Confused about new TV (65"?)

CazzaC

Novice Member
Hi,

I have been trying to do a ton of research to purchase a TV for our new flat (being renovated right now).
I have read the "primer" and "value" guides. But I am still a bit confused.
Any help would be appreciated.

Some basic Answers:

1. Usage will be very mixed:
No cable service, only streaming + gaming
4k Netflix/Amazon
1080p/4k Kodi
4k Sports through streaming services (TSN/RDS in Canada for hockey, mostly)
Some gaming (eventual PS5 for some games, but main gaming will occur on gaming PCs that are in a different room). So this is a factor, but not the MOST important one.

2. it will be used with the following equipment:
Nvidia Shield TV for most content (Kodi, Amazon, Netflix, Sports, etc)
Sonos Beam (via HDMI-ARC?) Soundbar
So really, I don't care much about the "smart" or "sound aspects?

3. The room will be bright (lots of windows). We do have blinds we can pull down, but I am assuming it will still be a factor?

4. The viewing angle is important (open area living/dining/kitchen) concept: most of the watching will be straight on, but enough will be from kitchen or table that wider is better?)

5. I know nothing about HDR or PQ. This is probably not the biggest factor for us unless it is very noticeable and/or broken. We are not the type to complain about PQ as long as it's not garbage. But I also want to have this TV for a long time. So some level of future proofing is interesting here.

6. THICKNESS/THINNESS and LOOK (borders?) are important to us. It will be wall mounted and very centrally located (and possibly be visible sideways, hence the thickness aspect)


Now for some questions:

Am I better off with a basic OLED for the extra money (for viewing angles and the "thin" aspect?) or a higher end QLED
I cannot seem to find the Philips 65OLED754 in Canada, but the LG 65B9 can be found for just under 3,000$ CDN. This stretches my budget quite a bit, but COULD be doable if somebody explains what I am really gaining over the medium/highend QLEDs that would save me money? Please note that I am having a VERY hard time finding some of the recommended models in Canada in the value guide in Canada. Also, the burn in issue with OLED scares me. Am I blowing it out of proportion? I do have kids that may "forget" things power on.

To Summarize the question: What do I gain or lose by choosing a basic OLED (LG 65B9) vs something else for my criteria? And which "non-OLED" should I attempt to find in Canada for my usage?
 

Dodgexander

Moderator
I QLED is just Samsung's marketing term for their higher end LCD TVs. They are in effect no different to LCD tech of old.
The difference lays with the backlight and how they can display colours. Their higher end models use quantum dot tech that allows them to display more colours. Other brands also use similar tech in their LCD TVs such as LG's Nanocell or Sony's Triluminos.

So really, you compare a technology that has been around for years with the same strengths and weaknesses now as it did back when people chose between LCD TVs and Plasma TVs to a new display technology in OLED.

If you take a read here: LCD versus OLED does it help you at all?

From reading your points, the only things I can pick up on against an OLED are:

1. ABL - When watching hockey which has a lot of white on the screen at once, an OLED will dim somewhat to save power. This won't be the case on an LCD TV. Therefore if you want to watch games during the day with the blinds open an high end LCD TV will be better. If you are however watching games as they are played in the evening without a light, or with dim lighting, an OLED will be better with greater contrast and better blacks.

2. Brightness and anti glare. OLEDs are pretty good with anti glare. But Samsungs's higher end LCD TVs are the bees knees. If you value watching TV during the day when its bright more than you do in the evening, a LCD TV like the Q80R or Q90R will be better suited.

Without further info, if you do decide on a OLED TV I'd suggest trying to go for the LG C9 as its a bit more future proof for next gen consoles. If not, the B9 is a good choice also. If you want better motion from an OLED, look at Sony's OLED models, but expect to pay more for them.

The OLED market in the Americas is worse than in Europe, there's no Philips or Panasonic OLEDs in Canada..although Vizio are releasing one this year.
 

CazzaC

Novice Member
Thanks for the reply. It is really, really appreciated. I did read the OLED vs LCD article.

What is confusing me is that I cannot seem to be able to find high end "LCDs" in Canada.

So most of the comparisons (pros/cons) make zero sense to me at the moment without availability or price point. It's all academic until you see the price difference. I am inclined to go OLED (B9) given that it is in stock and "only" 3k CDN. But I am still afraid of the "burn in" issues.

But this decision is driven by lack of options. Kind of a stupid way to make a choice.

I can find the Mid-range Sonys mentioned in that article (XF9005). But it doesn't appear to suit my needs (viewing angle, mostly). Same with the Sony 950s (viewing angle again...)

I also cannot seem to find 60-65" Q80R OR Q90R. I can find a Q90T 65" for MORE money than the B9 OLED (3500+ CDN).

Is it possible that many of the models mentioned are now discontinued? Is there currently an availability issue in the market? (Covid? confinement making people upgrade TVs?)
I will keep looking for the recommended models, but I feel like I am on a wild goose chase.

To be honest, I feel like given my criteria, I could easily be happy with a mid to high end, wide angle LCD.
 

Dodgexander

Moderator
Its probably because you are searching for the European model numbers.

In the guide the XG9505 is the X950G in North America. The Sony XF9005 is the X900F. If you want wider viewing angles you need an OLED really, there are LCD TVs with wide viewing angles, but not at the same level as OLED. Sony's new X950H has a wide viewing angle filter at 55" and up, but its newly released and overpriced. Same is true for the Q80T and up Samsung models.

Samsung TVs with the T suffix are newly released 2020 models, hence why they are so expensive (TVs usually are marked up tremendously upon release).

It may be there's no longer availability on many 2019 models, in which case your choice is even more limited.

It never makes financial sense to buy a new 2020 model on present pricing as they don't really make any gains year to year, so considering newer models from LG, Sony or Samsung isn't really worthwhile.

If the B9 is a good price for you and you understand the risks involved with burn in then its going to be by far the better option. The new Q90T is more like last years Q80R and should be similar in price to the B9, not a lot more expensive.

If you forgo viewing angles there are some decent options in Canada from TCL, Hisense and Vizio such as the TCL 6 series, Hisense H8F/H8G and Vizio Quantum if you can still find stock. These are all higher end models too.

Typically TCL/Hisense being Chinese don't mark up their new models quite the same as other manufacturers.
 

CazzaC

Novice Member
Thank you again. You are really helping out with this decision.
I hope I am not abusing your time with a few more questions?

I ran a wider search that includes some of the North American model numbers and some newer model numbers. It appears that, for some reason, the B9 is a much better deal here than "High End LCDs".

Combined with the viewing angle issue...it almost seems like a no brainer. I was hoping to find wide-angle LCDs for significantly less (whatever that means) than the B9. That doesn't seem to be the case in Canada right now.

It sounds like I am going OLED. I read some of the burn in studies (rtings.com?) and I think I can chance the burn in risk.

I am currently stretching my budget a bit, but I am still ready to listen to arguments for spending more for the C9. What exactly am I getting for the difference (probably over 33% increase in price to between 3600$ and 4000$ CDN).

You mention that "its a bit more future proof for next gen consoles" A lot of the reviews mention the upgraded processors... but I am not quite clear on what this does for me? Sounds expensive to optimize a console? I can live with a living features, but if something is "broken", it may be worth the upgrade.
 

Dodgexander

Moderator
No, no trouble at all. Glad to help!

Because we have no HDMI 2.1 devices yet to test we don't know for sure if HDMI 2.1 VRR will work with HDR with the B9 in the future. The C9 is said to work because it has a more up to date chipset and can support a higher bit depth signal.

This doesn't mean something won't work. If VRR is not supported with HDR you'll have the choice of using it without HDR enabled, or using HDR and not using VRR.

Everything is cross compatible and even older TVs using HDMI v1.4 will work with the new consoles so you never have to worry about it not working.

Its that time of year now when 2019 models are being replaced by 2020 models. It seems for you the B9 is the only good value model left. I'd snap it up before you are left only with overpriced 2020 options.

If you decide against the TV, I'd recommend waiting to purchase a TV later in time, preferably after the new consoles are released so you can let others do the beta testing and so it gives time for the prices to drop also. Usually Black Friday each year is the first time the 2020 models become more affordable and get close to competing the with the value for money of the B9 now.

So it really comes down to how much you are willing to pay extra for the C9. Its not just about future VRR support...but there are other differences too. Colour accuracy is better on the C9. Picture processing has the edge when it comes to upscaling and near to black detail. However a 33% increase in price is not really worth it for a TV that is perhaps only a little better overall.
 

CazzaC

Novice Member
Thanks. I just read a few threads regarding the C9 vs B9 on reddit. I understand that I may lose out on SOMETHING on my future PS5. It seems nobody is quite sure if the processor is powerful enough to do HDR + 4k + VRR/120Hz. But honestly, I am not too worried. I doubt that new games will take advantage of all of these things for quite some time. I am ok if I end up playing these games at a combo of these things (I am sure HD + HDR + 120hz won't be so bad or 4k + 60hz + HDR?) And there is always the chance of a firmware upgrade / more efficient software actually doing something to the B9 to enable features? In any case, I cannot really wait for the TV. I will place the order ASAP while it is in stock.

Just noticed that Costco.ca carries it in stock, which doubles the warranty for free and gives me 90 return. I usually prefer specialized shops, but anything at Costco is usually to good to pass up. Their return policy is VERY tolerant even beyond 90 days. I expect that if something is really broken in 6 months (when I get a PS5), they will issue a store credit (I have done it before).

Funny how life throws curveballs. I fully expected to be told that OLED is not worth it for me when it turns out that currently OLED is the most "bang for the buck" I can buy today in Canada. Go figure.

Thanks again, you were instrumental in pointing me in the right direction. The primer threads and the conversation really helped.
 

CazzaC

Novice Member
grrr...my order got cancelled (lack of stock (for B9). I had my heart set on OLED...thinking of a C8 (I can find it for a similar price). My understanding that I would gain some high end processing but it would be a 2018 model. Any concerns before I pull the trigger? I simply cannot afford a 2020 OLED in the 65" size for now...
 

Dodgexander

Moderator
You could wait for for 2020 prices to drop and swoop for an OLED like the BX or CX when they come down.

But otherwise the C8 is still a very good TV. There's practically no difference in picture quality between OLEDs bought in 2017 and OLEDs bought today. Just see the difference between model ratings at rtings.com
 

CazzaC

Novice Member
Thanks again for your precious advice. I have placed a few calls about borrowing a TV for a few months from friends that have several underused sets. Will set a few price alerts on the newer OLEDs and see what happens.
 

CazzaC

Novice Member
Just commenting back on this thread one last time in case it helps anyone. I tried HARD to find older LG oleds in Canada. It was always the same. I ordered, then either got my ordered delayed or cancelled. Another variation was that I was given the option for "open box".

Sooooo....I increased my budget and got a 65CX from Costco. The price had dropped a little bit from from the summer peak. They have a money back guarantee (60 days) + extended warranty included.

My only minor issue has been that for some reason it did not like the HDMI-ARC connection to my Sonos BEAM when I was using my Firestick 4k. Not a big deal for me, as the long-term plan was to use my Shield TV anyways. I just happened to have faster access to my Firestick when the TV showed up.

Never figured it out. Tried a MILLION settings until stupid me realized that I was troubleshooting a short term thing. I found my Shield. The Shield just work upon swap. In any case, great combo. The upscaling is unreal. Old, crappy shows actually don't look bad on the 65" OLED while the same video looks like s*it on my 7 year old 47" LG LCD. Something good is happening here.

The SONOS Beam works perfectly for my room and the complement to the TV is awesome. I like in a condo, so I didn't want to make a huge surround system. The SONOS is awesome because of "Night Mode" and Voice Enhacements. These setting normalize the sound and allow voices to be clear on low volume.
 

Dodgexander

Moderator
Never figured it out. Tried a MILLION settings until stupid me realized that I was troubleshooting a short term thing. I found my Shield. The Shield just work upon swap. In any case, great combo. The upscaling is unreal. Old, crappy shows actually don't look bad on the 65" OLED while the same video looks like s*it on my 7 year old 47" LG LCD. Something good is happening here.
Do you have the shield 4k? The upscaling on that is supposed to be very, very good.

Glad to hear you are happy with the CX though, thanks for updating! Congratulations.
 

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