Question Choices for in wall - M&K / Monitor Audio / KEF?

Discussion in 'Home Cinema Speakers' started by Rick84, Jan 3, 2018.


    1. Rick84

      Rick84
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      Morning all,

      Has anybody shifted from Monitor Audio to M&K ? I’m in the process of selecting speakers and looking at in wall/ in ceiling.

      I currently own the Monitor Audio Apex but with us shortly moving to a new build, the Mrs and I have decided we want everything as hidden as possible.

      Due to the depth of the front wall the front 3 channels will have to go in the ceiling.

      So from Monitor Audio

      Front CP-CT380IDC x3
      Rears CT-265IDC or the 265FX in the back wall.

      From M&K it would have to be the IW5 all round.

      Also considering the KEF Ci200QR or CI200RR-THX if I could get a deal on the latter.

      Open to other suggestions on brands if anybody has any.
       
    2. adam-burnley

      adam-burnley
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      Assuming you're still planning a pair of in-ceilings for Atmos, I'd recommend finding a way to fit in-walls for the base layer. It might mean chisselling a bit of brick out, or building a false wall to add depth.

      I've not heard an Armos setup where the front three are overhead, but I can't imagine it would work too well, even with Dirac. Perhaps others will chime in though.
       
    3. Rick84

      Rick84
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      I appreciate it’s not a normal setup but I wont be building any false walls or chiselling brick out to accommodate the speakers.

      Just trying to find a review of chap had written. He demoed the kef ci200rr in a 5.1 all in the ceiling. He’d wrote the accuracy of sound placement though the KEFs was exceptional (words to that effect).
       
    4. Andrew K

      Andrew K
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      The KEF UniQ driver does make placement very easy and they are exceptional speakers. Monitor Audio speakers tend to be cheaper though.
       
    5. adam-burnley

      adam-burnley
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      Again I've no experience, but I imagine in a 5.1 arrangement the Kef's could work well. It's in a 5.1.2 setup that I'd be concerned.
       
    6. cmclean

      cmclean
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      How deep is your wall could you fit KEF CI4100QL's in the front wall?

      They sound excellent
       
    7. Rick84

      Rick84
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      There is probably an inch from plasterboard to brick. Without going on to the building site I can’t be 100% accurate. These isn’t enough to house a speaker though [emoji30]
       
    8. Rick84

      Rick84
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      Just spoke to KEF on the blower and they also seem to think it would work ok. He explained that the over head gap from front to back would be filled by the 2 Atmos channels.
       
    9. cmclean

      cmclean
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      I've also heard the KEF's in a full in ceiling 5.1 without the Atmos and they do sound great even though many say don't do 5.1 in the ceiling. Both as in ceiling dinner plate style and also the motorised in ceiling speakers that they make
       
    10. Rick84

      Rick84
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      Dinner plate style ?
       
    11. Rick84

      Rick84
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      Just need to get some reasonable prices for the kefs now
       
      Last edited: Jan 3, 2018
    12. cmclean

      cmclean
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      Yeah I mean fixing in ceiling. They look like plates on the ceiling lol
       
    13. Rick84

      Rick84
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      Oh lol. I thought you meant arranging them like a circle in the ceiling
       
    14. the little audio company

      the little audio company
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      The KEFs do have an advantage with their UniQ drivers, which produces a far more uniform dispersion than most, and gel extremely well together. I'm hoping at some point to have a complete Atmos set up using KEF's Ci-200rr-THX (with other options too).
       
    15. Rock Danger

      Rock Danger
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      MK over Kef (having owned the upper end of both) - but either are very good, @Seriously Ltd do deals for forum members. Have a word with him.
       
    16. Rick84

      Rick84
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      The M&K are very expensive by comparison. The IW-5 is similarly priced to the KEF ci200rr but no idea they would actually compare with one another
       
    17. Rock Danger

      Rock Danger
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      In comparison to what? I use IW150's in the ceiling, I could have put 300's in there but there was a joist issue that turned out would have been an issue anyway... blah blah blah..

      The important thing to remember is that your atmos speakers don't deserve any less love than your bottom layer in terms of quality and this is largely true due to atmos speakers using the FR of 40hz and up, not to mention upmixing modes on AVR's are quite busy - so you don't want to throw some auld sh*te up there, like loads of people are doing.

      However..

      Did you mean to say your front LCR speakers are going to be firing downward at the end of the room? If so then you could staple an angry badger to your ceiling cause it'll sound just as awful. I dunno if you can do a stud wall but you should consider that if it's the case.

      That ceiling install - (of which I've done many) is what people put in their kitchens and some bedrooms to casually listen music or the news. I wouldn't recommend it for home cinema.
       
    18. Rick84

      Rick84
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      Yea, in ceiling is the current idea for the front 3, I see you’re firmly againts the idea lol.
       
    19. the little audio company

      the little audio company
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      It'll depend how far you are from those speakers, and how high the ceiling is. Obviously if they're 4m away from you and the ceiling was 2m high, that'd need some damn fine dispersion to sound half decent! The KEF's dispersion is wider than most, though, and as Rick is firing across the shorter width of the room, the issues are less apparent.
       
    20. Rock Danger

      Rock Danger
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      Well, it's your cinema I'm not trying to put you off - but in no universe is it a good idea. I speak from an install and someone who does sounds' point of view.

      Tell me why you can't do a stud wall? Is there a certain aesthetic you'd loose? What about on wall speakers? Plenty of discrete on walls out there like the MK MP7 - only heard them once mind, seemed pretty good and on budget.

      if you have to put them in the ceiling, i think I'd probably omitt the centre and run it in a phantom style to give you some sort imagery, rather than it bouncing off about 500 things before it gets to your ears. Like I said, I've never done an installation of ceiling speakers and thought it was a good idea because it sounds kinda meh and it really isn't designed to be on that axis with our anatomy.
       
    21. Rick84

      Rick84
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      The room is 7x3m with the sofa to tv being the shortest length. A stud wall would close the wall in even further which here just isn’t the room for.
       
    22. adam-burnley

      adam-burnley
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      Just a suggestion... you could build a 'floating wall' and create a recess for a wall mounted TV - at eye level height (unless you have a fireplace or something on that wall?). You would only need to bring the new wall out another 3 inches or so (depending on which in-walls you go for). You'd then be able to hide the rest of the AV gear out of sight, and have a really clean front stage.

      Otherwise, I have both the M&K MP7s (Living room) and the Kef T301s (back room - around the Philips 21:9), and both are pretty good. The MP7s are a little better than the Kef's in terms of sound and performance IMO, but the Kef's are really low profile and definitely have the WAF - although the missus accepted the MP7s in "her" living room too.

      I've posted pictures of both in other threads before, but can do again if it would help.
       
    23. Rick84

      Rick84
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      Cheers Adam, could you post the mp7 ?
       
    24. Rock Danger

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      Gotcha, well I'd tend to be of the same opinion as @adam-burnley then and if not a false wall consider low profile on wall.
       
    25. adam-burnley

      adam-burnley
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      Not the best picture, so I'll see if I can get a better one in the daylight tomorrow...

      20180103_183938.jpg

      BTW, the living room is 4.5m x 3.3m, with the sofa to TV also on the shortest length.

      And yes, I know the TV is too high, but the missus insisted on the 'ole-in-the-wall fire (it is on a motorised tilt bracket though, so the angle isn't too bad actually)
       
    26. Rick84

      Rick84
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      Just had a thought,

      I don’t think opposing wall is solid and offers a lot more depth. I wonder if it’ll hold the tv and in wall speakers ?
       
    27. adam-burnley

      adam-burnley
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      If its the ground floor, I'd expect all walls to be solid.

      If its just a stud wall, you'll need to be fairly lucky to find studs or noggings in just the right place, although most TV brackets are often wide enough to span 600mm stud centres (could of course be different on you build).

      Is the plasterboard up yet? If not, you could ask them to fit some osb or chipboard panels where you plan to mount the TV. You don't have to worry about finding studs then.
       
    28. Rick84

      Rick84
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      There are two internal walls so possibly the other is solid?

      I’ll try find out tomorrow
       
    29. Andrew K

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    30. yoskiwoski

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