Carts up to £500 for Rega RP6: Exact? Dynavector? Ortofon? other?

TheFlash

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Where do I start? I currently use an Audio-Technica AT440ML on my P3. RP6 arrives tomorrow; I am prepared to be patient in choosing the right cartridge for the RP6 rather than transferring the AT or rushing into buying something. I could afford to spend up to £500 if the sound justified the cost...

Initial review of this and other forums suggests:
  • Rega Exact has its fans but I could do better
  • If Dynavector wasn't a brand it would be a cult! Seriously well-regarded cartridges
  • Ortofon 2M Black might have its fans but not universally admired - perhaps too bright for some?

I will of course audition before i buy but any advice would be gratefully appreciated, particularly from people who have settled on or rejected one of the above.

All the best,

Nigel
 
do you have an MC phono stage, or only MM?

for MM a couple of interesting, but different, options are Clearaudio and Audio Note.

i had a clearaudio maestro which was wonderful, detailed but not overbearing. they're about £700 i think, but often available for a lot less as they come as standard on some turntables (the aurum beta is < £500 but i've never heard one). the Audio Note IQ2 is around £500 and is a modified goldring. very good cart.

also look at Goldring, Sumiko, Benz (if you can find an Ace SH at the right price)

if you have MC, then Benz, Ortofon, Dynavector are a good call,
 
I have a Zyx R-100H (H = high output MC) on my Gyro which I like a great deal. It was about £750 RRP from memory but I got a good discount on it when I bought the deck at the same time. They do an R-50 around the £500 price point - worth haggling! :smashin:
 
My earlier post seems to have disappeared....

... confirming I have both MC and MM via my internal phono stage on Arcam A85.

(Ambo, your set-up feels like my sort of treat for the eyes and ears. I'd love a Michell Gyro but am space constrained; I have just swapped out my CD92 for a CD23T; I have the Sony BDP-S790 with wi-fi connectivity for iPlayer on a proper screen (still can't work out how the quality is so damned good) which is a seriously good piece of kit at a ridiculously cheap price. I'm not quite as well set up for AV as you but my Proacs are a cracking stereo sound experience on movies.

Hey, wait a minute, I've just hijacked my own thread!).
 
Hi Flash,

If you don't mind me asking, what would you like to change? The AT has very good rep for tracking and it is very highly regarded overall. My knowledge of carts isn't fully formed yet so I'm really just interested in your opinions.

Thanks,
Simon
 
i was in the same quandry - choices choices choices

In the end I went for the Exact and tbh I am very impressed with it - the cartridge is only one piece of the jigsaw

If I could turn back the clock then I would get a Dynavector 10x5, it is my next upgrade.

I have just added a GrooveTracer subplatter - crikey, the noise floor has just disappeared and the surface noise has all but gone!
 
Regarding the Dynavector you will need a shim for the Rega Arm, also you will have to have the lid up when playing records.

Also if you already have you TT, how will you audition a new cart?
 
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Regarding the Dynavector you will need a shim for the Rega Arm, also you will have to have the lid up when playing records.

Also if you already have you TT, how will you audition a new cart?

With difficulty... I have a highly regarded local Rega dealer who will let me audition various carts and probably on an RP6 but not of course on my set-up, so I'll have to mentally log the differences and recalibrate to my own. Best I can do I believe but all other suggestions welcome.

Re shim, thanks for the tip. I won't use the Rega lid (I don't on my P3) as my kit is installed in a 1940s (I think) HMV cabinet with a mahogany lid which gives me room to spare. (Note to self - must post a photo).
 
ok good luck - the RP6 is a fantastic deck for the money - well happy with mine!
 
... confirming I have both MC and MM via my internal phono stage on Arcam A85.
Although the A85's phono option offers both MM and MC (I believe it's the same board as in my AV9), I consider the MC stage to be serviceable, not really the sort of phono stage you'd couple with a £500 cartridge. At the same time, I would suggest that a good MC cartridge with a good step-up transformer is able to climb greater heights than an MM or high level MC cartridge can achieve, but of course, there's aso a budget consideration.

At the same time, whilst MM cartridges are normed making connectivity easy, MC tends to be all over the place, meaning that the cartridge and phono stage combination needs to be considered together. I'd therefore suggest looking into the pair, although of course you could always upgrade in two stages if you should fall in love with something above your budget.

I've always been partial to Dynavector, Goldring and Ortofon.
 
if you can stretch the budget a little ESCO do a marvellous exchange deal on the Benz Wood cartridge. it's £576 with an exchange (£995 normally i think, it's still running as far as i know)

fantastic cart, that is probably better than your stage, but will last for some time so you can upgrade along the way :)
 
Although the A85's phono option offers both MM and MC (I believe it's the same board as in my AV9), I consider the MC stage to be serviceable, not really the sort of phono stage you'd couple with a £500 cartridge. At the same time, I would suggest that a good MC cartridge with a good step-up transformer is able to climb greater heights than an MM or high level MC cartridge can achieve, but of course, there's aso a budget consideration...

I knew it was a mistake to ask for advice on the forum...;) I upgrade my turntable and add in an external PSU, and before I know it I'm looking at stretching to a cartridge here and adding an external phono stage there. Does anyone do marriage guidance?

The internal Arcam MM/MC phono stage costs around £200. If I move up, eventually, from A85/P85 to A38/P38 I'm likely to have to spend this as most pre-owned amps don't have it fitted (I rarely buy brand spanking new). Do I take it the same money on a Rega Fono stage would be far better spent? And don't be tempted to ask whether I can stretch...

Overseas from tomorrow for a couple of weeks so I may go quiet...

Nigel
 
Hi Flash,

If you don't mind me asking, what would you like to change? The AT has very good rep for tracking and it is very highly regarded overall. My knowledge of carts isn't fully formed yet so I'm really just interested in your opinions.

Thanks,
Simon

I'm actually pleased with the sound of my P3 as is! But I go through cycles of around 10 years or so where I start exploring the next step up to see whether it justifies the investment. I'm also looking to shift the balance of my sources; despite having invested in a superb CD23T, I'm moving the underplayed 80% of my CD collection to a NAS - lossless format naturally - for decent but occasional playback. The core 20% will remain on CD. And I'm rekindling my love of the sound, and if I'm honest the ceremony, of vinyl.

The RP6 comes with TTPSU so I get a turntable upgrade and external PSU in one step. I was thinking of getting a new cart for the new deck, but I could transfer my Audio Technica across - and may well now do so in order to tune in to what the new deck/PSU brings in its own right. Then upgrade cart... Then bring in the external phono stage.

Will keep you posted.
 
Although the A85's phono option offers both MM and MC (I believe it's the same board as in my AV9), I consider the MC stage to be serviceable, not really the sort of phono stage you'd couple with a £500 cartridge.
....

Update: confirmed my RP6 supplier is able to let me audition the Exact (as a benchmark) vs the Dynavector 10x5. If I didn't need to draw the line somewhere I'd probably also see if I could audition the Origin Live Aladdin though that would most likely start to show up weaknesses elsewhere in the chain...

Mark: do you (and others) consider the Rega Fono MM MkII also "serviceable" or would that be a step up from the Arcam internal phono stage? I'm both physically space limited and in danger of having to explain to my wife why the hi-fi costs more than the kitchen...

I could audition the Fono at same time as cartridges but may defer for a bit, attune my ear to the RP6 and internal Arcam stage, and then get a nice surprise when I take the external phono plunge.

The trouble with this analogue lark is that, compared with a CD player which is basically an all-in-one box, you can break down what might at first be "a turntable" (what I have today) into all its various components and then break down those components into sub-components... ad infinitum, apparently, and at galactic costs if you get carried away. So turntable+default cartridge becomes turntable plus non-standard cartridge but then you add in a separate PSU. And a phono stage. And maybe a sub-platter. Perhaps a new arm... (and a leg?). And that's just the source, never mind the amplification chain. I feel like I'm on the verge of joining a cult. Perhaps I'll just find myself a nice little Dansette on eBay...

All the best,

Nigel
 
i have just upgraded from Exact to Dynavector 10x5 and very pleased I did - its more open, transparent and less surface noise - well happy
 
do you (and others) consider the Rega Fono MM MkII also "serviceable" or would that be a step up from the Arcam internal phono stage?
The Rega Fono MM MkII is an MM phono amp. My comments on the Arcam concern its usage as an MC phono amp, as I was careful to stress.
The trouble with this analogue lark is that, compared with a CD player which is basically an all-in-one box, you can break down what might at first be "a turntable" (what I have today) into all its various components and then break down those components into sub-components... ad infinitum, apparently, and at galactic costs if you get carried away. So turntable+default cartridge becomes turntable plus non-standard cartridge but then you add in a separate PSU. And a phono stage. And maybe a sub-platter. Perhaps a new arm... (and a leg?). And that's just the source, never mind the amplification chain. I feel like I'm on the verge of joining a cult. Perhaps I'll just find myself a nice little Dansette on eBay...
It's worse than that. After you've spent the equivalent of a small mansion, not just the kitchen, you'll find out that you could have spent a minuscule fraction of the same amount on a quality CD/SACD player and achieved a performance that so thrashes your LP replay that you just won't believe it. Reality withdrawal will set in: after spending all that cash, you 'll just refuse to accept what you know to be true, and you'll continue to listen to music through a bowl of rice crispies whilst trying to persuade everybody else how bad (SA)CD is and how wonderful LP is. (Now watch the flaming this paragraph provokes from the LP afficionados here).

[I treat my 1500 LPs as a legacy collection - meaning I stopped investing in upgrading LP replay kit by buying the next £nK tweak, paying only maintainenance costs, and no longer buy any LPs. I had to learn the hard way. The CD collection continues to grow beyond the available wall space.]
 
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I'm actually pleased with the sound of my P3 as is! But I go through cycles of around 10 years or so where I start exploring the next step up to see whether it justifies the investment.

Sorry, didn't notice you had an RP6 (maybe should read the thread title next time..) 10 years is long enough for anyone and if the equipment has been used regularly a change may be as good as a rest. I don't really have much to add other than the fact that the 2M Bronze from Ortofon is a nice price and even the Goldring Eroica comes within budget. I don't think you necessarily need an MC phono stage, although a new one certainly has some benefits.
 
It's worse than that. After you've spent the equivalent of a small mansion, not just the kitchen, you'll find out that you could have spent a minuscule fraction of the same amount on a quality CD/SACD player and achieved a performance that so thrashes your LP replay that you just won't believe it. Reality withdrawal will set in: after spending all that cash, you 'll just refuse to accept what you know to be true, and you'll continue to listen to music through a bowl of rice crispies whilst trying to persuade everybody else how bad (SA)CD is and how wonderful LP is. (Now watch the flaming this paragraph provokes from the LP afficionados here).

I would generally agree with that (although I stream my music). decent digital CDs/downloads of whatever resolution can sound fantastic. However, most music today is so horribly compressed on CD but vinyl is to a degree spared the same level of compression and as a result often sounds better.

I spent loads on various 80s & 90s CD remasters years ago and are now tracking down as many original CD pressings as I can as they sound so much better. If a CD has been 'remastered' it usually means it been ruined by needless compression and often re-EQd as well.

If I wasn't so in love with the sheer convenience of streaming music and having all my music at my fingertips I would just dig out my old LPs and continue buying new.
 
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I agree it isn't the medium that is the problem - CD that is - generally everything is so horribly compressed!
As I understand it a CD master & Vinyl Master is cut from the same master.
This is the main reason I went to vinyl - was really getting annoyed with how some music sounded on CD so tried vinyl out and loved it.
To give you an example look here at Daft Punks new album

DR Database

CD has been compressed to hell!

The Vinyl sounds fantastic and a lot people are going over to vinyl because of this.
 
I went for the Dynavector but have a confession - perhaps it was because I was blown away by the quality of the dealer's demo system but I didn't hear the differences I might have expected between the Exact and Dynavector. So why not go with the Exact and save myself a few quid? Well that's my confession - I went with the crowd! I have heard people say they love the Exact and heard people say they prefer the Dynavector, but no-one has come out strongly in favour of the Exact OVER the Dynavector. So I played safe.

The RP6 and Dynavector are now nicely ensconced in my home system and they clearly represent a step up from the P3 and AT440; I can't tell you which bit of the system - turntable, separate PSU or cartridge - accounts for the difference but it's good to hear. The cartridge is also just running in so I expect to hear further improvements. It's tough life, being forced to listen to huge amounts and variety of music hour after hour just to run a new cartridge in... but someone has to do it.:)
 

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