CES VIDEO: Sony AG9 (A9G) 4K OLED, ZG9 (Z9G) 8K LCD and XG95 LCD TVs

Discussion in 'Sony TVs Forum' started by Phil Hinton, Jan 11, 2019.


    1. Phil Hinton

      Phil Hinton
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    2. Matson

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      Thanks for the video phil. I was just wondering if you guys are careful when it comes to the type of questions you ask. I know you never want to insult a company but I feel sometimes the questions are all too mundane and just a bunch of marketing speak answers. I really would have preferred if you had asked why have they gone back to the Backlight Master Drive in the ZG9 compared to the ZF9 and also enquired about the ZF9 being so poor with blooming and blacks and the differences in this model that seems to be a true successor to the ZD9. Lets be honest the whole Master series is the absolute best in picture quality statement he made isn't really true when there master series ZF9 had such poor contrast, blooming and blacks. Even worse than some midrange LCD sets. That model is barely available or even shown in stores in the states so it seems like they aren't wanting to show it off too much and are quickly moving on.
       
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    3. MechaGodzilla

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      Thanks for the video. Nice to finally have confirmation on just where the XG95 fits in. Many of us (me included) assumed it was a successor to the XF90, but here Gavin says the XF90 stays for 2019, with the XG95 being the step-up model. That explains why it's numbered "95" rather than "90", is only available in sizes from 55" and up, and why it's being released later (read: a bit later, later than the XE90 and XF90 were) in the year; it's considered more of a successor to the XE93/94.

      If it's a higher tier model, may one hope for a few more dimming zones? Looking forward to hearing more about this TV, once it's in the hands of reviewers.
       
      Last edited: Jan 13, 2019
    4. SonOfSJ

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      I'm pleased to see that the 85ZG9 has a normal tabletop stand, as opposed to the easel stand of the 98ZG9. However, I'm slightly disappointed that the legs of the 85ZG9's tabletop stand splay outwards (as we've seen on several Sony televisions just recently, alas), so that the surface on which the television sits will have to be nearly as wide as the television itself. Pity that there doesn't seem to be an option, as in Samsung's recent QE85Q900R television, to have the (thankfully straight) legs in two positions, one near the edges of the screen and the second rather more towards the centre of the television.
       
    5. Phil Hinton

      Phil Hinton
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      Not at all, but with a show like CES I think it's best to hear what the companies have to say about the products they are announcing and we will then put those claims to the test in our independent reviews. I could ask those questions you mention but what would you expect the answers would be? And what use would that video be? We are certainly not scared to ask those questions and our reviews never hold back from giving you our honest opinion, but there's a time and a place for challenging questions, and a CES show floor is probably not that place, to be honest. At least Sony put forward someone for the interview and everyone knows that a CES Q&A is going to have a certain amount of marketing talk from the companies, it's what the event is all about. I'm sure you prefer this format than videos of me standing talking to the camera all the time... ;)
       
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      Last edited: Jan 12, 2019
    6. zeppelino

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      Yours is a face better suited to radio... :smashin:
       
    7. SonOfSJ

      SonOfSJ
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      @Phil Hinton I have two questions about the Sony video, and two observations.

      From easiest to most difficult:

      Observation 1. I like that the new remote control has the Input (source) button very close to the central dial, good move by Sony! I'm looking at the remote of my ZD9 as I type this and that has the Input button away at the top, which is not as good as the new remote.

      Question 1. Please can you ask someone to take a picture of your good self standing next to the 85ZG9 and, in particular, standing next to the 98ZG9, so that we can see just how big they are! Although I suppose if you're feeling camera-shy the same purpose would be served if you take photos of someone else standing next to the Sonys please.

      Observation 2. As I may have mentioned on the other Sony CES thread, I very much look forward to seeing how easily the four built-in speakers around the body of the (I presume) 85ZG9 can be incorporated into a surround-sound system and used as the centre speaker, especially at quite high volumes. Will there come a point at, for instance, round about -12dB on the receiver or amplifier's volume control (I normally listen to films between -24dB and -15dB) when the built-in Sony speakers begin to distort? Also, equally importantly, will the (Arcam, Yamaha, Denon etc) receiver's equalisation be able to compensate for the different characteristics of the Sony television compared to the other speakers in the surround-sound system?

      Question 2. This one is the most difficult, and I presume that you won't be able to answer until you discuss it with Mr Stuart Wright. I know that it's been AVForums's policy not to review hardware that you have not had in your own reviewing rooms, in the South-West, or North-East (of England) or elsewhere. The Samsung recent QE85Q900R television was made available to journalists (AVForums's and others) at Samsung Headquarters, and there are detailed reviews of it on the internet, I have personally read two reviews by very well-known journalists. Clearly under the current policy one of those reviews cannot be published by AVForums. I imagine that a 75" television is the biggest that can fairly easily be transported to journalists' homes for review, as you said on the podcast about a month ago (although I believe that Mr Withers did once have an 84" television in his lounge.) The industry is moving towards bigger and bigger television sizes (and the Sony 85ZG9 will be very difficult to transport in and out of reviewers' houses, and the 98ZG9 will be almost impossible). Will AVForums consider amending its policy and in future publish reviews of these very, very large televisions (85" and upwards) that are performed (of course with all appropriate measuring equipment, test patterns, video clips and also enough TIME) on manufacturers' premises, since these very, very large televisions simply cannot be transported around the UK to reviewers' homes?
       
      Last edited: Jan 12, 2019
    8. dave1956a

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      Fair point but where is the time and place to ask them
       
    9. deon444

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      Think you have done a great job with the videos and have asked all the relevant questions that are important to this years sets. Very imformative videos:smashin:.

      From what I've seen from this years Sony sets hasn't had me wanting to upgrade my Af9,so looking forward to 2020 to see a bigger jump. Although I do like the look of the ag9:blush:
       
    10. MahaRaja

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      The LCD front has been disappointing from Sony ever since the legendary ZD9 was released about three years ago and no replacement still not released in terms of similar size in 65 and 75 inches. We have a high end LCD gigantic in size, ZG9 which features the all important 'backlight master drive' but added the headline grabbing 8K res, this moves the set out of most people's reach and virtually impossible to get inside your home, due to its sheer size.

      Why Sony feels it can't incorporate 'backlight master drive' to XG95 for example, which is the next step down from ZG9? That would have given more choice to customers who're reluctant to go for OLEDs. Don't forget Panasonic has given up on high end LCD sets. Leaving Samsung and Sony to offer LCD alternative to OLEDs.

      Last year the 'Master series' has been disappointing and this year it will be the same unless you can muster the giant ZG9! Unless the XG95 can exceed the contrast level of the old ZD9, then it's a worthless cause, if it can't even beat a 3 year old set.
       
    11. LCDseeker

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      So they are going to keep producing the XF9005? I thought they were ditching it and releasing the XG90 but only in 49".
       
    12. MechaGodzilla

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      I wouldn't expect the XG95 to exceed the ZD9 in terms of contrast, especially not in larger sizes where it will feature X-Wide Angle, but it will be interesting to see how it performs anyway. You never know, X-Wide Angle may be improved for this year, and the 65" and 55" models won't have it. Will be the first time we see the X1 Ultimate processor coupled with a more conventional VA panel, so will be interesting to see the results of that.

      Quoting directly from the video:

      "...and it doesn't supersede XF90, so we're keeping XF90 running. But XG95 takes a lot of the technology we originally introduced with the Master Series into that lineup."

      So it would seem so!
       
    13. CMBmovies

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      I know you never want to insult a company but I feel sometimes the questions are all too mundane and just a bunch of marketing speak answers.

      It's a really interesting point. But as Phil mentioned, realistically where would it actually get you? Do you expect Sony to actually answer? Lets do a thought exercise and I'll answer them for you as Sony...

      Why have you gone back to the Backlight Master Drive in the ZG9?
      We have a range of proprietary Sony technologies suited for different products to give the best picture available.

      Why is the ZF9 so poor with blooming and blacks?
      Our TVs give incredible picture quality and immerse you in a wide range of content. (Starts looking over at the Sony marketing team member just off camera)

      Why are your midrange TVs barely available?
      Our televisions are available in a wide range of stores. (signals to Marketing member who steps in and ends the interview.. "Ok, so that's all we have time for today")

      I'm sure the journalists here have back channels to Sony to feed stuff like that back and get answers to readers questions. But like it's been said, there's a right time and a place. And CES is more about trying to understand the message Sony want to send out about this product and passing that onto the readers with commentary as needed. There will be other times to press them hard on difficult issues. I'm new here by the way and really enjoying the CES coverage. :)
       
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    14. zeppelino

      zeppelino
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      Could mean the XG90 is a premium 49”, step up from the XF90. Intriguing stuff
       
    15. LCDseeker

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      Exactly what was thinking. Why not improve the XF90?!
       
    16. Goldorak

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      It is truly a bizarre move from Sony. When you have something as good as master drive, why not use it? They even managed to refine it for the 8k...(smaller)

      They clearly pushing oled full steam...

      Contrast is at x12 I believe for xg95 when it is quoted at x20-30 for the monster 8k fald...

      When you see what pana oled and Samsung lcd are bringing in 2019, going to be a hard year for Sony and LG...
       
    17. MahaRaja

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      Yes, OLED seems to be the better choice, in absence of high end 4K LCD reasonable size TVs.
      This leaves Samsung with Q9 or whatever they'll decide to call it this year, as the top 4K LCD set in 65 and 75 inches. Don't think Sony XG95/90 can compete with Samsung 4K Q9 model for this year.

      Sony wants customers to fork out for the mega expensive and mega size ZG9, for the sheer luxury of 'Backlight Master Drive' the 8K feature is a mute point and a headline grabber, leaving the rest of the series without this feature. X-Wide angle will sacrifice the contrast level, as we have seen in last year's poorly received ZF9 and poor sales as a result. They have yet to develop the Techo where they can have both; wider viewing angle level and superb contrast. Something has to give. If they could have same contrast level for XG95, as they do for ZG9, then it would be a no brainer, would sell like hot cakes, providing it gets superb reviews of course, but that would mean no body would buy the giant ZG9! Poor Sony.
       
    18. woppy101

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      If you have a south facing room there is no point getting a Sony TV with X-wide fitted, you will be extremely disappointed and unable to watch your tv with any sunlight coming into your room, that goes for the ZF9 also
       
    19. encaser

      encaser
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      Sony do seem to have gone batty here with LED; you either buy the supposedly more generally affordable XG95 or, what is obviously hugely expensive ZG9.
       
    20. Phil Hinton

      Phil Hinton
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      This is exactly what I meant. You are also correct that a PR rep for the company is usually there just off camera to make sure the interviewee stays on message. My other point is that I think you would rather I got these interviews and the story they want to tell, rather than annoying them and getting no official input? You can then discuss the merits of that message and your doubts here as normal with no restrictions. We then test the products as we do to see if they meet the suggested standards of performance and we do not shy away from being honest and open with our findings. Obviously, we have channels we can use to feedback concerns and suggestions to that are not public and we are always keen to work with companies to make sure they introduce changes that benefit our members. That isn't always public. I hope that explains our balanced position.
       
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    21. encaser

      encaser
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      The perfect example appeared to be your saying, "I'm not being horrible"... about the remotes and Gavin's oh look what I have here. I particularly liked his keenness and saying how pleased he was you liked it; when in fact you remained neutral, supposedly as not having had the chance to actually try it.
      These events appear to be like having a teen child who's just brought an art project home and God forbid you make your own judgement.
       
    22. Matson

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      I do understand where Phil is coming from. Its better to get some information than no information and yes if you start asking them the tough questions the chances are they won't respond or answer them correctly anyway. It would most likely be no answer or a marketing answer. I also agree with Encaser above aswell you can also feel like these reps put on a fake smile the second you ask them any remotely challenging question or if your not lavishing praise. At the end of the day there grown adults and should know that both praise and criticism is part of an interesting and good interview. CES is pretty much a marketing show but at the same time its one of the few times you actually get the chance to ask them these questions. Either that or id just make a terrible reporter who would get banned from speaking with any of these companies :rotfl:
       
    23. Goldorak

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      I have been looking closely at the XG95 and it seems to be close to the XF9 than to an xe93 or ZF9...the contrast in particular is rated to a similar X6 to xf9
      I hope they didn't just take the XF9 and added the ultimate processor and better Soc (wide angle for big sizes only) plus a new remote...and 4 full fat hdmi 2.0b

      That would be a very bizarre/disappointing plus lazy move...

      I was hoping it was closer to ZF9 and XE93...will see but not looking promising so far...
       
    24. encaser

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      Your probably 3 or so months premature on making any conclusion. And who wants to be premature?!
       
    25. Goldorak

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      Too early for conclusions...I am hoping to be wrong. I just reflected on initial numbers...
      I agree with you, too early indeed but I am a bit worried
       
    26. desinho

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      Pretty strange, I was sure I saw it had a x10 rating but I now read 'six times' indeed. EDit: that Chinese leak had a x10 rating for the 'X9G' :rolleyes: so incorrect info again in that table.

      CNET's David Katzmaier (seems pretty tall, must be 6'3 or taller)

      12-sony-master-series-z9g-lcd-98-inches.jpg

      03-sony-master-series-z9g-lcd-98-inches.jpg
       
    27. woppy101

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      All I see in those pictures is the strange reflections and the rainbow effect from the xwide layer
       
    28. encaser

      encaser
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      Which could all in fact be from camera flashes and heavy lighting.
       
    29. woppy101

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      Having had a go of a 75ZF9 for a few days I can assure you it will be the x-wide layer that’s giving those funky pictures, I said a few pages back if you have a south facing room this tv and any tv with the x-wide layer will be useless unless you have a way to make the room totally dark, which totally defeats the object of these TVs being for bright room conditions.
       
    30. Goldorak

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      Latest video from Vincent stating that xg95 has much improved Black bars and dimming. It seems to have performed better than zf9 and Q9fn!!!
      Subject to more reviews, this seems super promising...finger crossed
       

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