Confused of Bitsream HD audio ..Pls help

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by berkeley384, Jan 12, 2008.

  1. berkeley384

    berkeley384
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    When I watch a BD disc I select the uncompressed 5.1 language and leave it on Bitstream.

    My Onkyo 605 comes up as Multichannel and plays it in its full glory, but I dont get how if im being told that using bitstream you cant have HD audio

    Can someone explain

    Ta

    Stephen
     
  2. jon1

    jon1
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    The bitstream on the ps3 is for standard DVDs normal dd and dts



    jon
     
  3. berkeley384

    berkeley384
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    Thanks - I appreciate what your saying is correct, however I think you have mis understood my question

    With Bitstream selected on the PS3and the Uncompressed 5.1 language selected (Not Dolby True) the Onkyo 605 displays Multichannel as if its recieving a PCM source. Ive just been digging about and have found the below ..

    Can anyone confirm this is correct

    Many thanks
     
  4. jon1

    jon1
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    True hd goes a cross as PCM....so you still get true hd in a PCM format ....and your amp is correct when it displays mutich..BTW you standard DVD sound formats goes across as pcm
     
  5. jon1

    jon1
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    If you want to bitstream over the HDMI for your sd sound formats you will have to go into the audio settings on the ps3 change the PCM over HDMI setting so that you and will display dd dts

    Jon
     
  6. berkeley384

    berkeley384
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    Jon2, Thanks, I know that your trying to help but I still think your missing what Im asking

    I know that for DD True I have to set the PS3 to LPCM, but what Im interested in this ...

    Take Spiderman 3 for example, it has both a DD True and Uncompressed 5.1 as two seperate options

    If I wanted to use DD True I know that I'd have to set the PS3 to LPCM

    BUT - If I pick Uncompressed 5.1 (NOT DD True) and set the PS3 to Bitstream it still the full Uncompressed audio that is output by the Amp.

    As I say in my above post some one else has said that this is because the PS3 cant send it as Bitstream, and because it doesnt know what else to do with it, it sends it as PCM anyway, all I wanted to know is if someone can confirm this is correct ?
     
  7. kingfats

    kingfats
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    Hi mate :)
    The Ps3 can't send HD audio Bitstream.
    If you want to get HD audio from the Ps3,set it to this.......2. BD/DVD Audio Optical Format (HDMI) LPCM.
    __________________
    Spiderman 3 Choose either PCM 5.1 or TrueHD 5.1 (both HD audio and to me sound the same ;)) don't change any settings in the Ps3. :cool:
     
  8. Lord Bunky

    Lord Bunky
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    PS3 does send out an LPCM bitstream in 5.1 surround over HDMI. It just doesn't send a Dolby TrueHD track in bitstream, or DTS-MA in any form at the moment.

    I just tried it 2 seconds ago with Spider-man 3. Though there was no difference between in sound quality whatever way the LPCM track was sent.

    Also, the 5.1 PCM track showed at 4.6Mbps either way.
     
  9. Lord Bunky

    Lord Bunky
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    Ps. Remember a PCM track is not encoded it is raw sound. Dolby TrueHD is encoded, and PS3 decodes it into LPCM. i.e. outputs Dolby TrueHD in raw format.

    LPCM over HDMI can be sent in 5.1 & 7.1 form. LPCM over optical will down convert to 2 channel.

    PCM sent over bitstream or LPCM is no different because it is not encoded.
     
  10. 6950rpm

    6950rpm
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    Seems to be a fair bit of confusion over this (as I was too until I played around with the settings for a bit) so here's what I do on my set up...

    Set the PS3 to output Bitstream over HDMI

    When playing a DVD the amp decodes the sound and plays it as DD / DTS or whatever the audio track is.

    When playing a Blu-ray film, manually select one of the HD audio formats on the disc and the PS3 will send the audio as PCM as it knows it can't do it as Bitstream. No need to manually make any changes to the PS3 audio setup.

    Worth noting that although the PS3 can't stream DTS MA, it will down convert it to DTS, the bit rate is limited to 1.5mbps, then sends that via HDMI. At the moment though, I prefer the sound of Dolby TrueHD over down mixed DTS MA.

    Edit: I meant to say down convert DTS MA to DTS Core but couldn't remember the exact term.
     
  11. kingfats

    kingfats
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    Has to be noted though if you choose that setting in the Ps3 menu,then you will not be able to enjoy HD audio from the Ps3.
    Has to set: BD/DVD Audio Optical Format (HDMI) LPCM.
     
  12. chic

    chic
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    with your ps3 you have 2 choices you can leave it at bitstream so when watching a dvd you can get standard dolby digtal/dts including 6.1 ex/es soundtracks from dvds and you will still get 5.1 uncopmpressed from bluray and with dts master audio you will get dts core at 1.5mb and if your bluray is 6.1 dts encoded like xmen you will get dts 1.5mb 6.1. If your bluray only has dolby true hd and you select it you will only get dolby digital at 640kb and not the hd audio.

    If you switch to pcm all your dvds will be decoded by the player and converted to pcm send as pcm to the amp and you will only get 5.1 even if the disc is 6.1. I find the ps3 very poor at doing the standard digital decoding.
    With bluray uncompressed pcm is sent as normal and dolby true hd is decoded and sent as pcm to your amp, and dtsma is sent as 5.1 pcm to your amp so even if the disc is 6/7.1ma you still will only get 5.1pcm.


    So its up to you how you want to set it, however for dolby true hd the ps3 must be set to pcm.
     
  13. 6950rpm

    6950rpm
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    Are you sure about that point Chic? I know you have the same amp as me (in fact, I read a lot of your posts before choosing it - thanks!)

    When I set my audio over HDMI as Bitstream, start playing a Blu-ray film, select the PCM audio track, the amp will change its display to say 'PCM 48' and if I hit select on the remote, I get 'Linear PCM 5.1ch. 48kHz 4.6 Mbps' (it also sounds massively different to the Dolby Digital track if I switch to that.)

    This indicates to me that the PS3 realises it can't send PCM over Bitstream and internally switches to PCM without me having to change anything.
     
  14. berkeley384

    berkeley384
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    This is what I am asking .. When Set to Bitstream on the PS3 and selecting Uncompressed 5.1 the PS3 Deffinatley sends te audio as PCM and Im presuming from the above that this is because it knows it cant do it as Bitstream so it sends it as PCM . Agin as said before doing it this was means that your not continually changing between Blitsream and LPCM.

    Edit - just to say I have just realised from the above post that by pressing select the PS3 will tell me whats its doin and I can say that set to Bitstream, The amp has chosen to send audio as PCM

    I understand what everyone is saying about how its not possible to send HD over bitsrream, but what I was asking was "why when its set to Bitsream and Im expecting it to NOT work does it work" - and I guess I found my own answer in that the PS3 just sends is as PCM because it cant do anything else with it.
     
  15. kingfats

    kingfats
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    Hi mate :)
    Is your amp HDMI I.3 (and 6950rpm the question). :)
     
  16. jon1

    jon1
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    correct:D



    jon
     
  17. jon1

    jon1
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    My amp is HDMI 1.3 have i won something:D




    jon
     
  18. berkeley384

    berkeley384
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    Hello

    Yes I think it is .. see below from the onkyo website ...

    Jon 2 ...

    Cheers mate :thumbsup:

    6950rpm

    Mine doesnt do this - i only get a PCM when i select Uncompressed 5.1 from the audio settings on the Blu Ray disc itself when the PS3 is set to bitstream.

    When set to Bit stream and selectinf :dd: True HD on the Blu ray disc it does as you all said it would and comes out as :dd:
     
  19. 6950rpm

    6950rpm
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    My amp is a Sony STR DG910 and I believe it is only HDMI 1.2
     
  20. kingfats

    kingfats
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    Yep..............have a burger. [​IMG]
     
  21. kingfats

    kingfats
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    Cheers mate. :smashin:
    Mine is 1.1 and if a choose the PCM track (spidey 3) instead of the TrueHD one and leave the Ps3 on BD/DVD Audio Optical Format (HDMI) LPCM all is fine,but if change the Ps3 to Bitsream (select PCM track) then all get is 2 channel PCM.
    No big as i only use the Ps3 for Blu-ray playback so leaving it on LPCM is fine for me. :cool:
     
  22. jon1

    jon1
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    You cheap skate..do i get frys with that?:D



    jon
     
  23. chic

    chic
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    yes i am, you can leave it set to bitstream if you want and if you select uncompressed pcm audio it will play fine, the problem is with dolby true hd, if its left at bitstream all the ps3 will send is standard dolby digital 640kb, so if you want to listen to dolby true hd the ps3 must be set to pcm, for uncompressed pcm itself it doesnt matter what the ps3 is set to as both methods will send the uncomressed pcm
     
  24. chic

    chic
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    you are correct, however like i said in other posts if you want to listen to a dolby true hd track where the ps3 decodes the true hd track and sends it as pcm to your amp the ps3 must be set to pcm, if you dont all the ps3 will send is dolby digital at 640 kb, so the ps3 must be set to pcm if you want dolby true hd, for uncompressed pcm soundtracks it doesnt matter what it is set to as both settings will send the pcm audio.
     
  25. Ian_S

    Ian_S
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    I'm going to buck the trend and say that I'm not convinced on the PS3 will never do HD bitstream audio front.

    Much of the confusion on this point seems to stem from the fact that the PS3 initially had a custom HDMI 1.3 chip made specially for Sony that has no publicly available spec sheet. However, contrary to some mischievious rumours circulated at the time of the PS3's launch, HDMI 1.3a DOES NOT contain any new updates for HD bitstream audio, having been sad and read the spec... The main thing HDMI 1.3a added was the lip-sync control feature.

    So, IMO, no-one bar Sony knows if the PS3 can or will ever send HD bitstream audio. If it really is HDMI 1.3 compliant then it should be able to send HD bitstream, if it's not HDMI 1.3 compliant but is advertised as such... I believe most of the standalone BD players have allowed bitstream audio because being only profile 1.0 players, they will never have to worry about mixing secondary audio so it allows owners to get the most from their machines especially given the lack of any player that decodes all the HD formats... (And of course it allows those same manufacturers to sell you a shiny new amp too ;) )

    However, the PS3 is not such a beast and is 1.1 compliant (wth 2.0 promised) and therefore WILL have to worry about audio mixing... This thread shows how confusing it can all get with only one audio stream, and I suspect Sony may be holding off on bitstream HD audio until people get used to things like PiP. You could argue on the PS3, that being a highly interactive games machine, such features might get more use on this platform and be more popular than on standalones where primary concern might be more PQ/AQ related. If that's the case it may make more sense for Sony to hold back on HD bitstream for a while.

    We'll see of course, but I would not rule it out.
     
  26. 6950rpm

    6950rpm
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    Had more of a play last night and now see what you mean - I was getting my wires crossed with Dolby TrueHD and Uncompressed PCM.

    For ease of use, I leave mine set to Bitstream and then just select the PCM track as all bar 1 of my Blu-ray films have that.

    Would be nice if in the setup options of the PS3 we were able to specify 1 setting for DVD and antother for Blu-ray.
     
  27. Bald Monkey

    Bald Monkey
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    The same could be said for a lot of HD-DVD and BR players, specific settings for both picture, such as 1080/24P and audio, bitstream/PCM, would be nice. :D
     
  28. berkeley384

    berkeley384
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    Agreed, however now I've worked out how to change between LPCM and Bitsream on the PS3 whilst the movie is in progress Im much happier.

    I had previously thought that every time I wanted to do this I had to exit the movie, go in to settings etc , but by pressing "triangle" and ggoing into the audio options its a much easier way of doing it.

    One of the things that most concerns me is that the retailers dont know what they're selling you at the moment. I asked in RS about setting up the 605 with a PS3 and they didnt know how it was best done .... well one chap did but he wasnt there
     

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