Canon 6d mk2 coming soon!

snerkler

Member
It's currently selling for £1480 on Panamoz. I've been waiting to see what this camera was gonna offer and I have to say that I'm very disappointed. I would look at it at £1300, since I have a few Canon lenses already. However, Panamoz are also selling the 5dmk3 for £1575 and even the 5dmk4 for £2300.
For studio work it should be great I'd have thought, but I know you do landscapes too. That being said you won't miss what you've never had ;) :p It will be interesting to see how if fairs against the 5D3, if anyone does a direct comparison for course ;)

I honestly think you'll be impressed with the 6D-II, it's just a difficult decision when you know there's better (in a number of areas) for less money. £1480 should be the UK price imo.
 

snerkler

Member
Just remembered the single card slot :facepalm: Why oh why do manufacturers still make expensive cameras with only one card slot? :confused:
 

Phill104

Active Member
I may be wrong but it sounds as though you think that people are saying that DR is the be all and end all, and that images without DR must be poor, which clearly they're not.

? ;)

You may not, but many do. From a personal point of view, I have never felt lacking with an body I have owned or used, which is quite a few from a number of brands. I just find them different, and I think about my shots in different ways when using those different bodies. In addition, with a lot of my shots being above ISO500 ish the range of DR evens out making almost all models quite close. The differences are so minor that it becomes pointless worrying about it. For me, there are plenty more important things in a camera body than DR.
 

snerkler

Member
You may not, but many do. From a personal point of view, I have never felt lacking with an body I have owned or used, which is quite a few from a number of brands. I just find them different, and I think about my shots in different ways when using those different bodies. In addition, with a lot of my shots being above ISO500 ish the range of DR evens out making almost all models quite close. The differences are so minor that it becomes pointless worrying about it. For me, there are plenty more important things in a camera body than DR.
You're still missing the point imo so we'll just have to leave it there and continue to have differing opinions :smashin:
 

Phill104

Active Member
The comparison between brands with the woman in the black dress, the Canon shot was sharp, the other quite a bit off, and grey when pushed. Seems noise doesn't show so much but pushing screws the colour. Same with some of the othe comparison shots.

One final point, the human eye cannot see 24 stops of DR, the Brain does it by combining multiple "exposures" with changing apertures, much like HDR but faster. 13-14 stops is the accepted amount, and only in the eyes of the healthy and young. Age and health reduces that.
 

Jules

Distinguished Member
So the 6Dii is a 6D with a flippy screen. 2 x product lifecycles (around 8 years) and that's progress at Canon.

It's baffling.

As an 80D, 5D mark iv, and C100 mark II owner, I no longer trust Canon to come out with any single product that excites me... in fact I now only trust them to screw me over.
Trust is everything to a brand, and once lost its very difficult to win it back.

Let me give you some examples...

1) My C100 mark II has been a great tool for my video work, but its well marketed dual pixel auto focus with face detection only works with 3 or 4 cheap zoom lenses. Canon have not updated the firmware for it to work with any other lenses.

2) The 5D Mark IV has the auto focus the C100 should've had (it works with all lenses), but has a deliberately crippled HDMI output (no 4K), a cropped and crippled 4K codec (Motion jpeg) that is all but unusable in the real world, and no flippy screen.

3) The 80D has the flippy screen and the autofocus skills, but being a crop sensor suffers in low light.

So Canon put a flippy screen on the full frame 6Dii, but being Canon had to make sure some area of its performance was crippled, so they screwed up the dynamic range (which is better on the cheaper 80D).

They just don't want you to have what you need at prices that exceed more capable competition.

I've stuck with Canon and built up my lens portfolio and accessories mistakenly believing that they were 'taking the time' to develop the one camera that really competes... but it is blindingly obvious they won't be doing that...they believe in taking your money and kicking you in the shins on the way out.
 

wysinawyg

Active Member
Much more recent entrant but I picked up my 80D on the basis it was an excellent camera - but in large part I was buying into the system with an eye to the 6D II.

I appreciate it has to be less "pro" than the 5D IV to justify the price - but skipping 4K altogether, going back a generation on sensor tech and using the 80D autofocus module... I'm beginning to regret the decision. Especially given the announcement of the A9 and the work Sony are supposed to have have put into ergonomics and usability.

A9 isn't the camera for me (not least because of the price) but I'm looking much more likely to pick up a Sony full frame in the future than I thought I was.
 

tapzilla2k

Distinguished Member
So the 6Dii is a 6D with a flippy screen. 2 x product lifecycles (around 8 years) and that's progress at Canon.

It's baffling.

Not that baffling. As I said before, Canon will wring out everything out of it's fabrication lines and other technology until they decide it's time to move on. The only thing that gets regular upgrades are the digic processors.

As an 80D, 5D mark iv, and C100 mark II owner, I no longer trust Canon to come out with any single product that excites me... in fact I now only trust them to screw me over.
Trust is everything to a brand, and once lost its very difficult to win it back.

Let me give you some examples...

1) My C100 mark II has been a great tool for my video work, but its well marketed dual pixel auto focus with face detection only works with 3 or 4 cheap zoom lenses. Canon have not updated the firmware for it to work with any other lenses.

Most Canon Camera's are capable of a lot more through the digic processors, it's just that they intentionally cripple a camera to reduce functionality. The Magic Lantern peeps have shown what's possible. Though they haven't looked at the C100 MKII. Canon's firmware updates are few and far between. I think the last major update was for the 7D to get more life out of it before they released the 7D MKII.

2) The 5D Mark IV has the auto focus the C100 should've had (it works with all lenses), but has a deliberately crippled HDMI output (no 4K), a cropped and crippled 4K codec (Motion jpeg) that is all but unusable in the real world, and no flippy screen.

Well that's what Canon do, they develop an AF module for the 1D series usually then it works it's way down the range in different configurations. As far as flippy screens go ? You likely won't see them on the Professional Cameras anytime soon, as Canon can't as yet dust seal the camera's properly.

3) The 80D has the flippy screen and the autofocus skills, but being a crop sensor suffers in low light.

It's a trade off, the 80D sounds like it's good for wildlife photography on the AF front (as it was on the 70D). I will upgrade to Full Frame eventually, but I won't be ditching crop sensors. They have certain advantages over FF in some situations.

So Canon put a flippy screen on the full frame 6Dii, but being Canon had to make sure some area of its performance was crippled, so they screwed up the dynamic range (which is better on the cheaper 80D).

That's what most manufacturers do, they cripple features through firmware to encourage people to buy a higher priced model. What the 6D MKII will do is likely drive sales of the 5D3 and 4 for those who've can afford to spend a bit more.

They just don't want you to have what you need at prices that exceed more capable competition.

Well it's partly that and Canon's habit of wringing out as much profit out of it's fabrication processes before they will commit the cash to upgrade them. If they ever do match Sony's sensor performance it will appear in the 1D series first, then the 5D etc. So it's a matter of waiting for Canon to announce investment in their fabrication factories.

I've stuck with Canon and built up my lens portfolio and accessories mistakenly believing that they were 'taking the time' to develop the one camera that really competes... but it is blindingly obvious they won't be doing that...they believe in taking your money and kicking you in the shins on the way out.

Sony do the same on the lens front, they produce great Cameras but they are behind on lenses. Sure they are producing some high end lenses but they simply don't have the depth and range that Nikon and Canon do to compete on a level playing field. Third Party lens makers don't appear too interested in Sony Camera's at the moment as they have to reverse engineer the lens mounts.

Canon has been far more interested in expanding it's other business interests in recent years than the camera side of things. Which is a sensible thing for them to do, given how the Camera market is going. We are back to where we were in the film days, the masses are going for camera phones that offer instant results, while those who are serious about photography will gravitate towards Cameras in DSLR, Mirrorless and for those with the cash Medium Format.

I may go for a Sony FF camera with an adaptor for my EF lenses. I only want FF for the low light performance, I think I'll stick to crop sensors for wildlife however.
 

Jules

Distinguished Member
I think you're better off sticking a Sigma 18-35 f1. 8 Art lense on an 80D than going with either the 6Dii or even 5Div.

It gives the equivalent view and light gathering capability as about a 26-54mm f2. 8 on full frame, and is incredibly sharp.
Its also a hell of a lot cheaper.

An 80D plus Sigma 18-35 is about £1600 new.

A 5Div + 24-70 f2.8 is about £5000 new, and you'd have no flippy screen.

IMO, the 80D is Canons best camera taking price, features and performance into account.
 
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wysinawyg

Active Member
The 18-35 is tempting (and I'd probably try it ahead of Canon full frame at the moment) but too many reports of focusing problems and the 1.6 puts it more like 28/29 mm equiv. and in an ideal world I really want something a bit wider than that. I'm also not sold on 35mm at the long end for walk around / general use though that is less of an issue.
 

snerkler

Member
Struggling to see many positives still. Yes I get it's not a bad camera (we've already discussed this) but it's severely lacking for the market it's entered. Also, I really don't get this guy. He's a wedding tog so why isn't he just shooting with the 5D4 and not risking not having a backup card, no having to focus recompose so much and having a better AF? Seems odd to me. Also, he said he cropped without any loss in IQ, that's a contradictory term in itself ;)
 

CFC1

Member
More real world reviews should be coming out shortly as I believe the camera is finally on sale in a few days, but its not gonna be for me, alas. I've been waiting for this camera for a long time as a replacement for my aging 7d (which is no more)... But I can't believe that Canon has come up with this camera as a replacement after 5 years. It seems like it is already 3 or 4 years out of date.

I'm probably a bit cheap, but for £2000 I expect a lot more for my money. Its a frigging bog standard camera after all (albeit a FF one). Cameras are so overpriced.

As a lifelong Canon user, I'm in the situation now that I have no options at present. The 6d3 isn't gonna cut it for me, the 7d2 is itself aging and doesn't compare to the Nikon d500, the 5d3, whilst still an excellent camera, is 5 years old and the 5d4 is out of my price range.

At the minute I've only got a Fuji X-T1 with 18-55 kit lens and will sit tight with that for a while. It actually won't do me any harm to work with that and adapt my photography accordingly.

I fear that my near 40 year association with Canon is about to end.....
 

snerkler

Member
More real world reviews should be coming out shortly as I believe the camera is finally on sale in a few days, but its not gonna be for me, alas. I've been waiting for this camera for a long time as a replacement for my aging 7d (which is no more)... But I can't believe that Canon has come up with this camera as a replacement after 5 years. It seems like it is already 3 or 4 years out of date.

I'm probably a bit cheap, but for £2000 I expect a lot more for my money. Its a frigging bog standard camera after all (albeit a FF one). Cameras are so overpriced.

As a lifelong Canon user, I'm in the situation now that I have no options at present. The 6d3 isn't gonna cut it for me, the 7d2 is itself aging and doesn't compare to the Nikon d500, the 5d3, whilst still an excellent camera, is 5 years old and the 5d4 is out of my price range.

At the minute I've only got a Fuji X-T1 with 18-55 kit lens and will sit tight with that for a while. It actually won't do me any harm to work with that and adapt my photography accordingly.

I fear that my near 40 year association with Canon is about to end.....
Real world reviews will say that image quality is very good, as we already know it will be. It still won't help me to understand why people are happy to 'settle' and pay over the odds. It's clearly going to sell vey well, and whilst ever Canon can get away with bringing out a sub par camera (for a given price point) yet still sell them by the bucket loads then they'll continue to do so. It kinda irks me tbh. I do wonder if it's easier to 'see' when you're not in Canons ecosystem, or whether the majority of Canon shooters just have more money than sense ;) :p
 

wysinawyg

Active Member
snerkler - in fairness one could wonder the same in reverse for lenses. £1,899 for the 70-200 vs £2,349 and £2,499 for Nikony.

Thing is if they'd stuck £500 on the price but given it 4K and an up to date sensor I'd have been fine with that. I could live with it being expensive for what it is - less so with it just being distinctly mediocre (and expensive for that).
 

Ali Raza

Active Member
Well looking at their cameras released from 2012...it seems they completely ignore the offerings from other brands. This is exactly what Nokia did even after the iPhone completely shifted the market...thry continued to ignore innovation and we all know what happened then. Canon seems to be impressed by Nokia's strategy and we know what's coming soon lol
 

snerkler

Member
snerkler - in fairness one could wonder the same in reverse for lenses. £1,899 for the 70-200 vs £2,349 and £2,499 for Nikony.

Thing is if they'd stuck £500 on the price but given it 4K and an up to date sensor I'd have been fine with that. I could live with it being expensive for what it is - less so with it just being distinctly mediocre (and expensive for that).
The Nikon is 'only' £2199 at Jessops, but yes you're right which is why I wouldn't entertain the new Nikon 70-200mm f2.8. The only difference is though is that the Nikon is allegedly the better lens, whereas with the 6D2 it's below par.

Of course, the biggest issue with the new Nikon 70-200mm is the reversal of the zoom and focus rings, what were Nikon thinking :eek: :facepalm:
 

snerkler

Member
The Tamron 70-200 G2 is half the price .... :nono:

:p
It is, and definitely the smart choice, especially in terms of bang for buck. I'd love to get my hands on one to compare it to my VRII.
 

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