CES 2018 News: Dolby Vision gains momentum despite HDR10+

[Steve Withers]

Dolby Vision has gained significant momentum against the competing HDR10+ format, with extensive manufacturer and studio support, so we ask them what are the other areas into which they can expand.
Watch the video.

 

[Roohster]

Broken link Steve, this is what I saw when I clicked:

...and back on topic, I reckon the first tv manufacturer to announce DV and HDR10+ will be onto a winner.

 

[mark800]

 

[linnasak]

Any update on implementation in projectors, don’t want to invest now in 4K projector and it be implemented 6 months later in next range.

Kevin

 

[psikey]

The "Dolby" name carries a lot of weight even with everyday consumers which is one of the reasons for its success.

I just bought my first 4K HDR OLED TV and made sure it supported DV. Didn't even know about DHR10+ until reading on here (I'm not a TV Tech nerd). I suspect Samsung will have to add DV or they will have issues selling TV's eventually unless all content starts to come with DV & HDR10+ support (both physical & streamed).

Its also a biggie "Netflix" supporting DV for everyday consumers.

 

[Bittern]

If you plan to play a drinking game while watching this don't choose the word CONTENT lol

Good stuff Steve, Thanks

 

[vulgartrendkill]

I was under the impression that Hybrid Log Gamma was the way to go for live broadcasts? How would one go about getting the metadata through the airwaves (or even broadcasters to adapt their streams to accommodate). Having said that I really welcome the advancement of HDR.

 

[Toon Army]

Thanks Steve for getting another good interview. Sports broadcasts in DV sounds very interesting.

 

[zubeir]

The "Dolby" name carries a lot of weight even with everyday consumers which is one of the reasons for its success.

I just bought my first 4K HDR OLED TV and made sure it supported DV. Didn't even know about DHR10+ until reading on here (I'm not a TV Tech nerd). I suspect Samsung will have to add DV or they will have issues selling TV's eventually unless all content starts to come with DV & HDR10+ support (both physical & streamed).

Its also a biggie "Netflix" supporting DV for everyday consumers.

Yes the Dolby name has a lot of credibility, just like DTS for sound. So Dolby Vision adoption ramped up quite quickly with TV manufacturers, Chromecast, Apple TV etc.
The Dolby Vision option seems more clear cut for the consumer, HDR, HDR10+ naming adds to the confusion and is not as catchy Samsung love their naming convention, Super, Super Super, Super + +. So watch this space and wait for Super HDR10 + next in 2019.
We shall see who wins the format war

 

[Norman]

Its also a biggie "Netflix" supporting DV for everyday consumers.

I totally agree, if there are two names that everyday consumers recognise its Netflix and Apple. I think HDR10+ is going to have a hard time gaining traction.

 

[hodg100]

Broken link Steve, this is what I saw when I clicked:


...and back on topic, I reckon the first tv manufacturer to announce DV and HDR10+ will be onto a winner.

Fixed now, thanks.

 

[next010]

There is a big gap in gaming for Dolby.

The smart thing to do would be to partner with the two industry leaders which are Sony in console space and Nvidia in the PC space.

Give them a cut price or free license to DV, then spend money on getting as many titles ported over to DV as possible. Position itself as the premium HDR solution for gaming something that just works by connecting up to a DV display minimal to no config required unlike the messy HDR10 format.

 

[SunnyIntervals]

Battlefield 1 on PC supports DV, but I guess only DV compatible hardware and screens can display it.

 

[LicensedTaximan]

Good interview but why with almost every reply to Steve's questions does Mr Auld begin with the word... so... what gives it's quite common now but what's the point. It's just as bad as a large proportion of the younger generation now pronouncing the letter "H" as hatech. Is this how they are taught to pronounce the word at school now, or is it just me from the older days?

 

[Stinger69]

Good interview but why with almost every reply to Steve's questions does Mr Auld begin with the word... so... what gives it's quite common now but what's the point. It's just as bad as a large proportion of the younger generation now pronouncing the letter "H" as hatech. Is this how they are taught to pronounce the word at school now, or is it just me from the older days?

Got to agree with you there! I think saying "so" gives their brain a bit of time to get into gear and decide what's going to be said. It's made even more annoying if it's combined with "up speak" where the tone rises towards the end, like it's a question. As for the aitch pronunciation, it's wrong but in very common use. As we all know, that means it will become an accepted variation. Oh well.

Andy

 

[LGFan]

I just wonder what extensive support we saw in 2017 from manufacturer delivering DV ?

Oppo, LG?

Did any other television get support in 2017? Did we find other players than Oppo to actually work with the media out?
Except Apple TV supporting it for their own app store products, i feel a huge cloud in front of me, or i fail to miss all the great products using it today
LG failed to deliver this for their own UHD player. Others do not want to support it.

I hope 2018 will be better and old televisions will support a wider range of HDR formats even if not working today.

 

[Roohster]

The guy presenting was awful... if you're going to be a company spokesperson, you need to be able to speak without resorting to cliches and hideous marketing language... "leveraging", "driving" etc.

Oh, and that annoying thing where every sentence ends on an upward inflection, making everything sound like a question.

I almost stopped the video after a minute of watching, he annoyed me so much Wanted to know more though so I stuck with it.

He said a lot without saying much.

 

[psikey]

c

Battlefield 1 on PC supports DV, but I guess only DV compatible hardware and screens can display it.

So does Mass Effect Andromeda on PC but I've not tried moving my gaming PC downstairs to try it yet. Its only got a single GTX 980Ti so only likely get 30fps with Ultra at 4K. PS4 Pro with Uncharted4/Zero Dawn looks amazing with HDR on the LG.

Still think I will keep my Gaming PC hooked up to my 27" ASUS ROG Swift 165kHz G-Sync IPS 1440p as its the sweet spot for my GTX980Ti and not wanting to upgrade until replacement for 1080Ti comes out. G-sync & high fps is supper smooth gaming.

 

[domtheone]

Good interview but why with almost every reply to Steve's questions does Mr Auld begin with the word... so...

It's not half as annoying as Christian Horner answering (or he used to) every question with.... No Yes.

 

[LicensedTaximan]

At least it's not just me then on inflections and pronounciations. Oh and by the way Stinger69 your spelling of "H" aitch (my hatech) is much better.... so.... there you are then.

 

[Steve Withers]

Any update on implementation in projectors, don’t want to invest now in 4K projector and it be implemented 6 months later in next range.

Kevin

We did ask Dolby if they plan to add Vision to projectors but they said they had no plans at the moment, which is a shame. Projectors would definitely benefit from dynamic metadata.

 

[edd handforth]

Jeez Give the guy a brake cut him some slack . IT seems as if most people understood what he was saying . idid and i am 81

 

[Khazul]

The trouble is Samsung will flood the market with junk 'HDR10+' compatible TVs (despite that many

We did ask Dolby if they plan to add Vision to projectors but they said they had no plans at the moment, which is a shame. Projectors would definitely benefit from dynamic metadata.

I do not see the justification for this. Does changing the OLED level stop them from doing it for TVs? No - so what makes projectors such a problem?

 

[Khazul]

I suspect Samsung will have to add DV or they will have issues selling TV's eventually unless all content starts to come with DV & HDR10+ support (both physical & streamed).

No - I think what will happen is that Samsung will start sticking HDR10+ into anything that can possibly justify it include barely HDR capable TVs. A few years down the road they will then claim that HDR10+ is the dominant format in terms of sold devices, despite that the reality will be a massive market share of barely HDR capable TVs (global dimming maybe, marginal WCG). The reality will probably be that their market share of truly HDR capable TVs is nothing to write home about, but none the less, they will use that to force the hand of content makers who still seem to stalling an dithering at the moment.

Meanwhile - people who actually care about the picture (typically those who consciously bought DV capable gear and services end to end) will get completely shafted for the next decade due to prolonged period of uncertainty on the part of content makers and BD player makers.

At this time the way I see it, the only thing that can save DV is probably the intervention of North Korea.

Its the way these things go - whatever gets peddled to the ignorant/oblivious masses tends to win - ie what Samsung seem to be best at. VHS didn't win on merit...

 

[Winnie1221]

Great interview Steve....

I have an LG UP970 and a LG OLED B6, both with Dolby Vision and they work perfectly and looks fantastic. I am really impressed with DV, i'm no expert but the difference over HDR10 is quite significant. There is plenty of DV support on Netflix too, which is great, but i'd love to see more UHD 4k Discs with DV. The ones I have look sublime and the everyone who I have shown DV content too (who own 4k HDR TV's) are all equally impressed with it.

I'd love to see Dolby Vision on PS4 games also. As someone mentioned earlier, Uncharted 4 and Horizon Zero Dawn look amazing in HDR on the PS4 Pro, to think they could look better with DV is an exciting prospect........

 

[SCOLANATOR]

c


So does Mass Effect Andromeda on PC but I've not tried moving my gaming PC downstairs to try it yet. Its only got a single GTX 980Ti so only likely get 30fps with Ultra at 4K. PS4 Pro with Uncharted4/Zero Dawn looks amazing with HDR on the LG.

Still think I will keep my Gaming PC hooked up to my 27" ASUS ROG Swift 165kHz G-Sync IPS 1440p as its the sweet spot for my GTX980Ti and not wanting to upgrade until replacement for 1080Ti comes out. G-sync & high fps is supper smooth gaming.

PG279Q?

I have mine paired with a GTX 1080, could never go back to 60Hz non Gsync now.

 

[tman]

It's a little early for that headline - HDR10+ isn't really readily available yet. Also, it's in Dolby's interests for DV to be a success - they're getting paid a lot of license fees for it, but, with HDR already 'everywhere' it wouldn't take much for HDR10+ to build on that once all the studios come onboard and hardware starts appearing. Not having to pay Dolby fees on every DV device sold could be of great interest to AV companies.
Technically, there isn't much between DV and HDR10+ for the average viewer, and it would be perfectly acceptable to 99% of buyers - if they actually care!

 

[ash23t]

HDR10+ is free unlike Dolby Vision, but requires that you join the HDR10+ Alliance and share with other members, and companies like Sony don't want to share. Throw in any special discounted licensing deals that Dolby may be offering and that is my guess as to why HDR10+ hasn't been embraced universally.

Otherwise I would have expected Dolby Vision to have lost.

 

[dave1956a]

While the Dolby rep thinks DV will be a winner he should remember Dolby do fail sometimes

Who remembers the Dolby system for FM radio (it failed)

Dolby FM - why?! - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

and Dolby S NR on domestic tape decks (digital recording saw that off)

Having said that as for HDR10 + that reminds me of DNR the noise reduction system in the early 70's lots of praise for that (it was supposed to work on all tapes unlike Dolby B) it never took off though

 

[BAMozzy]

Of course Dolby Vision has gained momentum. In 2016 it was just on LG OLEDs (as far as I remember) and via Netflix. In 2017 its spread to Sony (whether the Patch has actually arrived or not its still coming to TV's with X1 Xtreme Processor) and we have seen the first DV enabled Bluray players and discs arrive too. No doubt we will see more in 2018 too.

HDR10+ maybe late to the party but as Samsung TV sales 'tend' to account for 50% of all TV's bought, it therefore shouldn't take long to catch up and overtake DV in terms of user base. It could catch up with Dolby Vision too in terms of quantity as well because of the open-source nature of that format.

However, that still shouldn't affect the progress that Dolby Vision is showing. Chances are that more of Sony and LG ranges will contain DV as well as other manufacturers, like Panasonic will add DV to its Bluray Player range even if they are backing HDR10+ on their displays. It obviously has a number of big studio's affiliated to it so its logical to think that the content should continue to grow too.

Even if HDR10+ does catch up and overtake Dolby Vision in terms of user base and/or content, it really doesn't matter as TV's continue to improve as well as companies like LG offering a mode that analyses the picture and adjusts its tone-mapping - basically a pseudo HDR10+. The bigger the colour volume of a TV, the less 'need' for Dynamic Metadata. If we do get 10000nit TV's, at least Dolby Vision would still offer an advantage - even if the Dynamic metadata has no impact - and that is the Bit depth. It could still have an advantage of improving the content over HDR10 and HDR10+. At that point, Dolby Vision becomes much more significant. It won't matter if your TV has HDR10+ or not as it should look the same as HDR10 but Dolby will still offer an enhancement.