Carrick & Gerrard tonight

DJT75

Distinguished Member
Anyone else looking forward to seeing Carrick & Gerrard together tonight??(albeit a friendly & probably only for 45 mins).

After Gerrard missed THAT game in which King & Lampard played together, everyone was crapping on about how that was the solution & England had to move on withour pairing Gerrard & Lampard & choice just one of them - meaning Lampard.

What people failed to realise that night was had it been Gerrard playing & not Lampard we would've seen Gerrard in full flow & evenyone would've forgotten about Lampard. Don't get me wrong, Lampard's a great player, he scores goals & there's no reason why they can't play together IMO, but people were forgetting who is the best all round midfielder on the planet & the fact that Beckham should be dropped before either of them..

Anyway, hope Gerrard proves me right & I hope Carrick has a blinder cos I think he's good enough to go to these finals as our holding alternative when we require one...
 

thfccambs

Banned
I prefer not to see Gerrard and Lampard in the same starting 11.Too much alike,would rather play Carrick or Parker to sit and let Either Gerrard or Lampard push forward more.

Looking forward to tonight games as a few spurs player in the squad and Darren Bent(huntingdon boy) getting his full debut.:D
 

Opticon

Active Member
I agree, Gerrard is at his best when he has the midfield cover behind him to allow hime to push forwards. And IMO, he is a better midfielder than Lampard when this is the case.
 

2010

Active Member
DJT75 said:
Don't get me wrong, Lampard's a great player, he scores goals & there's no reason why they can't play together IMO, but people were forgetting who is the best all round midfielder on the planet
Best all round midfielder on the planet, that is Lampard isn't it :D
 

fantastic dan

Active Member
Lampard is a fantastic player going forward but i think he lacks a bit of ability going back where as gerrard would run the length of the pitch for you all day.

When Lampard is playing along side Gerrard i feel that Gerrard has to spend too much time covering how far lampard is up the pitch. Lampard is spoiled a bit at Chelsea because he knows he has Makalele behind him the whole time.
 

dc007

Active Member
Play Lampard... or play Gerrard.

Why do they both have to play ?! Play one, if he has a bad game drop him and play the other - keep both on their toes.

Both are brilliant, but too alike. They can't play their natural games together because they both want to run into the same spaces, etc.

It's a tough decision but has to be made. Remember when we had Clemence and Shilton ? Greenwood couldn't seperate them so alternated them in matches. Then Robson came in and chose Shilton, stuck with him. Clemence was consigned to the bench.

If Ericsson was in charge in the 70's we'd have had Shilton or Clemence playing fullback, just to accomodate the pair of them !
 

2010

Active Member
Which is why I think Gerrard should play the more holding role allowing lampard to get forward.
I think the main problem England have regarding the midfield is that Lampard & Gerrard are often not imposing themselves in games because Beckham's passing is bypassing them.

Anyone that says they can't be played together is talking nonsense, you have to play your strongest individuals.
 

mrtbag

Well-known Member
2010 said:
...you have to play your strongest individuals.

No. You have to play your strongest 'Team'. That does not always equate to the best 11 players in the country.
 

Opticon

Active Member
2010 said:
Which is why I think Gerrard should play the more holding role allowing lampard to get forward.
I think the main problem England have regarding the midfield is that Lampard & Gerrard are often not imposing themselves in games because Beckham's passing is bypassing them.

Anyone that says they can't be played together is talking nonsense, you have to play your strongest individuals.

I also disagree, as mrtbag says, you have to play your strongest team, and as big a fan of Gerrard as i am, he simply isn't the best holding midfielder we have. He should play either Gerrard or Lampard, with a holding midfielder such as Carrick, or King in behind them. I would agree with you about Beckham's passing bypassing the midfield though, which is why he shouldn't be playing at all! :)
 

DJT75

Distinguished Member
2010 said:
Which is why I think Gerrard should play the more holding role allowing lampard to get forward.
QUOTE]

Who's better at going forward? In fact who's better on all fronts other than penalty taking? Steven Gerrard, so play him there & either find Lampard a position that suits or don't play him....

This is exactly what I was talking abot at the top of the thread, I'm glad to see Gerrard having a run out tonight without Lampard & hopefully people will realise that Lampard isn't the best attacking option we have.

However, Gerrard could play anywhere on the pitch & still out-shine 95% of the team
 

KevD

Distinguished Member
Lampard and Gerard can play together, there is no doubt. The question is wheather you get the best out of either of them.
Do they hesitate for a second to see if the other is covering them, at there clubs they don't have to do this and is why they are so successful.
As much as like Joe Cole, if a midfielder wa to make way it would be him and the team would play 4-1-3-2 with Carrick or Parker in front of a Gerrard, Lampard, Beckham midfield, relying on the full backs to help out wide. Its not like Cole or Beckham are "wingers", they spend most of there time cutting inside.

But I am happy with the way things if they stay that way :smashin:
 

Sick Boy

Active Member
Gerrard should get the nod over Lampard every time. Lampard is a luxury, and against good teams you need 2 in the middle who can control the game. Lampard just rids the team of Gerrards attacking abilities.

Looking foward to seeing Carrick, but it will prove nothing to SGE. He will play Beckham, Gerrard, Lampard and Cole:suicide: in the middle. And they will all want to play in the centre midfield role. And he will let them. Cant wait for him to leave.

Anyone else think Joe Cole should be a sub all the time? A player to change the game only. Pointless being on the left if you ask me.
 

2010

Active Member
Lampard scored 3 goals in 4 games during Euro '04, thats hardly a luxury.
I do agree that J Cole can make an impact as a sub but he has acquited himself well down the left, although I always liked the idea of A. Cole & Bridge overlapping eachother on the left but that was never really given a chance.
 

SILVERBACK

Active Member
im just glad the england squad has such strength in depth in that position that where even able to have the arguement of who should play between these 2 great player s :) gerrard would get the nod imho :rotfl:
 

la gran siete

Distinguished Member
Tough call between those two buty fopr me Gerard edges it defensively as he covers so much of the pitch and tackles better and Lampard is slightly better offensively - his goal tally this season proves it.More interested in seeing how Carrick fares in the holding position. I hope he proves the answer to that role.

Uruguay are a tough team to beat as they are so defensive so I expect it to be close result. England by 1
 

scrapbook

Distinguished Member
la gran siete said:
More interested in seeing how Carrick fares in the holding position. I hope he proves the answer to that role.

If he does prove to be the answer tonight it will be a different Carrick then the one I see play at White Hart Lane!

Surely the key attribute to play in the holding role is being able to tackle....funnily enough that is his weakest part of his game. He can sit there and spray balls around reasonbly well, but a defensive midfielder he aint! If the opposition sits back and defends he will look a good player..if they bomb forward and put us under pressure he probably won't look that great.

I'm not sure what the answer is to Englands midfield combination problems if they play 4-4-2. We seem better suited to 4-1-3-2 myself. I don't see how you can not play Gerrard and Lampard. Can you imagine the Brazil manager sitting down thinking how can they can leave their best two midfielders out of the team....I would imagine he will be looking at ways of fitting them in.

Personally I am looking forward to seeing Bent tonight....he could be a real alternative to Owen for me.
 

Gliese 581c

Distinguished Member
Carrick was immense tonight.

Bent for a full 80 mins with not 1 shot at goal ? Boy does sven know how to pick a team :rolleyes: Thats it sven, play rooney from the start in a friendly as we need to know if he's good enough and give Defoe his typical 5 mins at the end.

god help us.
 

KevD

Distinguished Member
scrapbook said:
Surely the key attribute to play in the holding role is being able to tackle....funnily enough that is his weakest part of his game. He can sit there and spray balls around reasonbly well, but a defensive midfielder he aint! If the opposition sits back and defends he will look a good player..if.
I dont believe a Holding midfielder has to be a great tackler. While I agree with you this is a weaker area of his game ther is alot he offers in that position. The way he reads the game means he gets vital interceptions and blocks and prevents the opposition in this way and then either pull out a good foward pass orr just give it off to Cole or one of the other midfielders who will carry it foward.
 

DJT75

Distinguished Member
Sick Boy said:
Anyone else think Joe Cole should be a sub all the time? A player to change the game only. Pointless being on the left if you ask me.

Best player on the park for 90 mins by a mile, he'll start every match on the left ni the world cup, SWP, Crouch, Defoe, will be our alternative impact players.....(after last night I think Defoe will get the nod ahead of Bent).

Rio showed yet again why he should be 4th choice behind Carragher & King, these 2 are probably the safest 2 centre backs in the country & yet rarely get a sniff.....Both played well last night when called upon...
 

Opticon

Active Member
la gran siete said:
Tough call between those two buty fopr me Gerard edges it defensively as he covers so much of the pitch and tackles better and Lampard is slightly better offensively - his goal tally this season proves it.More interested in seeing how Carrick fares in the holding position. I hope he proves the answer to that role.

Uruguay are a tough team to beat as they are so defensive so I expect it to be close result. England by 1

Good prediction on the result! But i still think Gerrard is probably a better player offensively than Lampard, and Lampards goal tally has more to do with the team around him IMO! You only have to compare Chelsea's goals tally overall with Liverpools to see why Lampard gets more goals!

Was great to see Joe Cole finally deliver the kind of performance he's always promised for England, and i think Crouch justified his inclusion in the squad as an impact player.
 

la gran siete

Distinguished Member
Opticon said:
Good prediction on the result! But i still think Gerrard is probably a better player offensively than Lampard, and Lampards goal tally has more to do with the team around him IMO! You only have to compare Chelsea's goals tally overall with Liverpools to see why Lampard gets more goals!

Was great to see Joe Cole finally deliver the kind of performance he's always promised for England, and i think Crouch justified his inclusion in the squad as an impact player.

That would make him a far better player which he clearly isnt . As I say there is very little to choose between the two. I f playing the two i wouild like to see Gerard drop deeper and Lamps playing just behind the front two.
Promising match last night especially with regards to the subs who all played creditably.Carrick did well and will probably make the cut as will King. I knew how Uruguay were going to play because they always adopt the same tactics:boring: :boring: . One chance brilliantly taken and then withdraw into their shells:boring: :boring: trying toi catch England on the break but the lads kept their shape:smashin:
When you see what Crouch is about you begin to recognise his worth. He'll get better. Erikson now has options
 
D

Deleted member 51156

Guest
Gerrard is an outstanding player for liverpool but never seems to do it for england .

I'd pick lampard everytime .

Both carrick and joe cole had excellent games ,in fact joe cole looked unstoppable sometimes.

Still not convinced about crouch though ,no team has ever won the world cup booting the ball up in the air to a big clonking forward .
 

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