Cooling in enclosed space

FlubWubJub

Active Member
Hi Guys,

My HTPC is located in the cupboard space under my stairs.
Great because i can't see or hear it, but it's causing a few issues with cooling.

I'm getting average CPU temps of 60 degC and system temps of around 53 degC when at idle.
(bear in mind that this PC has CCTV DVR software constantly running so this may have an impact?)

Are these temps considered high?

The reason i am asking about this is, as the weather has been getting warmer, the temps have been increasing and causing lock ups on the PC.

I have just spent £100 on:

  • OCZ modular 400W PSU
  • Scythe Mini Ninja
  • Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Paste
  • Antec TriCool 120mm case fan
With these installed both temps have dropped around 5 degC to 55 and 48 respectively.

This is better, but am i still too high?

Would i benefit from running the PC case without the side on it to try and get some more air flow around the components?

I don't really want to go water cooled due to cost, so other than making some kind of extraction fan system that i could direct into the floor void under the house i have no idea what to do next.
 

Razor

Distinguished Member
You havent said what cpu you are running. Regardless that is very high temps.

You would be better off getting some fresh air into the cupboard be it an extractor fan or some vents on the door. One at the top and the other at the bottom. You need to get cool air in and hot air out. Both are just as important as each other.

You could also undervolt your cpu to bring down temps.
 

FlubWubJub

Active Member
Sorry... completely forgot to post my specs:



Do you think changing to a 5050e CPU would make a decent difference?
Just looking now and it's only 45W compared to the 90W of my current 7750

The only way i can get cooler air in to the cupboard would be to vent it in from the floor void under the house.
I suppose i could cut a couple of holes in the floor boards and get some fans on them?
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Razor

Distinguished Member
A lower energy cpu would help but you could just under clock your current cpu by reducing the multiplier and lowering the cpu voltage. This will bring down its power usage and run the cpu cooler.

Your main problem is ventilation of the cupboard. Sort that out and your temps will fall. Putting vents in the floor will help. Try under clocking your cpu first and lift a few floor boards to see what results you get.

BTW could you take a pic of the inside of your pc to see if you have the fans the right way and layout correct? Just to rule this out as its a common mistake. :)
 

FlubWubJub

Active Member
A lower energy cpu would help but you could just under clock your current cpu by reducing the multiplier and lowering the cpu voltage. This will bring down its power usage and run the cpu cooler.

Your main problem is ventilation of the cupboard. Sort that out and your temps will fall. Putting vents in the floor will help. Try under clocking your cpu first and lift a few floor boards to see what results you get.

BTW could you take a pic of the inside of your pc to see if you have the fans the right way and layout correct? Just to rule this out as its a common mistake. :)

to be honest, i probably have got the fans all to cock... especially as i'm limited the placement of the fan on the scythe due to PSU and RAM placement.

I'll see if i can grab a pic tonight.:thumbsup:
 

mikes

Well-known Member
Al;o you need to consider that if you start blowing warm air into a void, during cold weather this will cause condensation.

I like the undervolt idea.
 

conan

Active Member
Max temp for that processor is 73'C so if your not experiencing performance problems at 48 - 55 I wouldn't worry to much

AMD Athlon 64 X2 7750

What he said :) Its always nice to run CPU's as cool as possible, but with a temp of 55 and a limit of 73, then you have lots of headroom. The limit from AMD will also have some safety margin in there, they wouldn't risk mass failure of CPU's at 74 degrees.

People can go overboard in terms of cooling cpus more than neccessary, understandable, but still uneccesary.
 

FlubWubJub

Active Member
Max temp for that processor is 73'C so if your not experiencing performance problems at 48 - 55 I wouldn't worry to much

AMD Athlon 64 X2 7750

thanks for that - it seems to have stabilised more with the better cooling. Maybe the 5degC difference was just tipping it the the unstable mark.

Al;o you need to consider that if you start blowing warm air into a void, during cold weather this will cause condensation.

I like the undervolt idea.

I would be blowing the cool air from the floor void in to the cupboard, then would extract the hot air else where (if possible).
But it's a good point that i completely forgot about :thumbsup:

i think i'll try undervolting it to see if it makes much of a difference in performance vs temp.
 

FlubWubJub

Active Member
Does your cupboard have a external wall?

yes it does Nokmond... but not sure on how well the missus would take to me going down that route :rolleyes:

I've underclocked the CPU right down to 1.8ghz and it's only made a difference of around 1-2degC.

Yesterday ambient room temp in the house was 26degC - the PC had locked up and when restarted BIOS gave me a lovely CPU Overtemp Error

I'm seriously thinking i need to go down the water cooling route, but i don't know how exactly these work - would i be in the same position (i.e. needing cool air flow anywhere in the system?)
 

k4p84

Active Member
Remember water cooling requires a lot of air flow to function so it may not be your solution.

Just pop a couple of fans in the cupboard door to keep air circulating and it will be fine.

If you can put better aftermarket coolers on the CPU and GPU that would help too so long as you have implemented the above.

Dont worry about condensation you wouldnt get that unless you went down the exotic cooling of liquid nitrogen. Which would be a tad excessive for an HTPC

Pictures of how you have the rig set up would help trying to solve your cooling.

Though remember as stated above your temps are not near the Tmax so you are ok but it is still best practice to try and keep averything as cool as you can.

Ed
 

FlubWubJub

Active Member
Remember water cooling requires a lot of air flow to function so it may not be your solution.

Just pop a couple of fans in the cupboard door to keep air circulating and it will be fine.

If you can put better aftermarket coolers on the CPU and GPU that would help too so long as you have implemented the above.

Dont worry about condensation you wouldn't get that unless you went down the exotic cooling of liquid nitrogen. Which would be a tad excessive for an HTPC

Pictures of how you have the rig set up would help trying to solve your cooling.

Though remember as stated above your temps are not near the Tmax so you are ok but it is still best practice to try and keep averything as cool as you can.

Ed

Hmm... looks like i may well have to see if i can re-locate the PC then.
The problem i have is getting air in by cutting holes for fans etc wouldn't get passed the missus due to the fact that the cupboard door is in the hallway and the holes/fans would be visible - and when we've just spend upwards of £500 decorating the hallway and getting it nice and neat i don't think she's go for that idea :suicide: :rolleyes:

I know they're not near the max temps stated by AMD etc, but they are getting high enough to cause the PC to lock up/crash - which is a problem for me as the PC is being used as a CCTV DVR. :(
 

k4p84

Active Member
Depending on the design of the door you could make it complementary.

Use mesh / muslin panels. Allowing air through for ventilation and looking far more subtle than a round hole with a fan stuck in.
 

FlubWubJub

Active Member
im thinking of experimenting with putting the PC in my AV cabinet.
The thing with this is that the shelves are enclosed, see pic below - you can see the three AV shelves in the middle.

1.JPG


The problem with these is that they are not high enough for the HTPC cases i've been looking at.
So, i've been thinking of mounting the PC components on a piece of MDF or similar and leaving it open within one of the shelves (if that makes sense)

Obviously the doors at the front open, but i would not want to leave these one open 24/7 for the cooling.
Each shelf is open at the back, so i can put a fan to extract the hot ait out from the enclosed space.

You think this would work??
 

mikes

Well-known Member
I use an immersible fishpond pump in a large sealed tupperware box to circulate the water. Long pipes at the end of the circulation loop take the warmed water to a radiator about 15 feet away where fans disperse the heat.

Has worked for three years 24/7 with a monthly change of water.

I think the trick with water cooling is to take the heat as far away from the PC rig before dispersing it via the radiator and fans. All these systems where the radiator and pump are incorporated into PC rig appear couter-intuitive to me. You need to get the heat away from the PC before heat-exchange using the radiator and fans.

Oh, and if you vent warm moist air into a cold void you will get condensation as I found out to my cost with my loft.
 

Nokmondoo

Active Member
yes it does Nokmond... but not sure on how well the missus would take to me going down that route :rolleyes:

I've underclocked the CPU right down to 1.8ghz and it's only made a difference of around 1-2degC.

Yesterday ambient room temp in the house was 26degC - the PC had locked up and when restarted BIOS gave me a lovely CPU Overtemp Error

I'm seriously thinking i need to go down the water cooling route, but i don't know how exactly these work - would i be in the same position (i.e. needing cool air flow anywhere in the system?)

I have all my gear in a wardrobe upstairs which feeds living room and bedroom plasmas. I needed to vent the cupboard so i drilled 2 x 4inch holes, one at the bottom one at the top and fitted Manrose Square Brown 140mm Louvre Vent - Screwfix.com, Where the Trade Buys

to the outside wall. I then fitted some fans, 1 to draw cool air in and one to extract the warm air. Its very tidy and costs next to nothing to do.
 

pl1974

Standard Member
Hi,

I'm having exactly the same problem as this, vents in the doors are a no no as its part of a larger unit with other matching doors.

I'm getting problems with the system stuttering, which is always connected to receiving overheating error messages (I assume from BIOS).

This has only started since I put a nvidia graphics card in (to sort out bbc hd blocky problem).

I installed Core Temp to monitor the temp and it only shows 37C, I am getting BIOS (I think) warnings, in the bios its set to warn at 40C.

My question is that my CPU Athlon X2 240 should be able to cope with up to 74C, so do you think I'm safe to disable the BIOS warning, seems very low to me and not configurable.

Thanks,

Paul
 

BikerJim

Standard Member
Sorry to revive such an old thread, but also have a very similar problem and it also proves I have searched first ;)

I have an old pc running linux, with several external hardrives serving my Popcorn hour. The PC sits in the 'utility cupboard' which is about 2m3 in volume. It gets very warm in there, but has been running fine for about 6 months, but with the hot summer the PC has recently started complaining a bit, so I am looking at my options.

Its rented accommodation, so I have to be careful, and external venting is not an option, but I am prepared to install nice looking, quiet extractor fans to the hallway, or the door. Reading some other threads I have already contacted Middle Atlantic products about their door mounted fans, but they are in the states, and also a sparks company about the nice looking tile extractors (mandrake?), but I dont know if they will be man enough.

But I am also wondering if there is such a thing as a miniture airco unit for home installations? I have local drainage (the washing machine drain is in the same cupboard) so it appears that this may be an option too. I realise you still have to blow the hot air out somewhere, but a grill is easier to fit than a fan.

Anyone done something like this?

Cheers
Jim
 

RBJTech

Active Member
You don't have to install active fans at all - you should be able to just install vents in the top and bottom of the door, and natural heat convection will refresh the heated air inside the cupboard out the top of the cupboard with cooler air drawn in from the the hallway via the bottom vent.
 

The latest video from AVForums

Star Wars Andor, Woman King, more Star Trek 4K, Rings of Power & the latest TV, movies & 4K releases
Subscribe to our YouTube channel

Full fat HDMI teeshirts

Support AVForums with Patreon

Top Bottom