about the analogue picture, that's what I use.
     
  18. Krance

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    I went and did something stupid, I had it all set up through component and it was looking really nice. As I had the Supra DVI cable hanging around I thought, why not buy the DVI board.
    Looking at the DVI picture yesterday (tried NTSC and PAL) I find it hard to see any improvement. I even thought that the component connection looked at little bit smoother and I noticed that changing the picture (on the Panasonic) made a massive difference to the picture (artifacts appearing in the blacks). I ended up changing it so it looks ok but I think I may have wasted my money. :-( am I missing something here or should I carry on tweaking?
    One advantage is the cable is smaller as the component cable I was using was an absolute beautiful thing about 3/4 inch thick (but what a sexy cable, is it only me that gets excited over a nice cable?)
     

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