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CD transport?

Discussion in 'Hi-Fi Stereo Systems & Separates' started by superfly666, Aug 15, 2004.

  1. superfly666

    superfly666
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    Hello all, I've recently picked up a Trichord pulsar series 1 DAC, and am currently in search for a new transport for around £200.

    I would quite fancy dipping my foot into the SACD market, and the SONY SCD-XB790 seems to fit the bill. But I heard its rubbish at cd playback. But i'm guessing thats only because sony use a lower grade dac inside it. My question is that is it a decent cd transport? Also any other player i should look at? I need the have coaxial output.

    Cheers.
     
  2. Knightshade

    Knightshade
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    Hi Superfly
    You won't find a decent DVD player that will play cd's unless it's dual mechanism. This is down to several things. CD's and SACD's are clocked differently therefore playback of CD's will be compromised on a SACD capable player. Even adding an external DAC will not solve this. As an experiment I hooked up a Chord DAC 64 to a very cheap DVD player. Playing DVD- A's and SACD's it was pretty much the (audio) equal of anything on the market. CD playback was however, awfull, the sound was very flat and lifeless.
    If you like CD's and you want them to sound good this probably isn't the way to go.
     
  3. Alex47

    Alex47
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    hi Knightshade,
    it looks like you might have at least tried your Exposure CDP as transport with your DAC. What is your opinion on it? I have been using Exposure 2010 with MF TriVista 21 DAC and planned to swap it for some multi-format player. But your words about different clocking make sense to me.
    Also - have you tried Bryston vs Exposure 3010 combination with your OB1? I am using Bryston pre/power with ATC 35 and thinking about going back to Exposure.
    I would be very grateful for your feedback. Thanks.
     
  4. CJROSS

    CJROSS
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    Alex

    I think one of the bets things ever to happen to DACs and a lot of hype that surrounds them is Musical Fidelitys Trivista DACs, stop for a moment and consider the connection this wonderful sounding DAC uses :

    1 RCA SPDIF
    1 Toslink Optical

    No fancy buffering or clock linked synching, just standard connections (jitter laden though that old audiophile fave) and a nice reclocking circuit. Yet still the concern of jitter, if MF had that base covered the back of that DAC would feature some audiophile tweakable connections. Out of interest, I recently tried some transport vibes of my own.

    £500 Pioneer 717 on an £500 Ash Design Rack > £60 VDH The Source 1m Coaxial > DAC 20
    Sony DVP S355 (£90) on TV stand > £8 Maplins DIY 10m 75ohm coaxial IC > DAC 20

    Not one area of difference to these ears, the DAC copes with what its sent or it does not, IME I have not encountered DACs that are effected by jitter.
     
  5. Alex47

    Alex47
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    Hi CJROSS,

    I have tried 3 different digital cables with my TriVista - Cambidge Audio from Richer Sounds ( about £10), QED for £35 and LAT for £80. To my earsd they all sounded deferently with LAT being the best. So if digital cables do affect the TriVista DAC sound, then different transports should cause even bigger diferences, shouldn't they?
     
  6. Alex47

    Alex47
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    My God, I managed to spell "different" in three "different" ways...
     
  7. Knightshade

    Knightshade
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    Hi Alex,
    Strangely enough my OB1's are now rigged up to my 3010 system with an external DAC. System is 3010 int and 2 Power amps passive tri wire. Blows almost everything away. With a good DAC such as your music fidelity (I don't know how this compares to the DAC64 but I've heard good things about it) you will be hard pressed to get anything to come close sub 5K. A good DAC should make up for all the short comings of your CD transport. Try finding the cheapest CD you can find with an optical out and connect your DAC to it. You'll cry. I did!
    I've listened to the Bryston BP25 pre and (and 4 I can't remember the power amps) when I was looking for something for my main system. I found overall I wasn't warming to them, nice and warm with a smooth midrange and OK bass extension the treble was nice, they rendered female vocals very well. Overall not quite as good and definatly lacking the slam of the exposure Classics. I thought for the money the exposures were the better all round amp. As the exposures worked out cheaper and were the easy equal of everything else I listened to the Brystons at there higher price didn't get a look in really.
    Exposure 3010 make lovely amps, TRI AMP and they really take some beating. Matched with the OB1's the speakers disapear and the sound stage just gets bigger. And of course you get the Exposure sound.
    Very surprised by the mediochre reviews. I wonder who at exposure upset the magazines?
    I really like this system. It's overkill for my room size but it's just to nice to change.
     
  8. CJROSS

    CJROSS
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    Alex have you ever heard those differences between those cables under blind conditions ? Ie would you be able to identify them blind ? I have tried dude and cant TBH. Once I ruled out my eyes of listening to cables, my vibes on the differences they make changed dramatically.

    I even had a £6 Digital Coaxial IC in my system over the weekend :

    http://forum.hifichoice.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=11909

    no difference to the £60 VDH in DAC terms to these ears. I am very sceptical about cables (ICs) and what they can do in my system bro.

    YMMV & ATB Dude
     
  9. Alex47

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    Yes, I know what you mean, once you've got hooked on this exposure sound, everything else sounds a bit bland and boring. I've had Exposure for 10 years. I found Bryston's transparency and mid/high detail clearly superior though. But I never heard 3010.
     
  10. Knightshade

    Knightshade
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    Quite possibly right on the mid high detail when comparing to the 3010's. Maybe they just weren't a good match for the CD12? They weren't a match for the classics in any department. Unfortunatly I wasn't able to compare them to the 3010s.
    If you live in South West your welcome to have a listen.

    CJ, your so right....... The DAC side is good!:laugh:
     
  11. Alex47

    Alex47
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    JCROSS -

    I do not believe in blind testing TBH. I know there is some psyco accoustics involved, but in my case it always works against a new or more expensive cable (being extremely stingy, I always try to convince myself that a cheaper cable sounds the same). Still in some cases I had to splash out.
    I am too rather sceptical about cables - in most cases you add a tiny bit here, loose a tiny bit there and in half an hour you are not sure about even that, because your ear-brain system makes corrections and takes you back to where you've been before. But there are some instances when a different cable changes the sound more dramatically that even a new DAC (no no no it's not an overstatement!). Try swapping p.e. Nordost Blue Heaven for Cardas Cross - I did and was gob smacked it amounted to a component changing. You might say that it is an exception because Cardas was deliberately made not to sound neutral. But here we are - they can possibly sound very differently.
    Re-clocking is a dark area for me as well. One of my friends owns Chord 64 and he was absolutely convinced that this DAC does not depend on transport as it has a RAM buffer (that's even better than with Trivista) and fully re-clocks the data. Yet when he put a re-clocking device (I think it was Monarchy) between the transport and the DAC and the data was re-clocked twice - the sound clearly changed. A humble layman like me can not explain why it happens, but the guy was a bit depressed needless to say.

    When I was studying hydraulics at the University I had the most honest professor of them all - he started his lesons with a statement: "I will make you learn a lot of long and extremely complicated formulas explaining turbulences, currents etc. But you have to bear in mind - in spite of all these formulas we do not have a clue of how exactly does the water flow down those bloody pipes." I rememer those words each time another engineer says that all cables are the same because it's the law of physics. Ok but it's not what this thread is about.
     
  12. Alex47

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    Thanks Knightshade,
    I live in Richmond, Surrey. It would be great. I have to get permission from my 2 month old baby daughter though, who is not quite flexible, I'm afraid. Work-home-work-home - that's my life a the moment.
     
  13. Knightshade

    Knightshade
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  14. CJROSS

    CJROSS
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    I know of a few people using the DAC 64 KShade, the majority of owners use it as Rob Watts advocates off a Toslink connection, this seems to be the most commonly used connection for the 64, then XLR/AES after that. Actually I mentioned you on another forum ie CD12 transport & CAT5 cables, and a DAC 64 user informed me that is a common combo, the vibe being the CD12 makes a great transport (better than a CD player - which I would agree with after hearing one - not my cup of tea)

    LL&P dude
     

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