confused!!

Was that Henry or James you spoke to ?

I would say they are kinda correct but not completely...remember that they do not sell nor deal with plasma screens...they are mainly CRT projector based historically and in that area they are masters.

That said I would say that the majority of plasma screens available would not benefit greatly from an external scaler for various reasons...either they do not have the correct connectivity...or provide support for the necessary resolutions and refresh rates...or they screw around too much with the signal once they have received it.

To get the best from an external scaler you really want to be feeding the it the best possible signal you can...ideally that means SDI, followed by interlaced HDMI, interlaced YUV, RGBs...but a digital signal is preferable.

Then you really want to be feeding the plasma screen it's native resolution...again ideally digitally via DVI or HDMI...to avoid any unnecessary A-D and D-A conversion stages.

Then you want to make sure that the plasma screen itself is performing as little processing to that signal as possible and that it does not perform its own internal frame rate conversion on the signal...or if it does that it will not introduce and annoying judder.

If you can achieve the above then the results are really rather good…if you are having trouble with some or all of the above then its not going to work for your configuration...or at least not without its drawbacks/issues which you may or may not find annoying.

Some examples are the Pioneer TV range of plasma screens will only accept 720p input from an external scaler meaning that the source image has to undergo two scaling stages…one in the scaler to 1280x720 and then again in the panel to either 1024x768 or 1280x768.

The Panasonic Viera range of plasma TVs have no digital input so you are either forced to use the front mounted VGA socket – nice – or the component inputs which do not support 720p :mad:

The PW6/7 range of plasma screens will only accept native resolution via their DVI blade at 60Hz meaning any 50Hz sources have to be converted to 60Hz which can introduce judder on panning shots. And their HDMI blade does not seem to offer anything better just yet either.

The best suited plasma for use with an external scaler at the moment, well that I know of anyhow, is the Pioneer MXE1 range. This is because they have native resolution support via DVI and an FRC setting which allows 50Hz sources to be displayed at 100Hz internally thus eliminating judder.

Anyway…it’s not as straightforward as saying all scalers are bad with plasma screens…especially as they are about to start selling one called the ‘Plasma Enhancer’ :rolleyes:

Cheers, Lee
 
loonatic,

Thanks for the reply. Much appreciated for the time you spent :thumbsup:

It was Henry. He did say my screen may benefit because of the resolution of 1024*1024 with the DVI connection (compatible with HDMI and HDCP) but from what you say if I go down the scaler route I may be making life more difficult for myself. As I said before, the picture is very good, but I just wanted that more - kinda of 'poor' mans HD in a way. But as you said, with the so called Plasma Enhancer on the way things may change for the better?
 
stonedragon your ALIS screen (1024x1024) is a nightmare to use witha scaler as it will always need ALIS'ing by panel that said there was talk of a scaler with an ouput specificly for the ALIS panels but Hitachi ALIS wont accept it properly, not sure if philips will... I think it was a lumagen try asking gordon......
 
Hi everyone and thanks for this thread on the XDE with scaler.

I have been looking at the XDE specs lately (comparing them to the Pana HD7's) and if anything it says the (analog) PC input accepts 1024x768 at 60 or 75Hz (not 50), which seems to me to imply that a 720p @ 50 signal will be FRC'ed when converted to native.

Anyone knows if the Media box will actually FRC a 720p @ 50Hz to 60 (bad for PAL source) or 75 (good).
Does the HDMI input definitely refuse a 720p @ 75 signal fed from an HD+ scaler?

Thanks a million.
 
Does the ANALOG PC input (RGBHV) of the XDE Media receiver take 1024x768 @ 50 from a scaler (we seem to agree, as Joe was describing, that the DIGITAL HDMI wont take 768p but requires 720p)?

Can anyone confirm what the internal frequency of the XDE series is (48, 50, 60, 72, 75)?

Finally, is there any difference/advantage in quality between having a scaler performing a FRC over a panel/media box?

Cheers.
 
newbiebie

The HD15 (VGA) port on the XDE Media Box will work with a 1024x768P PC signal - its less happy if your inputting a Video signal (scaled to 1024x768P); you get lots of tearing and odd motion artefacts.

Best regards

Joe
 
Thanks for this Joe. Is that the Media box messing around here? Or can you explain the difference between a 768p RGBHV signal out of an HTPC and - errrrrr - a 768p RGBHV signal out of a scaler? :confused:
 
Re-igniting this thread a little hear, please bear with me ... :)

Recently (the last 2 months) I've started to notice a very strange 'artefact' occuring in certain colours on my plasma when viewing Sky+.

To recap my setup: Panasonic Sky+ DigiBox RGB -> RGBS Scart -> HD+ -> Panasonic 42" Plasma.

The artefact only occurs on areas of white/grey/blue and only when watching Sky+ (even if it's recorded), and not on DVD or Xbox sources.

I've checked that my Plasma does not have any wild settings (all set to normal), and that it doesn't occur on any other source input via the HD+.

If you look at the picture attached below you can see the 'purple-hase' artefact in the sky ...

I've run through the DVE DVD to setup my HD+ and Plasma, and everything looks beautiful, with no extreme settings.

I've contacted iScan, and they say it's not something they've never seen with an HD+ scaler, and feel that it's the Sky+ box at fault ...

I called Sky+ and they say I should switch back to PAL, instead of RGB as "there's no picture benefit, it's all digital whichever output you use, and as the picture is perfect when it arrives you won't get any difference in picture quality" ... hmm ... (ahem)B*ll*cks.

So what's causing this? and what should I replace? ... should I switch back to PAL, or simply get a new Sky+ box under warrenty? ... any comments would be very helpful.
 

Attachments

  • PurpleHaze-Medium.JPG
    PurpleHaze-Medium.JPG
    55.4 KB · Views: 82
Can you bypass the HD+ and go straight from Sky+ to Plasma? If the artefact is still visible, then there's the answer, but if not, then it is the HD+ set-up.
But before dismantling, try the PAL suggestion and see what the result is.
 
Sekrof

If you have the option to output RGB from your DVD player hook it up using the cabling and connectivity you usually use for SKY+ - do you get the same results.

I'd also suggest you avoid calling the SKY Help Desk if they think Composite is a 'perfect' picture - I wonder if SKY HD is more perfect than perfect :)

Best regards

Joe
 
Joe Fernand said:
Sekrof

If you have the option to output RGB from your DVD player hook it up using the cabling and connectivity you usually use for SKY+ - do you get the same results.

Joe

Interesting idea Joe. I'm guessing your suggesting I simulate another source into the same HD+ ports to see whether it happens again ...

Looking at the DVD player I have the option of either RGB-SCART Output, or Component-Phono (Y CB CR) output.

To simulate the same input to the HD+ I'd have to make the above fit into the RGB phonos (which also accepts YPbPr).

Would this work?
 
Hello sekrof

Try the SCART RGB Output of the DVD player (simply plug the SCART cable that's currently plugged into the SKY+ box into the RGB enabled output on the DVD player) - if you get the same result you can look 'down-stream' of the SKY+ box.

If its not the SKY+ box you can start to eliminate the next item in that 'Input' chain.

Regards

Joe
 
Thanks Joe.

I tried the PAL option on the Sky+ Box, and the problem didn't re-occur. I then re-plugged back in SCART lead and low-and-behold the problem seems to have vanished!

It looks like it may have been a connection in the SCART connector.

I'm monitoring it now, but so far haven't seen the issue repeated. But I'll give it a good viewing before writing it off as a wiring fault.

If it does reoccur, I'll try the DVD suggestion Joe - thank you.

Andrew ... looking for white & blue bits, without watching the damn thing :)
 
OK, now this is getting me down :(

It wasn't a wiring fault - the problem came back after a few hours (suspicious me thinks!)

It isn't the Sky+ box - I had it replaced today, and the problem is bigger than ever. I found a channel exhibiting the 'sky' tone and paused it, then feed the Sky+ output to another TV, via the same SCART port - no artefact. So the artefact doesn't appear to be generated by the Sky+ box.

Next in line is the HD+ box. Problem is, it only has one output of use to me - 15-pin-D-dub, and I have nothing other than the Plasma to connect that to - all the other TV's in the house need a scart connection or ariel.

Could it be the Plasma ? Odd how the artefact occurs after the screen has been on for a period, after being off ... but this could apply to the HD+ box in some ways to, as although it's always on, it's not always processing information - so it's chips are likely to be cooler. Could it be the age of the Plasma - now coming on for 5 years old (Model: TH-42PW3)

BTW, I tried the earlier suggestion of using the SCART plug on the Sky+ (that goes to the HD+ box) and simply plugging it into the RGB SCART socket on my DVD player - didn't work though - guess it doesn't like this RGBS-SCART lead config. Tried playing with it and checking menus, but nothing came through unfortunately (yes I did unplug the RGBS phono's first from the DVD, just to ensure it only had 1 possible output).

So, how can I prove which element it is HD+ or Plasma???

I'm thinking I might need a special cable ... is there such thing as 15-pin D-Sub to SCART ?? Maybe LetraPacks can make me one. Gota be cheaper than a new Plasma :)

Anyone any other suggestions?

groaning,
 

The latest video from AVForums

TV Buying Guide - Which TV Is Best For You?
Subscribe to our YouTube channel
Back
Top Bottom